This topic is for discussing schooling. You may discuss your own personal experiences or discuss the general subject of schooling throughout the world, including your own neighborhood or the style of schooling in another country. Topics may include home schooling, public schools, private schools, no schools, college/university, tech. schools, trade schools, etc.

Please respect everyone's thoughts and opinions

Thank you El Barto for making my idea come to life!

Well I'm going to start off with a question for the dueling club in regards to this topic.



Sorry for such a short post, I'm being kept on my toes with all that I need to get done at the moment.

~Ashley

Personally, homeschooling as had the most positive influence on my daughter followed closely by a private church school. I've had little to no luck with public school where my daughter is concerned.

With homeschooling, we are able to go above and beyond the normal public school level. My daughter is getting a stronger education with more hands-on experience. During certain times of the year, the nature/science place around my area has a homeschool centered science class. The kids not only get to learn about certain things, but they also get to see these things and experience them first hand. It's not all about the textbook and busy work. While the kids are there, they don't even feel like they are taking a class yet they are learning soo much.

My daughter has always been above her level in the school system. While the public school would do nothing for her, the private church school was better able to accomodate because they work at a level above the public school system. However, when I had to pull her out of the church school and place her back in public, it became a nightmare. I ended up pulling her out and homeschooling her. She is much happier now, especially since we have settled into a routine.

Also as a result of homeschooling, I was able to skip her ahead a grade to get closer to her actual education level. And every child learns differently. My daughter loves to read so I am able to pick out a curriculum that focuses more on reading for learning. She's not much of a writer so the reading takes away some of the written work. Of course she still has to do a lot of writing, but not as much with the curriculum we are using. It's helped get her back to enjoying education where the public school was taking the enjoyment away.

She still has plenty of social time with other kids of all ages through PE, library, science, field trips, and whatever else comes up during the year we decide to participate in. The only thing missing from her public school days is the hassle and frustration. I think my daughter would probably hate school by now if she had stayed in it.

Of course, not every school system is like mine. I'm sure there are plenty of areas out there who have a wonderful public school system. Just for me and my daughter, homeschool was the best because our public school system was greatly lacking.

I am an educator in the public school system in the state of Hawaii. I am also a product of the same public school system. I think that I am fairly intelligent with a wide degree of common sense. I love to read and have excellent social skills. Is this all attributed to the Public Schools? Probably not.

I do want to point out that in my profession, the biggest impact we have noticed on a childs learning and adapting to school is parental involvement. In my area we have schools that simply thrive in all areas of academics, sports, social and community activities. The main reason for this is the parents willingness to be involved. In the communities where the parents play an active role in their child's learning and social and physical development...the students seem to excel far greater. The challenges for teachers are in the areas where the parents really expect the schools to "babysit" their kids and then complain when their child is only reading at a third grade reading level in the ninth grade. A teacher is a valuable asset to any school if they are doing everything they can to involve parents and students to work together to acheive maximum success.

Sorry this is short. It is almost 2am and Im tired

I agree that a parent's involvement in their child's education is very important to their success. However, the school system in my area seems to frown down on the idea of the parent getting involved. I've had a couple of teacher's in the public school system get quite rude with me because of trying to get myself involved with my daughter's education when she was in the system.

I will say, her Kindergarden teacher was absolutely magnificent. We were able to work together because she realized and acknowledged my child's advanced level. She put her on the accelerated reader program and kept me informed of her progress. Together, we were able to find ways to keep my daughter's interest including allowing her to keep a daily journal of full sentences which she came up with on her own while the other students were just copying down the word of the day into their journals.

But, she was the only teacher I encountered who seemed to live by that philosophy-teacher and parents working together for the benefit of the child's education and future. I got the impression from other teachers that I was bothering them when I approached them to discuss my daughter. And when I confronted the admins about it, they just seemed to shrug their shoulders and blow it off. Oh well, for now, I don't have to worry about that because of homeschooling her. One day, she will end up back in the system and I'll have to deal with it again. I'll just have to worry about it then.

