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Group: Witches & Wizards
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From: Through the door, down the corridor, pass the bins and third door on your left. Though watch out for the Venomous Tentacula.
Member No.: 29189
Hello everyone. I'd like to welcome you all to my new society. It has been approved by MODS i promise you.
Here is where we will get a society on the Death eaters and our views on them and our opinons will be discussed and expresed here.
Here are the rules. - (That are generally next to the MODS rules.)
We will be talking in a safe environment. It's for supporters of the Death eaters only! In other words thosse who are willing to discuss the Death eaters traits in a good and calm way. And thosse that are willing to show genuine intrest to the topic. So they'll be no " I hate Bellatrix." etc. It's just our safe views on them. An also quite important. While we acknowledge that Snape was a death eater. Discussion of him will be limited here as to the fact. There is allready S.O.S.S, to discuss Snape. We don't want it dipping it into to much Snape terriotory. All though discussion on him isn't exactly band we are keeping it limited. And we all know politeness. And if you want to join D.A.R.N. Just put a little thing about it in your signature please. Just so we can identify members easier.
So now down to bussiness...
Death Eaters and Voldemort. There the villians of the HP series and i beleive they deserve some credit. For after all no villains no story. So to start off i'll ask 3 questions.
In your opinon.
Which Death Eater do you like the description of. Which one in your eyes seems the most to be feared among the wizarding community. By this i don't mean Voldemort strictly the Death eaters.
If Voldemort had friends which Death Eater/s. Who would he become closer to?
Out of all the Death Eaters crimes which you can remember which one do you think is the worst? And how do you think they can make up for what they did? Or is there no way at all?
Here is an list of all the Death Eaters. If there are more please do tell me.
Hello Seriouslysirius, I am welcoming myself as the very first member. Glad that I was the first to post in here. Didn’t realize that there was no such society exists yet.
Which Death Eater do you like the description of. Which one in your eyes seems the most to be feared among the wizarding community.
Of course none other than Bellatrix. As she is a Black, she has the beauty and glamour, though Azkaban doesn’t suit her. I especially like the heavily lidded eye, and her maniac laugh when torturing her victims.
If Voldemort had friends which Death Eater/s. Who would he become closer to?
None as I believe he will trust no one but himself. But I believe he gave some credits as to keeping guard of one of his horcrux like the cup of Hufflepuff to Bellatrix though I believe that she doesn’t know to what extent the cup is and later with the safeguarding of the Gryffindor Sword.
of all the Death Eaters crimes which you can remember which one do you think is the worst? And how do you think they can make up for what they did? Or is there no way at all?
All I can remember is the Cruciatus curse of Bellatrix torturing Hermione, as it was in the latest book, but wouldn’t say it the worst. As for the following questions I’ll answer them the next time.
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Welcome annesches!! I agree with you on some many points.
So i'll answer my own questions now.
Which Death Eater do you like the description of. Which one in your eyes seems the most to be feared among the wizarding community.
I at first would say Bellatrix as you state annesches the heavily lidded eyes. The darknees about her. She is defiently like an assasian. Sort like a bad version of " Elektra." Thats a film and Elektra is an assasian. But she has a good heart. Not like Bellatrix she kills and tortures for the fun of it. But i suppose there is always Fenir Greyback. Though he isn't an offical death Eater. I mark him one. As he is as evil as any other death eater. Stationing himself next to people to bite them to become a werewolf. It's foul really. As Lupin said. " I even felt pity for him, thinking that he had no control, knowing by then how it felt to transform. But Greyback is not like that." I think it's a horrible thoguht and how somone could be so cruel.
So if anyone disagees with me about the whole Fenrir coudl be calssed as a Death Eater thing please do let me know.
If Voldemort had friends which Death Eater/s. Who would he become closer to?
We are asuming he had friends. Which of course enver happened. Well i would say what you said annesches Bellatrix and her husband. As he trusted them with the cup. So i would say he woulb be more closer to them. As Bellatrix shares the evil connection that Voldemort so has.
of all the Death Eaters crimes which you can remember which one do you think is the worst? And how do you think they can make up for what they did? Or is there no way at all?
