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Louise
Okay guys, so the door is open again!! Yippee!! tongue.gif I'm not going to post the details here of how to solve it - it's on the main Veritaserum site for those of you who can't (or won't!) solve it yourselves (although you really should try...it's not that hard...think of the sense of achievement!! wink.gif )

If you do want hints though, there is a separate thread for discussions about that HERE. PLEASE don't discuss the puzzle here.

This is only for discussions on what the new hints might mean.

So, she's released the titles of three of the chapters in the HBP. I'm sure she must have chosen to release these particular ones for a reason. wink.gif

Chapter 2 - Spinner's End

Chapter 6 - Draco's Detour

Chapter 14 - Felix Felicis

Okay then! Who's gonna start? wink.gif
legendkiller
Maybe the release of the chapters is a hint as to how far she is into writing the book. To me she must be much further on that chapter 14 and she did say that hbp is shorter than ootp.
xXhApOcHiCxX
[color=green][SIZE=7][font=Courier]i figured the riddle out bymyself its easy to figure out its chapters. but i know iam so anxious now that i know that shes gotten upto chapter 14 so far maybe i think she might vbe even ahead. I really wanna know what dracos detour means. i mean iam so enthralled to know shes gotten this far. but i really hope she can relaese the book this year or in tyhe summer. i have nothing left to read becuz there is no more harry potter i have read the books already amny times to keeep myself busy but just cant anymore. ph34r.gif in order to first get in u have to wait for peeves to come around and knock the flower vase down and when the flower vase is knocked about ten keys come out and strat zooming around u u have to take the keys and insert them in te door when the right one comes around the door will open when the door opens there will be drawer open it up and take the magnifying glass and use on the folder and ther riddle will come up after u solve the riddle the chapter names come and thats it. blink.gif
Louise
Excuse me, what did I just say up there?^^^ rolleyes.gif

NO TALKING ABOUT THE PUZZLE ITSELF IN THIS THREAD!!!!!!

Please keep comments restricted to discussions about the clues.

There's already a separate thread about the riddle itself.

hermione_rocks
the chapter spinner's end sounds like something to do with a spider... i'm not really sure i heard some people say it might be something to do with rita or something

draco's detour sounds like draco made a mistake and is going back... draco's name wasn't actually in a chapter before (or am i wrong?) that probably means draco is probably going to be a BIGGER character in this book

and felix felicis sounds like a spell so maybe harry uses it to accomplish something

this news was really shocking... i never knew that she would actually give the names to the chapters...that probably means that she's done or almost done with book..i mean she wouldn't tell us the actual names if she wasn't sure and chapter 14 that's a lot of chapters! i'm hoping this means that HBP will be released NEXT YEAR! PLEASE!
Naz
Dracos Detous sounds interesting, i wonder what it will be!!
ashleigh07
Yeah you're right hermione_rocks, I'm pretty sure there hasn't been a chapter with Draco in it. I'm pretty curious about that one, coz like you said, this means that at some point in the plot, Draco *does* play some significant part.

As for Felix Felicis, my first thought was that it was another new character coz Felix is a name. But then I thought, with exception of the new DADA teacher, would she really introduce another new character so late in the series? And plus, it just seemed a little too straighforward for JKR.

I like the guess that it could be a spell. Maybe it was some spell named after a famous wizard called Felix Felicis? Hehe.

Yeah I'm REALLY keeping my fingers crossed that HBP will be out sometime next week!! *impatient*
Louise
Mmm.....she must have chosen to release those particular chapters for a reason. Why would she have picked those ones? Was it because she didn't think that those ones would give too much away whereas the others would have?

Or do they have a bearing on the information she's released before?

Spinner's End....and only in chapter 2. Mmm....usually, at this point, Harry is still in Privet Drive, but JKR has told us that this is his shortest stay there yet, which means that he might have already left by chapter 2. So where would he go? Spinners End......

Not a name that's ever been mentioned before, to the best of my knowledge. My first thought is that perhaps it's where James and Lily are buried? Maybe its where there will be a memorial for Sirius set up? Or, rather than an actual place name, it also sounds very much like the name of a cottage. There are hundreds of cottages in Britain with quaint little names like 'such-and-such's End'........could it be where Sirius lived? The place that he bought with his Uncle's money? If so, who would be taking him there? What would be there for him?

Draco's Detour....Mmm.....well, a detour is when you're on a journey, intending to go to one place but end up somewhere else, usually because the original way is blocked. So where would Draco be going? And why would he need to take a detour? Or is it a less practical thing....a detour, or change, in his character? Is it a hex or some other form of punishment for taunting Harry? Does someone hex him and send him somewhere else?