I have been in a private school all my life with no regrets. I have always had fun and enjoyed my classes. I love to read and I understand things very easily. My weakest point is grammar and all of that in English. Since I have a higher level of comprehension i am very good at math and science so I just moved up to honor classes in those area. the teachers are always concerned about the grades, but because it is high school they let us make our own decisions and go along with it. I haven't meet any teacher in the private schools that I went to not care about any of their students.

I'm not much of a writer so this is pretty straight forward.

Jake

Hiya,

I've been in a private school for 7 years now, and i enjoy it. It's not extremely strict, its just fine. It's a religious school though, so its pretty strict on that basis.

However, i like it. I love reading, i love english, i love history etc. I enjoy school. And the teachers are very supportive, they back you up and my old teacher used to be like a "friend" to us. If you have any personal outside-studies problem or anything you could just talk to her, and get good advise.

You dont get any racist people, no bullying, except slight...but thats just people joking about and nobody's expected to take it too seriously. It's absolutely great.

I disagree with private schooling at home, because i feel thats just too much. The child gets less time to socialize with other people around them, and its really too different. It gets lonely, and you cant debate with people, so in the end people like that end up lacking in important skills/qualities which every person attending schools lacks.

Anyway i think i'll stop there..

~Vian

*dementor*, thanks for your input. But I have to disagree with your views on homeschooling. Not saying that the lack of socialization doesn't happen for some, but for the majority of homeschoolers, there is plenty of socialization.

I've been homeschooling my daughter for a few years now and it is great. Before we started, I never realized just how many people are doing it these days. Just in my small little area, we have 50 families on our homeschool list. Just a few miles down the road in the next town, there are about 60. And a few more miles down the road, there is a group with well over 100 families. Every once in a while, we try to get all the groups together for an outing. But the majority of the time, we do activities within our own groups.

My daughter has PE once a week, science class at this neat hands-on science place down the road, swim team 4 days a week (not to mention the meets), and creative writing once a week. Due to swim, we don't have time to participate in other activities, but there is also a spanish class, an art class, and this community service group (I can't remember the name) that goes around doing things for the community like visiting nursing homes, fund raisers, etc. or get together for horseback riding or camping. Not to mention the field trips we take as a group during the school year.

Due to the diversity of ages that she interacts with on a daily basis, she is able to participate in any age leveled conversation with ease and fit right in. She can interact with older and younger people just as easily as peers her own age. She, like the other kids in our groups, have no problem at all in the socialization area. In fact, in some ways, they are more skilled because of their experience with the different levels. In public/private schools, you pretty much stick to your own age and grade level. You don't have as much of a chance with the intermingling of ages.

Don't get me wrong. My daughter went to a Christian school for a couple of years. She thorougly enjoyed it as well. But when my youngest came along and I became a stay-at-home parent, we could no longer afford to send her there. If the day comes that I have to put her back into the "school system", I hope it will be back into the Christian school. But until that day comes, homeschooling is the greatest thing for us.

Anyways, that's my observations from personal experience. Hope I didn't sound argumentative or anything. Just wanted to give my side.

I'm with Laura on this one.

Vian, your school sounds lovely! But many parents cannot afford such a school.

That aside, I homeschooled my son James for grades 2-3, then 9-12th.

I often heard the 'socialization' argument--in fact, it was usually the only argument that most people could come up with. But I never agreed with that. As Laura states, a homeschooled child interacts with many different types of people, different ages, different circumstances, because they have time to go places and see things--they're not in a classroom with the same people all the time, day in, day out...they don't spend all day with people the same age as them, the same socio-economic class, or the same religion.

As a result, I feel my son can socialize freely with many types of people very comfortably. He does not judge a person upon appearance or age, since he mostly only had peer pressure at a time when he was sure to notice it for the farce it was. No one dictates to my son how things have to be. He's the most open-minded person I know.