I think one of the worst. Was the torture of Frank and Alice Longbottom. It was an act of hatred that drove the poor couple into a sort of state of living death. It ripped the Longbottom family apart. And i beleive that nothing can make up for what they did.
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As I’ve already said, Seriouslysirius, what a fantastic idea for a thread! Personally, being a pacifist, I’m not a supporter of the Death Eaters, neither of the Dark Arts. But on the other hand, I must admit that these are fascinating characters and matters. In the words of Mr. Ollivander:
QUOTE
He Who Must Not Be Named did great things – terrible, yes, but great. (SS/PS 65, UK ed.)
And this basically summaries my opinion of the Dark Arts.
Which Death Eater do you like the description of. Which one in your eyes seems the most to be feared among the wizarding community. Are we talking here about physical description? If so, then Lucius Malfoy and Severus Snape. No, wait, in the reversed order. I know, they are complete opposites in their appearance, but both of them are so much distinguished and I would say very attractive men.
As for the second question, again, I will say Severus, as he is known to be a very powerful wizard and people actually think that he is a Death Eater and thus are afraid of him accordingly.
If Voldemort had friends which Death Eater/s. Who would he become closer to? I agree with annesches that Bellatrix was definitely trusted once by the Dark Lord, but then so was Lucius with another Horcrux – the diary. I think the Dark Lord ever becoming a friend with any of his followers is not a question of loyalty but of equality. And though I’m sure the Dark Lord never sees anyone as his equal, I think Severus can be seen as close to being the Dark Lord's equal as possible; at least in the Dark Lord's eyes. I think the Dark Lord is obsessed with power and knowledge that leads to getting this power. And he perceives Severus as powerful and also possessing great knowledge, thus I can imagine the two of them become close.
Oh, poor Severus actually. He was a Death Eater such a long time ago and hasn’t been one ever since, and still, I’m talking about him in such a context. Really, shame on me.
Of all the Death Eaters crimes which you can remember which one do you think is the worst? I would say all of their crimes are equally evil and despicable. But if I were to choose one, I remember being particularly outraged by their behavior at the Quidditch World Cup. I think it is first such a demonstration of their actions. What was particularly horrible about it was that they performed the deeds on Muggles and only for the pure fun of it.
And how do you think they can make up for what they did? Or is there no way at all? On this point I will be rather radical and say that there is no way at all, in my opinion. Majority of them have already had their chances for redemption, right when the first war ended. But they haven’t learnt anything from their experience and at the very next opportunity joined the Dark Lord again. Thus I think, sad as it is, Azkaban is the only solution.
And just a simple PS: is Peter Pettigrew actually a real Death Eater? I know there is an independent forum on this matter, but still, do we count him in, considering his cowardice? I’m not sure if the Dark Lord would brand him with the mark.
I’m so glad this thread exists as I have the impression that we actually do not learn much about the Death Eaters from the novels, or at least I don’t remember much, so I’m looking forward to learning new things here.
I wish you good luck with the club, Dan, and I’m so much eager for other people’s comments.
Edit: As for counting Fenrir Greyback among the Death Eaters, I'm not quite sure about that, Dan. We know that apart from werewolves there were also various other creatures fighting for the Dark Lord's side, such as Inferi, giants and others. But this fact doesn’t make Death Eaters out of them, so I don’t think Fenrir Greyback can be one either. Though I totally agree with you on the point that he is downright evil.
I think there are certain criteria that distinguish a witch or wizard as a Death Eater. And we can even discuss these as some of our next questions, (which would be much interesting; or even how a person become a Death Eater etc.). I would say that primarily the person must be a witch/wizard and not any other creature. Although the Dark Lord uses other creatures to fight for him, the Death Eaters are a sort of elite into which he wouldn't count any, in his eyes, inferior beings. And second, I think a Death Eater is branded by the Dark Mark. So in other words, I think Fenrir Greyback is not a Death Eater. Which doesn't change anything about him being totally evil. How does that sound?
~Jana
This post has been edited by Potions Mistress: Oct 25 2007, 06:52 PM
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Welcome Potions Mistress.
Now on the matter of Peter Pettigrew.
QUOTE
I’m not sure if the Dark Lord would brand him with the mark.