Felix Felicis.....Well, Felix is a name and it also means a cat, which has quite an interesting connection to the excerpt JKR released last time - lion-like, and lions are cats, so......

Felicis means fertile; favorable; lucky; happy, successful, fruitful; blessed.....a lucky cat? Something like that, maybe? A good luck omen? Someone who will be useful to the order? The new DADA perhaps? I doubt very much whether it's the HBP, JKR would never be that obvious. Although there is also a species of fringe-toed lizard called Acanthodactylus felicis. A connection there, perhaps?

I dunno....just some ideas I thought I'd throw out there.

What do you reckon?
ashleigh07
Wow, you've got some REALLY great theories there, Dana!!

Yeah I definitely believe those 3 chapters she revealed were especially chosen for specific reasons unknown to us at this time. But I definitely think they could be important chapters where something significant happens.

Spinner's End...yeah it sounds a lot like a place, doesn't it? And like you said, at such an early point in the book...meaning to say that JKR's going to be diving straight in from the very start!!

Yeah it has started to get me wondering where Draco's headed, or rather, was meant to be headed. What journey could he possibly be taking?

Felix Felicis is the most elusive of them all...it could be anything really!! But I like the whole "lucky cat" idea, that would be something really interesting to think about and venture further!!

Aarrrgghh...so many questions, so many possibilities!! blink.gif
taks
Here are my theory things...

Chapter 2:Spinners End- Its probably a place Harry goes to after he leaves Privet Drive (It is suppose to be his shortest stay yet...) It also sounds like a name for the place in the forest wher the giant spiders live, but I don't know how that would fit in (Spiders Place>Spinners (they spin webs) Place> Spinners End (end does sound like a name of a place, or maybe I'm just crazier than I thought...) Nevermind that spiders Place, to work it need to be Spinner's or Spinners'....

Chapter 6: Dracos Detour- It is definatly talking about Draco Malfoy... maybe he was following them and he had a detour or someone id telling a story about him doing something and taking a detour (Chapter 6 does seem a little early for them to alread be at Hogwarts, or even Diagon Alley...)

Chapter 14: Felix Felicis- It is probably a password to a forbindon/secret place, Instead of giving it the title of the room/place its the password of the room/place (It just seems so much more orginal...) You know, I can just see Harry and Ron and Hermione underneath the invisablity cloak wispering Felix Felicis into a door...

Bandoth
Spinner's. Doesn't JKR like to use spelling and definition games? She is always careful with what words she uses. Spinner's. Looks like the name of a person to me. Look at the appostrophy. A store? What if it's in Knockturn alley? Something like that? Hm. Or maybe a magical item to ward off spiders? Spinner's end sounds a little like spider death to me. Please JKR! Give us more info soon!
lupin22
i looked up the definition of spinner, and one of the def. was the arrow on gameboards that you spin to see how many spaces you move etc. it could be a referance to where harry has to go or a decision he has to make after he metaphorically " spins the the spinner". sorry if that didnt make sense blink.gif
joeshmoe1228
Chapter 2 - Spinner's End - In OoTP, Harry leaves by the third chapter ("The Advance Guard") with the aurors. Since Harry's stay at Privet Drive is much shorter, it'd make sense if he's there by the second chapter. I think maybe he ends up in the wrong area and it happens to be called Spinner's End. Just like Diagon Alley or Knockturn Alley. There are a lot of places that end in "End" . . .

I always think of Aragog, but I doubt Harry would be visiting Hogwarts and the Forbidden Forest that early. . .

Chapter 6 - Draco's Detour


I doubt JKR would decide to change the point of view at this part of the series. So since everything is in Harry's perspective, Harry has to see Draco. So why would they see each other? A detour? That makes me think of people on a tour at the White House, and they decide to sneak past the red ropes to look for the President's office. Draco is doing something sneaky. But why would he make a detour?

If Lucius escaped, he can't be seen. . . if he's still in Azkaban, Draco would be with his mum. I can only think of them meeting in Diagon Alley. Unless, Harry pays a visit to the Malfoy's place at Spinner's end. . .(whoa, where are all my strange theories coming from?)

I think Draco's detour is physical. Change in character, Dana? I don't know. . .it sounds awkward to put that as a chapter name. Why wouldn't she just say "Draco's change (of heart)" or something. Her chapters are usually straightforward.

Chapter 14 - Felix Felicis

I defnitely don't think it's the HBP. That will probably be information JKR will not reveal to us until the book is out. That's like giving away half the book, don't you think?