Another thing that people may not know about homeschool--we only spent 2-3 hours a day on it. That's all we needed to spend on 'lessons.' Thing is, at home, a child doesn't have to get in line, doesn't have to wait for everyone to 'settle down,' before something can be done. No queue for the loo, no queue for the cafeteria, none of the things that happen in school that waste an incredible protion of the day. I'd say many school children spend a good third of the day waiting for something to happen, for classmates to be quiet so the teacher can go on, or doing silly 'busy work' that isn't geared to their interests or skills, but was simply put in front of them to keep them out of trouble. The rest of the time, he went to the supermarket with me, where he learned first-hand about nutrition and budgeting. He went to the library with me, to the doctor, to yard sales, where often he would engage someone in conversation, based simply on their opening line, "Hey, cutie, shouldn't you be in school?"

When he was older, he taught himself algebra. And he loved it.

He's off to university next week--he's nervous, but excited! I think he will enjoy it very much.

I am a sophomore in college, and I went to a public school for all thirteen years of grade school. While I don't believe my high school experience was the greatest thing since sliced bread, by and large I think I got a good foundation in reading, writing, and math, I was well prepared for college courses, and I doubt I would have been much better off in a private school. Certain departments were inevitably worse than others, and during our freshman year, most of my high school classmates and I found that the trick was to ignore those weaknesses in our secondary school backgrounds and not allow them to carry over into our undergrad experiences. My high school's history and economics courses were notoriously poor, but my friends and I decided to give the subjects a fresh start in college and now two of my friends are econ majors and I've taken and enjoyed several history classes. I'd hazard a guess that the same applies to private schools.

My only objection to public education is the emphasis placed on state-mandated and national testing. I don't know about other states, but New York puts students through a battery of exams starting in eighth grade with assessments in math, general science, language arts, social studies, and technology, and continuing through high school with Regents tests in math, earth sciences, biology, chemistry, English, world history, American history, and foreign languages. Add AP exams and the rest of the College Board phenomenon (and now No Child Left Behind, which thankfully never effected me) on top of that, and suddenly curriculums in virtually every subject revolve around the test score. Teachers careers depend so heavily on their students achieving high results that they lose all creative freedom in designing their classes. Overall, it's pretty intellectually stifling for everyone involved, and this is not a situation faced by either privately schooled or homeschooled students. That being said, I had some great teachers, particularly in English and science, who were so good at structuring their courses and keeping people engaged with the material that it was enough to make you forget the exam even existed. A lot of the time I think it comes down to the individual teacher.

If people don't object to my hijacking the conversation, I'd like to hear what everyone thinks about a different topic that has interested me lately: what is the purpose of an undergraduate education? A couple weeks ago, I was talking to one of my high school friends about his fall course load. He told me that he was taking business, economics, statistics, and communications studies. I was kind of startled by this development, because throughout high school he always had been interested in literature and art, and I expressed my surprise that he was taking no classes in the humanities. His response was that majoring in English, philosophy, religion, foreign languages, linguistics, theater, gender studies, art, or music is like asking for a lifetime of unemployment. The only way to get a job is to get a business or engineering Bachelor's degree.

While I certainly have my future in the back of my mind as I plan my course distribution, I am continuously stunned by the number of people who view college as a direct route to a career. I highly value the liberal arts, I didn't apply to any schools with a large core curriculum, and while I'm a geology major and I love my department, I've taken and am planning to take many courses in history, political science, religion, English, and art history, and I don't even know whether I'm going to continue geology after college yet. Am I completely naïve? Is this really the way of the world?

I've been meaning to post here for two weeks now, but for several reasons, I couldn't sit down and organise my thoughts. Some of them were logistic constraints, but the main reason was my own confusion on the subject.

As some of you know, I've been studying computer engineering for two years now, after choosing it above languages at the beginning of last year. I chose engineering for two reasons: firstly, it's more challenging in terms of maths and science, and secondly, one is more likely to get a job with an engineering degree than a languages degree.