He is branded with the mark as he used Peters Dark mark, to summon thosse Death eaters in the graveyard. In the Goblet of fire. He is offically a Death Eater but not a very good one. I suppose this in sense is a good think. One less threat for Harry eh.
I to am not fanatic about the Dark arts but like you say there are much things to be learnt about them.
And Fenrir yes he isn't an offical death eater. AI agree with you that he can't offically be counted as one. But i suppose for the purposes of the discussion you can say that he was the closest to being a Death eater than an actual Death eater. If that makes sense. I mean he was more of like a liutenant to the death eaters. So i suppose Fenrir is not going to be on the list. Ahh but if i do remember now he does wear Death eater robes. He just doesn't have the mark.
I look forward to more people joining up. Then we can get into bigger discusions.
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Hi Dan, I see people are queueing up to join you society!
Anyway, I thought it only fair of me to support you with your thread. I have to admit that I agree with Jana. I don't agree with the whole Death Eater way of life, but they are fascinating characters and because of that I will join in the discussion.
Which Death Eater do you like the description of. Which one in your eyes seems the most to be feared among the wizarding community. By this i don't mean Voldemort strictly the Death eaters.
Up until Voldemort disappeared, pressumed to be destroyed, I doubt that any Death Eater was feared or singled out as feared any more than another. But with his return, I expect anyone of them showing their faces on the street would have put the fear of God into the wizarding community and because of this, I'm going to go along with Lucius Malfoy no make that Bellatrix no, maybe who was the big blond one, he seemed pretty intimidating, but..oh, I can't choose!lol!
If Voldemort had friends which Death Eater/s. Who would he become closer to?
I would think probably Lucius. He is quite a cold self centred chap, they could talk about themselves to each other ! Can you imagine the converstaion..."No I'm the most concieted and arrogant"...."NO, I think you'll find it's me"!
Out of all the Death Eaters crimes which you can remember which one do you think is the worst? And how do you think they can make up for what they did? Or is there no way at all?
The most heinous of crimes that sticks out is the torture of the Longbottoms. The fact that the Lestranges allowed them to live after to going through all that is the worst thing. I think they'd have rather died.
The muggle bating at the Quidditch World Cup comes in a close second though.
I expect there is someone out there kind enough to forgive, but with the Lestranges crimes...no remorse, no forgiveness!
QUOTE
I think there are certain criteria that distinguish a witch or wizard as a Death Eater.
Absolutely, one such thing to me would be a degree of subservience in the persons personality. That must be something that Voldemort would easily recognise in his 'recruits'. Someone like Greyback however, would never succumb totally to another master, he'd only hang around to see what was in it for him.
But I digress, That could spark a whole off-topic converstaion and I don't want that to happen. So, ignore me peeps and answer the questions!
Criteria to become a Death Eater: The first and foremost rule must be a pureblood witch/wizard, although the Dark Lord himself is not. They of course should be fascinated in the dark arts and in Lord Voldemort himself. Then they must be of value to Voldemort. Like Pettrigrew, even he seems to be of no value but still Voldemort broke into the Fidelius Charm as he was the secret keeper, then he was also the one that help Voldemort return to his body though reluctantly.
As for Fenrir Greyback, I think that he was not branded the dark mark because he is a werewolf. Voldemort only uses him to command the werewolves to become his allies, because he needed them to fight for him and not against him. Voldemort uses them to terrorized wizards, but he will never let them be part of his death eaters circle.
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This intresting guys. Keep it up. And feel free to ask questions yourselfs.
Criteria to become a Death Eater
Of course first things first. You have to like the dark arts and i suppose admire Voldemort. You have to be pure blood or pretend your pure blood. They have to please Lord Voldemort. They would have to give Voldemort information. For we know from all the books he values that highly. Quite obviously the Dark mark. Which we have now ruled out Fenrir Greyback as he does not have one.
I am always wondering. As you do in gangs. We've all heard of thosse stories out there. Of people being forced to do something to join a gang.
So...
What do we think Voldemort would ask a willing Death Eater to do for an initation?
Be imaginative with that question but don't delve into anything that might upset people.