As for a spell that sounds like "happy/lucky cat". Lol. The image of a cat leaping out of a wand. . .Wait a second! *moment of realization* Could it be a Patronus? We've had theories that Ginny's Patronus is a cat. Also, with a Patronus, we have to think of happy things. So maybe! *gets excited* tongue.gif

Another theory is that maybe Crookshanks is this lucky cat. We know he's smart because he's talked to Sirius before. Maybe he'll help again.

Chapter 14 is after Chapter 13. Okay, that sounded kind of awkward, but hear me out. Chapter 13 is the unlucky chapter, according to some, who theorize that Rowling always puts some sort of misfortune there. In OoTP, it was Detention with Dolores, Harry refusing to go to Dumbledore about the scar, writing to Sirius, the aftermath of Harry yelling at Umbridge, and others. Maybe there will be a major battle already? (going with Patronus theory). Or perhaps something happened to Harry and this cat (Crookshanks?) saves him like Fawkes or maybe brings good fortune.

What does that book say about Kneazles?

So uhh. . .tell me what you guys think.
Louise
QUOTE
As for a spell that sounds like "happy/lucky cat". Lol. The image of a cat leaping out of a wand. . .Wait a second! *moment of realization* Could it be a Patronus? We've had theories that Ginny's Patronus is a cat. Also, with a Patronus, we have to think of happy things. So maybe! *gets excited* 


Oh, no, no, no!!! ohmy.gif That wasn't what I said!!! I never mentioned anything about a spell!!!! I just posted a translation (very rough one) of what the Latin name suggested. If it's a person, then I was suggesting that maybe that person has a connection in some way to a cat....and, with it being lucky, whether that person may prove to be an ally for Harry. Or something like that. I dunno....I'm very tired.....I've had a rough couple of days..... dry.gif

As for the Spinner's End thing...mmm....sorry, guys, you know me by now.... wink.gif I'm getting stubborn in me old age.... tongue.gif Good theories from y'all, but the cottage still sounds the most plausible to me.... wink.gif

So far...... tongue.gif
joeshmoe1228
Oh no, Dana, I just saw a couple of people theorizing that Felix Felicis might be a spell. ( I don't remember which thread. . .) I was just playing into what they were saying.

I guess we have to accept each possibility and see if we can narrow it down. *takes out Sherlock Holmes cap*

Okay Dana, maybe your theory about Spinner's End is pretty plausible. . . cool.gif Harry would be dealing with death and of course, he'd be thinking of Sirius. . . You're the one that lives there! A cottage just makes me think of Matilda though. Her and Miss Honey and a little cottage in the woods. biggrin.gif
zyra123
QUOTE (joeshmoe1228 @ Nov 2 2004, 11:55 PM)
A cottage just makes me think of Matilda though. Her and Miss Honey and a little cottage in the woods.  biggrin.gif

Oh, I love cottages!! And I like 'Matilda' as well...

Anywayy...sorry, going off topic there... tongue.gif

Spinner's End

I like Dana's theories of Spinner's End...where it was where James and Lily was buried. Or maybe a memorial place set up for Sirius... it is Chapter 2, which is to me a bit too early for Hogwarts scenes yet... and Harry must be furious still and trying to cope with Sirius's ...well, y'know...*sniff* leaving him... so, maybe it is a scene where they make a proper final tribute to Sirius... (they have to!! They just have!! *stomped feet* okay...I'll calm down now... tongue.gif)

Draco's Detour

Well, we know that Lucius has been captured in Azkaban. Do you think it has something to do with what he did now that his father is nowhere to restrain him? Maybe going to Knockturn Alley?
QUOTE
well, a detour is when you're on a journey, intending to go to one place but end up somewhere else, usually because the original way is blocked.

I need to ponder on that more... hmm... *thinking*

Felix Felicis

the first thing that came on my mind is cat...
QUOTE
Felicis means fertile; favorable; lucky; happy, successful, fruitful; blessed

A good luck omen, eh Dana? Could be...since like joe said...Chapter 13 is definately something we should look out for...it may be deceiving us like the books before. So, maybe Chapter 14 is something that covers up/neutralize Chapter 13. I don't know how else to explain... dry.gif

Anywayy...nice going there guys!! Lots of theories!!
Verity Serum
[FONT=Impact][SIZE=7][COLOR=purple][B]
Ook here's my take.....

Chapter Two: Spinner's End
This could be the new residence of Harry or maybe like Goblet of Fire it's where either Peter Pettigrew or a memory taking place.

Chapter Six: Draco's Detour
Around chapter 6 I believe they would be in Diagon Alley getting school supplies or something and maybe Harry spies Drcao going somewhere he shouldn't and follows him.