In my own defence, it was never a money thing. The situation in South Africa is so that I would either have had to become a journalist or a teaching assistant at the university if I studied languages. I don't want to be a journalist, and a teaching assitant's job isn't enough to live on. So, engineering was, besides a nice enough course, a way of ensuring a challenging and "proper" job.

However! I've realised it's not enough. More specifically, I've realised this in the past two weeks. I'm amazed it took me so long. There's even a bit of shame mixed in there, because I've always been a huge advocate of pursuing one's interests, instead of things that please others or are considered proper. When all my friends in high school were choosing graduation subjects according to the "doors they opened", I simply went and chose 8 subjects I wanted to take. Simple as that, and it worked perfectly for me.

Anyway, I think, more than ever, that it's imperative to pursue one's interests. I've decided to switch courses, and already it's improved my view of my surroundings, which I hadn't even realised was murky. Funny how that works.

Thinking about money tires me. I'd probably not say no to winning the lotto, but the thought of getting up in the morning to study a course for the sake of earning good money one day just gives me the creeps. I'm too much of a Ravenclaw - broadening my mind is what gives me energy. To me that means being busy with things that interest me, which are the humanities and maths/formal logic.

I love hearing about people who pursue their dreams, sometimes despite it being unconventional. I do understand that there are circumstances that force some people to choose routes that ensure employment (heck, I see enough of it where I am), but I have trouble getting why some people, who have the chance to do what they want to, choose courses of study based on the salary they'll get one day. It's depressing.

I guess it's very easy for me to talk. I don't have to provide for myself yet, I study at minimal cost and I have the opportunity to attend university. On top of that, the infrastructure exists that enables me to pursue my interests. It makes me feel even more obligated to make use of it as best I can, and that means, to me, doing what I feel passionate about.

Oh to be able to study purely for the sake of studying! Currently, I'm going after my accounting and business admin degrees. This wasn't my first choice, either. Initially, I was pursuing degrees in engineering and mathematics. However, lack of time due to my kids forced me to change directions. Although engineering could potentially bring in more money, I need degrees sooner than later.

Currently, I'm a stay at home mom homeschooling my oldest while my youngest is 2 1/2. I only have about another year or two to attain a degree before heading back out into the work force. At the rate I'm going (because I can't go full-time with the kids), it'll be another 4-5 years before I could get an engineering degree. However, I'm just a quarter away from getting these 2 two-year degrees. They will be enough to get a better position and pay while I slowly start working toward the 4 year degree in bus. admin. So this is the logical choice for me at this time.

In the perfect world, I'd still be going after my engin. and math degrees, but that just isn't possible for me right now. Maybe one day when the kids are old enough to be self-sustaining, I can go back and work towards them. Heck, I'm just about 5 or 6 classes away from getting my 2-year degrees in them. Math has always been my strong point and a degree in a math related field would be much more challenging, satisfying, and enjoyable.

I will say, though, in the beginning of my "college days", I did take classes just for the sake of taking them. But that was before I was remarried and had a second child. I'm sure things would have been even more greatly different if I had decided to go to college straight after high school. But, alas, I made the mistake of taking a "break". I was about 27 when I finally started my college "career". Oh well. Better late than never!!

Like Laurette, I had wanted to reply to this weeks ago, but never did because I knew it would require more than the quick dashing off of a post.

Allie, the education choice thing can be a real dilemma! I too study things that don't lead to money (languages, history, arts). I knew that if I got my degree in history, I would have to go on to a Master's Degree in something like Library Sciences (more commonly called Information Sciences now) in order to make a decent living.

As it is, I had a stalker a few years back and got really paranoid to leave the house. So it all fell away. I haven't got back yet and I don't know if I will, and here is why.