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Hey Dan!!! great idea, I hope this doesn't mean you wont have any time to post in WAW
As Elaine said, I don't support the death eater's methods at all, but the characters themselves are very interesting.. if not exactly likable
Which Death Eater do you like the description of. Which one in your eyes seems the most to be feared among the wizarding community. I of course love the description of Bellatrix.. She has the insanity.. a huge contrast with the beauty and glamour.. she seems to have no sane reason for doing things, yet she still does them with surprising efficiency and effectiveness. She was feared because of her insane streak.. she didn't need a reason to kill you, and she would certainly enjoy it. She's not a nice person... I detest people that have no reason for doing what they do, and unnecessary violence? nope. So saying she's not nice is a huge understatement.. but she is still a great character- described perfectly! Severus Snape would of course be feared, though in a very different way to Bellatrix. People feared her for her outright cruelty, people feared Severus because they believed he was a traitor.. they believed he had wriggled his way to Dumbledore's right hand, and was slowly but surely killing off those that would oppose Voldemort. Complete gobbledygook, of course, but he was feared. As was Lucius Malfoy. How could I not mention him. He always did strike me as a strange one... was he loyal to Voldemort? or was he only out for himself? He was feared by those who knew what he was capable of.. which i suppose would be mainly death eaters and people that had displeased him. I have no doubt that 'underground', away from day-to-day life, he was extremely feared. Malfoy was powerful, ruthless and completely self obsessed. He was also feared by those who knew that he put the 'corrupt' in Government People who knew what he was doing, but could not act against him, for fear of the entire Ministry tumbling down on them.. yes, he was feared.
If Voldemort had friends which Death Eater/s. Who would he become closer to? Yes.. he didn't have friends did he.. 'friends', suggests those of equal status.. nobody could possibly be equal to Voldemort.. however.. for argument's sake, he would probably spend more time with Bellatrix and Lucius- they were his most trusted death eaters (Severus is arguable, of course) and they would bow down at his feet, offering him praise and the likes, until he got bored of it, and they rushed off with apologetic bows...
QUOTE
"No I'm the most conceited and arrogant"...."NO, I think you'll find it's me"!
hehe, however hilarious that would be... I have a feeling one of them would end up dead if that happened.. and It wouldn't be Voldemort
of all the Death Eaters crimes which you can remember which one do you think is the worst? And how do you think they can make up for what they did? Or is there no way at all? I definitely agree with the Lestranges torturing the Longbottoms being the worst that we know of, though don't forget, I'm sure the death eaters were capable of much worse than JK wrote about. Anyway.. Pain... especially the pain of seeing your loved one tortured alongside you, can be so much more unbearable than death. That is why I think that sometimes the Imperious and Cruciatus curses can be so much worse than the killing curse. As for redemption.. I think It depends on the individual. The Lestranges knew what they were doing was evil, and they did it anyway, more than that, they enjoyed it. That pair were beyond redemption. however.. some people.. who were brainwashed into doing what they did, and if given an alternative would chose to stop.. I think they can redeem themselves. I know ignorance is no excuse, I'm certainly not making excuses for them.. just separating them from the truly evil.
QUOTE
As for Fenrir Greyback, ... Any thoughts?
-A werewolf is like a halfblood.. a creature not of one 'race' but not of another. They are dirty, disgusting creatures. To be destroyed if possible.- These were Voldemort's thoughts. Don't forget, he hated the idea of 'impurity'. Werewolves were a useful ally- and a dangerous enemy, but could never be seen as equals, and certainly not 'worthy' of the dark mark.
Of course, we know that this is a load of rubbish, look at Remus Lupin! One of the nicest characters in the whole series, and still with huge amounts of power and strength!
What do we think Voldemort would ask a willing Death Eater to do for an initiation? Voldemort demanded complete and unconditional loyalty. I think there would probably be two or three parts.. one where the initiate would have do do something to hurt somebody else- whether kill them, torture them, something that would show if they had any compassion or not. Another part would be to do something to themselves. Maybe aim a spell at themselves, or drink a poison, or deadly potion, in the trust that Voldemort would get them out of it.. that could link to the third point- a testing of skills.. they may have to drink a potion- to show loyalty and 'trust' then brew their own antidote (discovering the poison looking at their symptoms) to show skill.. there would be different tests depending on which area the death eater 'specialised' in.. and different levels of difficulty depending on which level the DE would be working at. It would flush out most of those who didn't have the skill, or the loyalty. It would also be a good chance to get rid of those who you didn't want in your service.. you know, give them a poison with no antidote...