Chapter Fourteen: Felix Felicis
Maybe the new Defence Against the Dark Arts teacher....he's lucky...by chapter fourteen would they be at school sitting in the Great Hall after the sorting ceremony......

and maybe really looking too far into it......
why chapters 2, 6 and 14.....

maybe 2006 either the 14th of a month or in fourteen months would place release date January 2006!!!!
taks
hmm, i really like Dana's idea of it being where Lily and James were buried, that would be a really touching chapter...

QUOTE
and maybe really looking too far into it......
why chapters 2, 6 and 14.....

maybe 2006 either the 14th of a month or in fourteen months would place release date January 2006!!!!


nonono you aren't looking too far into this. That's a really cool idea, The release day probably isn't set in stone but that might be a clue towards an estimate...
zyra123
QUOTE (Verity Serum @ Nov 3 2004, 04:23 AM)
Chapter Six: Draco's Detour
Around chapter 6 I believe they would be in Diagon Alley getting school supplies or something and maybe Harry spies Drcao going somewhere he shouldn't and follows him.

[...]

maybe 2006 either the 14th of a month or in fourteen months would place release date January 2006!!!!

Oh, yeah...that's what I thought so too!! Only you put it better in words... tongue.gif

Yikes! Didn't realize the chapter numbering might coincidently be the release date... and 2006!!! ohmy.gif That's a long wait!!! Anyway, good catch there...although if it is out in the coming fourteen months, it would be something that's too early to speculate... but there are 5 books before this, they (publisher and JKR) might be able to see the pattern... I dunno...could be...
taks
I've heard theories (already rolleyes.gif ) Where people are saying that Spinners End is where Aragog and fellow spiders live (not that they're dead, that's just where they live) although in the CoS movie screenplay they call this place Spider's Hollow. I'm not saying that this theory is impossible, espically since that's in the movie, but it's just something to keep in mind...
joeshmoe1228
But why would Harry be in the Forbidden Forest so early?!

(I like the idea of the chapters being an estimated release date! I really hope so!)

QUOTE
spinner -
1 : one that spins
2 : a fisherman's lure consisting of a spoon, blade, or set of wings that revolves when drawn through the water
3 : a conical sheet metal fairing that is attached to an airplane propeller boss and revolves with it
4 : a movable arrow that is spun on its dial to indicate the number or kind of moves a player may make in a board game

money spinner
chiefly British : moneymaker

web spinner
an insect that spins a web; especially : any of an order of small slender insects with biting mouthparts that live in silken tunnels which they spin


there was a dictionary definition.

Do you think Harry would get so mad that he buys his own house? Okay lol maybe not.

[I wonder if Sirius gets added to the paintings at 12 Grimmauld[sp?] Place]
ibeehoneyduked
I was so happy when I found out the door was opened! I am sad I used the clues though. It would have been fun to try and figure out that riddle. Yestersay my freind got a letter back from Daniel Radcliffe! I haven't seen it yet but I can't wait! It took months to get a reply. She sent him a cd for his birthday. I think that Felix Felicis thing is a spell. I mean, what else could it be?
Anneth
On the whole "Spinner's" vs. "Spinners" thing, just remember that JKR's publishing company originally released Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince instead of Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince.... Note that "Spinners" here is plural, and not possesive.

Draco's Detour is very intriguing, as the books are told from Harry's point of view. Draco and Harry would have to be somewhere together for it to be in the books at all, or Harry would have to be seeing it through some outside source. Hmm.....

As for Felix Felicis....Hermione missed the lesson on cheering charms one year, and never learned the incantation. Perhaps this is the incantation for the cheering charm, since "felix felicis" means something along the lines of "luck and good fortune".
I have a hard time thinking of Felix as a person, but then again, that's just me...
ashleigh07
Lots and lots of interesting theories!!

This is so much fun ya know...all these guessing games, and it'll be really cool if one of us got it right!! smile.gif

Yeah it's Spinners not Spinner's. I still think it's a place of some sort that Harry has to go to. I like the idea that it's possibly a memorial ground of Sirius or James and Lily.

I was kinda doubtful about it being the name of Aragog's lair initially, but then I remembered what JKR said about Harry dealing with something in HBP which he first discovered in CoS. So yeah, we could very well be hearing from the spiders again...poor Ron laugh.gif

And good observation that since the book is written from Harry's POV that Draco's Detour would have to involve Harry somehow. Yeah I wouldn't put it past Malfoy to sneak up behind the trio trying to eavesdrop or something...

