The way I understand it, the Triwizard cup isn't just some simple magical object that, like a lottery, randomly chooses a name from each school, but rather it weighs the strengths and weaknesses of the entrants and chooses the best person for the job from each school. That is the impression I got from the book anyway.

That said, if the cup is able to pick the student with the best chance of winning from each school, than why does there need to be an age restriction on who can enter?

Operating on the assumption that the GoF chooses the best student for the tournament, let's take a look at the logic of the age limit rule.

If their was no age restriction the GoF would pick the Hogwarts student who stood the best chance of excelling in the tournament. Now, let's say that the student who stood the best chance was 14 years old, and the student who stood the next best chance was 17 years old. Regardless of his age, the 14 year old student is going to do better in the tournament than the 17 year old student would. When the age restriction is imposed the inferior 17 year old student becomes the "best" student for the tournament because the 14 year old is no longer eligible; does this really help to protect students? If there is any task that the 14 year old student (who is the best in the school at magic) couldn't do, chances are the 17 year old student isn't going to be able to perform the task either; if anything, he will fair worse than the 14 year old. Furthermore, there could be tasks that the ineligible 14 year old student could complete, that the 17 year old student will not be able to complete. And if the 17 year old truly is better than the 14 year old, the GoF will choose the 17 year old instead, so their really is no need to prevent the 14 year old from putting his name in the GoF.

Now, chances are the 7th year students will always be better at magic than the underclassmen, but their is sure to be an Albus Dumbledore, Tom Riddle, or Harry Potter in every generation...a student whose aptitude for magic allows him or her to excel beyond his older classmates.

Bottom line, the GoF would only ever pick a younger student over an older student on the grounds that the younger student was better suited for the tournament than the older student; so how does restricting the age limit to 17 protect students? All things considered, it seems the age restriction actually endangers students. By not allowing exceptional younger students to compete in the tournament the lives of their older counterparts are unnecessarily endangered by making them the first pick for a tournament they aren't the best pick for.

The age restriction can never ensure that the best student will be selected, it can only hinder the the best student from being selected.

What do you think?

Good question...

Maybe the Goblet is like the Sorting Hat in the sense that it measures potential. In that case, an eleven year old could have the potential of becoming the next Albus Dumbledore or Tom or Harry, but the kid hasn't learnt enough magic yet...

The goblet cannot distinguish age, so it might choose a kid who hasn't learnt enough to compete, while a less talented older student would have handled the tasks set better.

Also, the tasks have changed since the previous Triwizard Tournaments to prevent deaths. Maybe in the previous tasks, magical ability weighed less than inherent talent - scenarios like Harry encountered as a first and second year (Voldemort and the chamber). No-one in their right mind would make a competition of such dangerous encounters now, and Harry managed to survive because of his spunk and guts, but in previous tournaments people had died, so who knows what freaky tasks they were set.

The Goblet didn't change though, so to counter its way of measuring only potential and guts, they brought in the age line.

In the new tasks, the students faced 'safer' challenges where they weren't in mortal danger, but their magical skill and ability is measured to a greater extent. Harry managed to get through the first two tasks in a rather unorthodox way and with serious help, proving that older students handle such tasks better. Maybe an eleven year old could laso have outflown a dragon and swallowed Gillyweed, but he would definitely not have done well in the maze.

I don't know if that made any sense.

It could possiably have something to do with being of age. They might just let the 17 year olds enter because they are seen as albe to think for themselves because they are of age.

Capricorn, it made prefect sense. But well it may be true that the 14 year old is more talneted then the 17 year old, it doesn't make the 14 year old more mature than the 17 year old. I don't know what the GoF messures, but maybe it reads skill over maturity, or how well you can cope with stress. If the 17 year old is no genius with a wand but still pretty good with it and can keep a cool head, I'd bet on him or her to win over the extraordany 14 year old.
And that's true about the maze. Out flow a dragon, sallow Gillweed, anyone could do that if they were brave enough. And Cedric trully won the Tournament, Harry got throw the first two with a lot of help. And with Moody taking out Fluer and then bewitching Krum...Cedric would of won.

I agree wth amyrat and i would also like to add that the rules are kind of like our laws, they are just guidelines to keep order, you have to draw the line someplace... literally draw the line.... the age line

Yeah i have to agree here with albus dumbledore and amyrat. i think that these tasks are very dangerous and people do die in the tournament. the ministry is just trying to make it clear that these tasks are not to be taken lightly and that they want wizards with some experience and wizards who know what they are geting into. and yeah albus dumbledore they are almost like our laws just a tad bit different.

the part about the ministry wanting to set the guidelines..... thats what hit the spot.... its shows clearly how much the ministry was trying to interfere at Hogwarts and do something right, id have to say alot of the things in HP are products of the politics of the magical community

yeah the ministry is always trying to step in and interfere at hogwarts but are they always doing the right thing. in this case yes with the age restriction but with other things, such as umbridge, no. sometimes the ministry just needs to stay out of hogwarts and dumbledore's way because they never know what they might be getting themselves into. hogwarts to me can be a more powerful place than the ministry.