*hmhm*.. I wasn't enjoying that.. honestly!! I just got a little carried away with the whole testing thing.. what can I say.. I did a Hermione
OK... I'm guessing the post is probably long enough now
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ah!! Daniel my dear cousin!! i see you went ahead and made the thread. good on you! again.... and well done on the name DARN its so hard to make a name for a thread that actually makes a word!
well i'm not about to say that Death Eaters are great... beacause they are not but wehat story would Harry POtter be without them! there's got to be some characters in a book that you just love to hate and to discuss.
Which Death Eater do you like the description of. Which one in your eyes seems the most to be feared among the wizarding community. By this i don't mean Voldemort strictly the Death eaters. physical apperance - Bella mental effect - Bella she is extremly well... Azkaban sent her mad with rage and a lust for torture and killing...even more so. i have always thought that she was the sacriest and most itimidating... okay remember deathly hallows when hermione is bella ... everyone was ten feet away from her! it's fantastic... erm i mean well basically she has that effect on people.
If Voldemort had friends which Death Eater/s. Who would he become closer to? again i think he trusted Bella the most but i guess he would have trusted Lucius quite a lot too. erm.... lol
Out of all the Death Eaters crimes which you can remember which one do you think is the worst? And how do you think they can make up for what they did? Or is there no way at all? the torture of the Longbottoms!! evil... it was a fate worse than death in my opinion..they were tortured to insanity and Neville had to live with seeing them like that ... i can't imagine any crime done by a death eater that could be forgiven... hmmm i don't think so... i'll think...
hi everyone by the way! lol keeping this short and sweet i'm afraid....cheerio!
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clara - welcome
QUOTE
*hmhm*.. I wasn't enjoying that.. honestly!! I just got a little carried away with the whole testing thing.. what can I say.. I did a Hermione
No no of course you weren't enjoying it Clara. Well the idea of torture and all that. Of course no one would enjoy it. But there intresting to talk aobut. As i've allready said " Know your enemy."
Yoour 3 stage intiation is what i fele is the guide line that i would follow. Voldemort finds all the qualities that he needs in that person. In doing so and if they are... unsatisfactory. He might just eliminate them from the proccedings. So to speak.
I wont forget WAW. No need to worry Clara.
K.Lupin_werewolf Welcome jade
QUOTE
it's fantastic... erm i mean well basically she has that effect on people.
I see your point. Bellatrix not to be respected but to be feared.
I do agree Longbottom's as you say a fate worse than death.
Thank you all for joining. Keep posting and have fun.
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[url=I see your point. Bellatrix not to be respected but to be feared]I see your point. Bellatrix not to be respected but to be feared[/url] yes exactly! lol now why did i not just say that?
basically a lot of people can control us right? now you haven't got to respect them but you fear them because of what they can do or a re capable of e.g like some people at school. they think that they are better than everyone else and they can get what they want from you but you don't respect them...you just don't want them to start spreading rumours about you. it's the same with the death eaters... you do what they want because they can kill your family and well you don't want that... i guess in a sense fear is a fantastic tool of power... it can control very well... lol
i think Bella is a great example of this. she is below respect but above it at the same time as you respect the fact she has power over you and the ability to destroy what you hold dear yet you do not respect who she is in the sense that she is a murderer and a follower of that dark lord... that is what you fear....lol
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Oh, Dan, you are right with Peter Pettigrew. I don’t know what I was thinking forgetting such a thing as his Dark Mark and the graveyard. This only proves that I must go and reread the books again.
Elaine, I love your Voldemort-Lucius dialogue. I can well image the two of them in such a debate. It's really hilarious!
But then, it seems to me, particularly in the last book, that the Dark Lord trusts Severus much, whereas he rather makes fun of the Malfoys. Personally, I think that he sees Lucius lower in the whole Death Eater hierarchy than Severus. In other words, I still think that the Dark Lord might regard Severus closer to himself than any other Death Eater. But so far, I seem to be in a minority with such an opinion.