Felix Felicis being some kinda password is a brilliant idea!! Very possible. Yeah I agree with you taks, can't be the HBP...it's like giving the whole thing away. It just seems to straight forward for this to be referring to a person. So yeah, I like the password idea, and even the possibility that it's a spell of some sort.

Hey this is JKR we're talking about here...she thrives on being unpredictable!! I never put anything past her!!
HermioneGio
I don't know the other two, but Felix means happy in Latin, not cat... and Felicis... well, it's very similar to the Italian word for happy, "felice". A spell for the happiness?? laugh.gif
doomed_renascence
Spinners End-

Sounds like a street, but it could also mention something about Aragog [Spinners- spiders (Hagrid could send a letter to Harry about him)]. Hrm...speaking of spiders...spiders are very afraid of the basilisk right? Since it's the "end" of the "spinners", could that chapter have something to do with the basilisk? I don't know...it's a train of thought that I just had that had something to do with spiders. Although your guesses are as good (and usually better) than mine.

Draco's Detour-

QUOTE
Draco's Detour is very intriguing, as the books are told from Harry's point of view. Draco and Harry would have to be somewhere together for it to be in the books at all, or Harry would have to be seeing it through some outside source. Hmm.....


Harry possibly having detention with Draco then? Or Harry could have been finding Draco being really suspicious lately, and decided to use the Invisibility Cloak to follow him around...Although I still don't think Draco would become some Death Eater at that age (16 right?), or be one at all (I already explained that on another thread...but a long time ago).
Although the title could have a figurative sense to it...from one of Dana's earlier posts on this thread.

Felix Felicis-

The only original idea I can come up with for this one is that this chapter could be describing the new character that was introduced to us. Remember the old lion looking character? Felix means cat right? But if I'm right, Felix Felicis could be his name.
Although this also reminds me of Ginny and Hermione. Ginny has a small obsession with cats (no explanations, sorry x_x), while Hermione turned into some cat person when she drank the Polyjuice Potion in CoS (long side effect of the potion made wrong?).
joeshmoe1228
The one that intrigues me most, as of now, is "Felix Felicis", which I think should've been the poll put up on Veritaserum, but anyway. . .

I have so many questions about this two-worded phrase.

Number one, the alliteration. Rowling loves using alliteration for her chapters. As I look through OoTP now, I see "Detention with Dolores", "Percy and Padfoot", "Christmas on the Closed Ward", "Luna Lovegood", and "the Ministry of Magic". I'm wondering whether Rowling chooses this alliteration on purpose, or perhaps it is just a fun name for kids to remember. That's what they remember most right? Similar sounding words used in nursery rhymes usually get very engraved in your brain. Maybe I should look for a connection there. . Perhaps a certain order? I just know chapter 16 will probably be in the middle of the book, if not, before it.

Then, there's "felix". There are so many references to cats as doomed_renascence/Lisa reminded me. Not only did Hermione turn into a cat because of Millicent Bulstrode or Ginny's alleged love for cats, Mrs. Figg loved cats, Hermione has Crookshanks, the HBP is described as lionlike, McGonagall can turn into a tabby. . .
You really start to wonder. . .is something big going to happen in the middle of the book? McGonagall becomes a "happy cat" for some reason or I don't know. In our everyday expressions, we have "fat cats" and "the cat is in the bag". There's just so many things pointing at cats, would that have been JKR's pointing to something huge?

Last, is the fact that this is in Latin. We know that spells are often latin-rooted. And if Ginny really is a cat-lover, it could be her Patronus because Patronuses require happiness and a cat could match her personality. If it says anything about what her Patronus is, in OoTP especially, tell me! Or perhaps, McGonagall comes to rescue Harry for some reason. We saw her firmness with Umbridge. She's definitely not afraid to stand up for what she thinks is right. How that would be "Felix Felicis", maybe McGonagall accomplished something. There is also Crookshanks, who we know is a smart cat, who might just be able to pull off another smart trick. Last time he could tell it was Sirius asn an Animangi, how do we know what Crookshanks will pull off this time?

Where else do we see Latin in the books besides the spells? What is the incantation for a "cheering charm"? Maybe there's something with that. My main attitude is that something good happens, or a discovery is made. Wait, hold on. I'm going to try to remember what case "Felicis" is in. . .a dative or ablative plural case. The dative case is to do something "to" or "for" somebody. An ablative is sort of confusing because there are so many types. But one is the ablative of "respect", in which something "gives respect to" something. It is used to express the respect in which an adjective, noun or verb is true.