I personally ally all of my allegiances to DD, he has always been my favorite character, i believe that he is usually right and he agreed witht the age restriction, and so do I.

yes, dumbledore is incredibly intelligent and agrees with the age restriction and so do i in this case but what i'm saying is why does the ministry always have to get into hogwarts affairs when dumbledore has asked them not to or they don't need to. sometimes the ministry drives me a little crazy. they are too uptight sometimes, especially fudge, and they need to loosen up a bit.

i think it frightens them that DD "can" and "will" do what he pleases, he showed them that counless times especially attacking them in his own office, and jinxing Dawlish when they were trying to have him followed.... The ministry doesnt know what to do about the threat of LV so they are desperately clinging to the one that does, DD, but they are approaching it in the wrong manner... and are causing DD to distance himself from them to get his task at hand complete

Yes agree that the ministry is afraid of what dumbledore can do and they fear that. who wouldn't? and yes they are trying to cling to dumbledore for answers but i think he might have gotten a little sick of it. fidge always asking so many questions at once and stuff like that can get annoying. although i don't blame the ministry for "clinging" to dumbledore because i would've to because after all he is the most powerful wizard in the world. at least dumbledore is trying to help them but maybe the ministry just needs to back off maybe just a tad bit so that dumbledore could've gotten things in order.

im going to have to elaborate this and mke it quite wordy because i dont want to be warned for a one liner but i wanted about the last post----- well said, i couldnt have put it better myself

thank you. you are doing quite well yourself. anyway about the age restiction yeah i agree and stuff with all that you have said. great wording. it is hard to talk about dumbledore now because you sorta have to talk past tense. *sigh* i miss dumbledore.

I dont think i will talk about DD in the past tense til the 7th book comes out because i dont just think its stubbornness that i am feeling about his death, its just isnt right and there are so many contextual clues that lead you off in many directions... no The White tomb will Open Again

yeah even though i do talk past tense i don't think dumbldore is dead. until jk absolutley confirms that he is dead he is not. dumbledore planned something and i think that will be revealed in the last book. ok now you've gotten me to stop talking about dumbledore in past tense. thank you. yes!, the white tomb will open again!!

woww this forum has gotten really off topic, lets pull it back if we can so as not to upset teh mods, hehe


Final Verdict: I believe the age restriction was a necessary guideline to ensure the safety of the particpants to the fullest extent. DD thought so, as well the the ministry so i guess we should trust them.

yep. sorry about the offtopic stuff. let's hope they don't get mad. anyway i couldn't agree more. in this case the ministry is trying to help and dumbledore sees that and accepts it as do i.

To break the string of this one-on-one posts, and thank you for agreeing with me, I think that a 17 year old is more likely to understand the risk. But how JK shows the government is her view on it, the Harry Potter books really can be read as potical novels. It reminds me of a quote from Buffy the Vampire Slayer "We're the government baby, it's what we do," to justify themselfs.

Imagine this:


A frightened second year's name flies out of the Goblet Of Fire.

Now imagine this:


That poor second year is standing in the big stadium with a Hungarian Horntail on the other side,while he regrets ever putting his name in that silly Goblet.

Now this:

He is trying to hold his breath as long as possible as he searches for his dear sister underwater.

And:

He is in the middle of the maze,running for his dear life ffrom a 9 foot long Blast-Ended Skrewt.


Not such a pretty site,eh? Now imagine all of that,but with a burly seventh year,who has been in school longer,has more knoledge than the second year,and is much stronng.Thats why there's an age limit

I think the age restriction is completely bogus. I agree that if a fourteen-year-old is better than a seventeen-year-old and there's a task the fourteen-year-old can't do then there is no way that the older one could. Even though I wouldn't enter, an eleven-year-old might be the absolute greatest wizard dead or alive.

The best student out of the whole school should be the contestant for that school.

That's really interesting, I had never thought of that before. I don't think there should have been an age-limit, because it's most likely older students would have been chosen anyways, but there is a chance of a 13 or 14 year old genius. If there was an age-limit, I think it should have been set at a younger age, like 14 or 15. But that would have created a problem in the plot, because it wouldn't have been such a big deal that Harry had gotten entered in the tournament. Harry probably would have entered on his own probably. But, the book was still amazing regardless of the age line!

I think regardless of age if you are the best you are the best age wont change that. But I guess the age restriction was placed there because the tasks that the champions would be facing would have been more suitable for what was taught to the seventh years.

Okay, considering that age doesnt really matter because Harry had faced things and been in situations since beginning at Hogwarts that would curl even most of the seventh years toes. I think that the only reason Harry's name actually came out of the Goblet was
1. He was entered as the only participant from a different school and
2. The Goblet is an extremely magical object that knew what Harry was capable of. Honestly, I don't think that if Crabb or Goyles name was put in there that the Goblet would have chosen them as champion...

That being said, I think the age limit was put into place to protect the likes of a Creevey or someone like that trying to get glory...Ron too for that matter. I would like to have seen Fred or George try though...I think they are very resourceful and would have stood a great chance.

Well, Maybe Because it would like to pick the best person from each school, But they think the age of 17 you really know all of ur spells and all of the magic they can teach you at Hogwarts. That might be why they put the age of 17. I mean, Harry won the Triwizard Tournament, But one of the only reasons is because he has had experience with these types of things. He has fought the Dark Lord. So I mean shouldnt that count? But I can understand why they put the age of 17 up there, only because they want the most trained yet skilled Wizards/Witchs up for the Tournament, Not some un- skilled person who kinda knows magic.

I think it has to do with the fact that a wizard comes of age at 17. This tournament is a dangerous undertaking, and since it is not a part of the curriculum at Hogwarts, but a special event; I think participants were supposed to be able to assume total responsibility for their participation.. That seems to me to be the principle behind it.