And back to the criteria for becoming a Death Eater. If that is not much a digression; I hope, I’m not watering down your threat, Dan.
annesches, when you talk about the pure blood as one of the criteria, I don’t think it is the first and foremost thing, as for example Severus is not a pureblood but still is warmly accepted and trusted by the Dark Lord. And, Dan, when you say that you must at least pretend to be a pure blood, does that mean that Severus has been pretending all those years his blood status to the Dark Lord?
As for our next question: What do we think Voldemort would ask a willing Death Eater to do for an initiation? Clara, though you didn’t enjoy writing out the testing part, I think it is a very interesting idea. I have never thought about recruiting the Death Eaters in such a way but I guess you are right. The Dark Lord must have tested his followers’ skills, loyalty and ability to be cruel enough, so to speak.
To be honest, I have never imagined any initiation processes for the prospective Death Eaters. What I rather thought is that the Dark Lord, though rather picky in his approach, might allow anyone into his circle should the person prove to be somehow valuable to him. annesches, you seem to make the same point. I actually wouldn’t think that the Dark Lord was interested in his followers’ skills. Well, if they don’t possess particular knowledge of magic, in his eyes, it is their fault when they get killed carrying out their Master’s orders.
What I see as initiation, is sending a prospective Death Eater on a mission, so to speak. If they succeed they are in, if not well, bad luck, it’s their fault. Something similar to when Severus hears the prophecy and then carries the message back to the Dark Lord. Or when Peter Pettigrew persuades Lily and James to become their Secret Keeper. Something valuable and useful for the Dark Lord himself. I see the initiation not only as a test for tests’ sake but something useful and practical that might help the Dark Lord with his gathering of powers and strengths.
It’s nice to see that the discussion is getting started.
when you talk about the pure blood as one of the criteria, I don’t think it is the first and foremost thing, as for example Severus is not a pureblood but still is warmly accepted and trusted by the Dark Lord. And, Dan, when you say that you must at least pretend to be a pure blood, does that mean that Severus has been pretending all those years his blood status to the Dark Lord?
I think so, because as we know he was pretending more than half his life on being a death eater, and as pretending to be a pureblood is only but natural for Snape, as he is an accomplished occlumens. There was also something mentioned by Harry telling those death eaters about their dark lord being half-blood and yet they seemed not to know or if they did they were too scared of Voldemort or they won’t admit it as they too were against impurity. Blood status is still the most important one, as Voldemort himself is campaigning all the while he is alive. During his speech in the first chapter of deathly hallows about pruning those bad ones and of becoming a laughing stock when they have any relatives that are not purebloods among the death eaters. But still I think Voldemort will grant anyone of real value to him the dark mark.
They also used the dark mark as a way of recognizing each other and as a key or password when they set up barriers where only their lot can enter. This was shown during the hbp,the invisible barrier cast by the death eaters to block the stairs going up the lightning struck tower and also in the front gate of the Malfoy’s manor. The ones branded with the dark mark were let through as if there was no barrier.
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QUOTE
And, Dan, when you say that you must at least pretend to be a pure blood, does that mean that Severus has been pretending all those years his blood status to the Dark Lord?
Yep. Like annesches said. He is good at pretending.
And can i remind everyone not to go to near Severus just in case. We have to remember S.O.S.S, Not a big problem yet though but just thought i'd mention it.
Blood status
It was really one of the main points that formed Deathly Hallows. It's the thing Death Eaters value most highly. I think it's important to go into detail about Blood status because Death Eaters consider it.
I think there may be a few other Death Eaters that are Half Bloods. I know Voldemort is no fool and could detect them out easily with Legimency. (Is that how we say it?) But it's more to the point that how usefu;l a Death Eater is. If they are a valuable servant i think Voldemort would ignore it. Afterall he is a half blood. Yet if they do something wrong he would prehaps use it agansit them before exacting his revenge on them. I honestly think a Death eater is so wrapped up in there pure blood mania. They kid themselves into thinking that they are pure blood.
So everyone delve into Blood Status and your opinons on it. Like i say i think it's an important subject to go over.
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