Lol, to contradict the whole cat theory, I have a feeling "Felix" does not mean cat. There is an expression in Latin called "Felix culpa", in which the definition is "fortunate fault". Culpa is "fault" from my knowledge. So I'm guessing Felix is an adjective meaning "fortunate". Applying the dative case, it would be (The) Fortunate for fortunes. Using the ablative, it would be, fortunate in respect to fortunes.

Then, there's the theory that Felix might be a name. Perhaps of McClaggan, whose first name I don't know. It could be Felix, although it is rare, it has been used as a first name. So the definition could be changed into Felix for (the) fortunes or Felix in respect to (the) fortunes.

I have a feeling that was a bunch of gibberish no one will understand. sad.gif
Louise
QUOTE
I have a feeling that was a bunch of gibberish no one will understand


Aw, Joe! Have more faith in yourself!!! You're among the far more literate members around here, so you never have to worry about talking gibberish!! I understood you perfectly!! And a very good post it was too!!

But, first of all, I think I may have caused a bit of confusion here and it's entirely my fault for being a prat. wink.gif (But if anyone else calls me that, I'll get the werewolves out.... tongue.gif ) Anyway, HermioneGio was perfectly correct - Felix doesn't mean cat in Latin.

QUOTE
felix, (gen.), felicis  ADJ 
fertile; favorable; lucky; happy, successful, fruitful; blessed;
(from http://lysy2.archives.nd.edu/cgi-bin/words.exe)

In other words, Felix Felicis mean the same thing essentially. 'Felis' is the genus of the Felidae, incorporating true cats and most wildcats. I think that's probably where the confusion arose. Particularly as 'Felix' is a very stereotypical name for cats, at least in Britain, I'm not sure about everywhere else.

So we're left with 1) JKR's word games and 2) What is becoming increasingly likely, IMHO of course, to be a person. I really don't think it sounds much like a spell because the Latin roots aren't right. I really wish Ceres was still around because she knew far more about Latin than I do, but spells are more adjectives whereas Felix Felicis sounds far more like a name to me. (Good arguments from Joe there though about the ablutive case) Although I still think that there is a cat involved there somewhere, whether it be a Kneazle, animagus, patronus or whatever. And you're definitely right about the alliteration there too, Joe. She certainly does love using that.

I've been looking through all of the previous books to see that pattern that JKR uses and it seems to me that although she can be a little indirect, her chapter titles have never been cryptic. I'm thinking here more of Spinners End than anything else. I don't think that Spinners has anything to do with Aragog or the forbidden forest for two main reasons - firstly, I can't see any reason why Harry would be in the forbidden forest so very early on in the book and secondly because JKR has never been cryptic in the past - her chapter titles are exactly what they appear appear to be. They might occasionally be a bit mysterious (like 'Grim Defeat', 'The Centaur and the Sneak', 'Mudbloods and Murmurs', 'The Egg and the Eye' etc etc) but never cryptic, which this chapter would be if it involved the death of spiders, 'Spinners end'.
wizard
QUOTE (hermione_rocks @ Oct 31 2004, 08:35 PM)
the chapter spinner's end sounds like something to do with a spider... i'm not really sure i heard some people say it might be something to do with rita or something

draco's detour sounds like draco made a mistake and is going back... draco's name wasn't actually in a chapter before (or am i wrong?) that probably means draco is probably going to be a BIGGER character in this book

and felix felicis sounds like a spell so maybe harry uses it to accomplish something

this news was really shocking... i never knew that she would actually give the names to the chapters...that probably means that she's done or almost done with book..i mean she wouldn't tell us the actual names if she wasn't sure and chapter 14 that's a lot of chapters! i'm hoping this means that HBP will be released NEXT YEAR! PLEASE!

[SIZE=[B][IMG]Listen,what I know about these chapters is that they all have a meaning:like Spinners End,maybe it could be a place,or a street that Harry would taken to get somewhere.Draco's Detour is maybe something about Draco making something important ,making a detour to his...I don't know,maybe his plan (a plan of somekind),and Felix Felicis I deafnitly think it will be the new DADA teacher, dry.gif
wors
QUOTE (taks @ Nov 3 2004, 12:56 AM)
I've heard theories (already rolleyes.gif ) Where people are saying that Spinners End is where Aragog and fellow spiders live (not that they're dead, that's just where they live) although in the CoS movie screenplay they call this place Spider's Hollow.

hey you may be right. What if spinner's end has to do with aragog that would fit in almost perfectly with dracos detour. maby Harry blames the death eaters for sirius's death.... so het finds out that voldeort is doing something in the forest, Harry sees what there p to and follows draco to some place and thats why draco must have taken a detour.

Also jk gave 3 chapter names chapter 2,6 and 14 ok theres a patern. 2+4=6chapter 6+8=chapter 14 coincedence that she gave the chapters in that order... biggrin.gif i dont think so ut now i cant figure out why she would give it in that order the only reason i can think of is 14+12= 26 maby shes already at chapter 26. biggrin.gif I just thouht of something spinners end can also be the death of someone? wink.gif
joeshmoe1228
Wors, I noticed you used the apostrophe 's' when referring to Spinners End. I think we all do that automatically.

Now that I've been thinking about that,
even if it was the name of a street, it would make so much more sense if that phrase has an apostrophe. But it doesn't.

So rather than having "end" be a noun, maybe we should use it as a verb. (Such as the end of something).

I was going to say that using "end" as a verb would not sound like Rowling because she usually uses all nouns as chapter names. But I was just flipping through OoTP (for like the millionth time lol) and I noticed the last chapter seems to be the only chapters that end with a verb. What are they titled? They are chapter 36, "The Only One He Ever Feared", and chapter 38, "The Second War Begins".

The two main questions often associated with the phrase are: "What is the spinner?" and "What does it mean by end?"

If the spinner ends, talking about the spinner we use in the game Twister or something, then it has to land somewhere right? Or perhaps there is a game of chance involved. She's referring to the plural of spinner so I don't know. However, the aforementioned chapters from OoTP may be able to relate to this chapter because those are two of the last chapters of that story. As it continues on to the next book, the story is carried over, is it not? I dislike the theory about the spinner being the Ministry of Magic because Rowling is very straightforward with her chapters like many people have said and that statement is too elusive. A spin doctor? Sorry to butcher the theory but Rowling's chapters are usually set up so that if you read the title in hindsight, you'll go "Ohh, yeah it's that scene where such and such occured. and whatnot"

Also if, outside Harry Potter, someone hadasked me what I associated with the word "spinner" would think of:

Twister and spinning that spinner (right hand red!)
a top
and thread.
I wouldn't think of a spider unless someone said the word Harry Potter.
Anneth
Ooohh...I never thought of "end" as a verb before.

And I just thought of something. What if "spinners" referrs to some of the characters, and not something new. If people were spinning around in circles (either literally or figuratively) they would be called "spinners", right? And if they stopped, they would "end". So perhaps the chapter title is talking about something that some characters do in the chapter...just a thought.
Ammo
A few thoughts:

Although it is true that JKR tends now to tell the story almost exclusively through Harry’s eyes, this is something which she has really only developed in the later books. Initially she was much more likely to directly describe the emotions/opinions of others, and in many cases this was necessary (eg as Hermione was not Harry's friend to begin with). Of course, she broke with this tradition at the beginning of book four. Rowling has also mention (in a webchat? on her site?) about a lost chapter she once tried to write, a conversation between draco and Theodore Nott. Importantly this was at draco’s mansion and she explicitly said she liked the opportunity to write in a different setting and between two characters into whom we so rarely get an insight. So its not too far fetched to suggest that draco's detour may be minus Harry. (i love the idea that he may stray into the path of the spiders - If he were to owe his life to Harry for example, the consequences might be fascinating, however I am wary of linking the chapter titles to closely. they are pretty far apart all and I’m sure very little can be gleaned from the equivalent chapters of previous books alone. Plus Rowling is first and foremost a writer, she does favour alliteration because it sounds better and adds interest. chapter or even book titles can be deceptive - after all how much of a part did the goblet of fire really play in book four?)

-As for the discussion of the punctuation used in Spinners End, it aught to be considered that proper nouns often loose such details over time. the absence of an apostrophe may indicate relatively little.

-i try not to engage myself in far fetches theories (at least not in written form!) but arguably a truly broad view can only help develop a tighter and more plausible understanding in the long run. So here goes: I’ve often wondered how exactly Voldemort of Harry are to defeat one another. after all, their wands cannot do battle...short of poison/pushing your opponent off a cliff there is nothing doing. would Harry really attack V unarmed? after all this is not the valiant conduct we have come to expect from a Gryffindor. come to that would voldemort? He seemed anxious to duel with Harry at the end of GOF and in true bond-baddy style, why go for the easy killing?
IN the third triwizard task harry used his wand as a pointer, a compass.. a kind of spinner. we know that despite the wand "choosing" the wizard, that charlie and ron at least have both owned more than one wand, Neville's wand snapped at the end of OOTP. If Harry had a new wand it would solve the V problem. We know Harry is "fond" of his wand so this would be a major event. It might even explain the continual references to his parents' wands.
Louise
First off, welcome to the forums!! Excellent first post - thanks for adding your thoughts, particularly the parts where JKR has said about that chapter between Draco and Nott....I wasn't aware of that...I wonder why she decided to cut that out? Mmm.....good reasons for why Draco's Detour may be something a bit different to JKR's usual style though.... wink.gif

That last paragraph though, I'm afraid, was completely off topic. There are other threads around here discussing the future, the wands, and who might kill whom in the end, so if you'd like to post your ideas over in the appropriate threads, I'm sure there are loads of people around here who would be pleased to discuss the ideas with you.

Anywho, welcome again!! Hope you have a blast here... biggrin.gif

Ammo
the snippet about nott s here on rowlings site.

http://www.jkrowling.com/textonly/extrastuff_view.cfm?id=5
Anneth
Yeah, that is a very interesting comment she made. Before I read that, I would have thought that Theodore Nott was just a background character (but who knows, maybe he still is...)

It seems likely that JKR will finally put in her chapter about Godric's Hollow, so it stands to reason that she might put in the Nott chapter as well, as a nice Detour for Draco.
hpfreak11
[COLOR=yellow]IS it just me or does it has to do with the Death of a spider(Aragog)

[COLOR=red]Draco's Detour sounds like him going on a jourany. Maybe to find someone or something.

[COLOR=orange]Felix Felicus sounds life someones name.(DADA)
Ammo
another grammar point:
when hbp first appeared on rowling's site, it was written without a hyphen. surely if shed made a similar misteake on the chapter titles, she'd have changed it like she did before...?
wors
ok i went and thoght about it and it hit me (ouch!) a spinner could be someone who spinns storys so the only person it could be is rita she always Spinns storys abbout Harry so maby she going to die. dry.gif
Fergy71
Oh my! I really wanted to have any clue bout who was the next passin by, but Rita? I mean, she it's not that important so that her death cause a revolution in the book, unless she make somethin realyy big......
Ammo
well it'll be the "end" of hermione's ban on rita's writing...
wors
It could be, but if she dies i wonder if it would be Voldemort of deatheaters who will kill her dry.gif
.:Fleur_Delacour:.
About the chapter Spinners End...it sounds to me like at the veery begining of the book J.K has already started killing off ppl! i measn Spinners End...mayb Spinner oculd be a person... huh.gif
.:Fleur_Delacour:.
and the theroy on Rita is good...only as already said...unless she is creating sumthign big her death wouldnt b so horrifyling.


Also i have a perdiction on who the Half-Blood Prince is:

Dumbledore isnt one of the older "pure-blood" family names...and we dont know much about his past...it could be dumbledore!! ohmy.gif
Fergy71
I dn't believe it...Dumbledore? It could be: we don't know nothing about his past, but it would be really weird. I think someone new is gonna be in the book and that he or she will be the prince, as you can see, in each book there is a new character that gets involved with harry's life anyway, from his side or from Voldemort's

MOD EDIT : The use of netspeak is not allowed on this forum. Please read the rules which you cand find a link to at the top left of every page. Your post has been edited.
Louise
Please can we keep the discussions to the new chapters?

If you want to talk about who the HBP might be, you can do so HERE.

Thanks.
Rickmansmissus
Chapter 2 - Spinner's End I believe that it is more to do with a sneakoscope (don't they spin?)

Chapter 6 - Draco's Detour I'm wondering if this has something to do with DE's. Or if he has a master plan, he did warn Harry about siding with the wrong people.

Chapter 14 - Felix Felicis I think this would have something to do with the new "lion-esque" faced character. Though I am wondering why it is quite late in a book that we would meet this character, unless he is not a prominent character.
I_LOVE_RON
I think that the chapter "Draco's Detour" might mean draco has a change in character(not likely) or another big change in his life.
katkid
Chapter 2 - Spinner's End
spinner seems like she might be refering to a spider. Maybe someone is an animagus and they become a spider. Or maybe we'll be hearing more from Aragog. End sounds like someone dies.

Chapter 6 - Draco's Detour
I can say just about the same thing. Draco is taking a trip.

Chapter 14 - Felix Felicis
<quote>In August Jo Rowling put what we can only assume was an HBP excerpt behind the mysterious "Do Not Disturb" door on JKRowling.com. Spoiler alert!:
"He looked rather like an old lion. There were streaks of grey in his mane of tawny hair and his bushy eyebrows; he had keen yellowish eyes behind a pair of wire-rimmed spectacles and a certain rangy, loping grace even though he walked with a slight limp."</quote>It does sound like a cat is involved. Hmm...
Princess_Hermione
The story looks like that Harry and Draco might cause something that we might not forget when we read the 6th book. Sounds like they're gonna start a catfight, or something. huh.gif
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