I think that in America, we have new challenges as university students, regarding financing education. Our government favors corporate interests over human interests right now, even as regards education. Legislation has changed. It is now far more difficult to get university grants, yet much easier to get university loans! That makes the banks happy, but it also means most 4-year college students leave to enter their new lives with an instant $20,000 debt, at minimum. That makes it even more important to find a career that can pay that bill! So I fear humanities in this country will take a real blow, as more and more people must give up studying what they love, in order to study what they need.

For me, I don't see the point of going back now. I will only end up working for a government that doesn't really seem to want people to be informed, and will force me to turn over my patron's reading lists so they can be spied upon! That's what a librarian does, essentially--works for the government. And I'll have an even bigger debt than what I already have, so my lifestyle will hardly improve. I would be paying that debt even after I retire, as I'm 45 now. How many people can afford a loan debt repayment of $1,000 a month, in order to pay it off in 10 years? Not me.

Consolidate! That's the new option. With that option, I'd be paying for 25 years. The bank is already arranging that with me. Isn't that nice of them? Nothing like having to pay twice as much interest. Well, they like that idea at least. And that's the whole point. It's more important to cater to the banks than to ensure that students get a good education so they can contribute to a better society.

Perhaps a lot of young Americans will opt out of college altogether. I mean, what's the point of all that effort just to get a job you don't even like? So Laura, I can sure see where you're coming from! Not just from a "I need a decent job now" standpoint, but also from the point of knowing that the four-year degree will cost much more money to get! I think your plan to do all that is a really good one--some compromises, yes, but your eye is on the horizon, not just the next few miles. And man, if it's something we learn when we become parents, it's the art of compromise!

Laurette, I am glad you have found a better niche! It sounds extremely fascinating, and something that will be in demand, as well as it being something you love! The lucky ones are the ones who can make a good living doing what they love to do!

Aethonon, I couldn't agree with you more on the whole grant verse loan issue. It's funny how the government wants to push education achievement levels, but when it comes time for college, they don't want to help any more than they absolutely have to. They do this whole "No child left behind" stuff, hoping kids will get a better education, go to college, and be able to compete against other countries in the academic fields. They want to claim that America has this great educational system, but they don't want to fork over the money to help people out. If less and less people can afford higher education, less and less people will get college degrees. America won't be able to compete with these other countries that actually take education seriously.

I have to say that presently, I am working on a grant basis with 75% coverage at a community college. We have a 4 person household with only one income yet we don't qualify for 100% coverage. Once I do go back into the job force, I doubt I will qualify for any coverage at all. So every class I take to earn my 4 year degree will have to come out of our pockets. Money was another big deciding factor towards my degree plan. When looking into the future, I couldn't see being able to afford going after engineering and math. And you can't do anything with a 2 year degree in those two fields. But I knew I could do something with the two 2-year degrees in acct. and bus admin.

Although there are plenty of resources out there to get loans, they just aren't that flexible and the idea of debt is scary to say the least. From what I've read, you have to be a full time student to get a loan, and as soon as you leave school, or you take a quarter off, the loan goes into effect and you have to start paying it back. That would be simply impossible for me. With the kids, I couldn't go full time, and to not be able to take a quarter off without risking the loan payments to start coming in is too...risky. So although people would just love to give you an education loan, because they want your money, they just aren't for everyone. So, still, I'm going to be stuck paying as I go. Too bad I can't win the lottery!

Well, I'm 32 now...see how long it has taken me to get this far...5 years. To be fair, I took a couple of years off after my son was born. I think I will enjoy the accounting and bus. management field, but I just don't see it as challenging and satisfying as eng. and math would have been. I made sure when I made the change, it was into something I could enjoy. I'm a behind the scenes kind of person, and to work in an office, behind a desk, at a computer, away from the public is great with me. I'm through with the service industry...too much confrontation with irrate customers! I run away from confrontation. So the degree path I'm on right now will be good for me. At least much better than what I was doing!!

Laura

Okay fellow duellers. I received an interesting email the other day from another homeschool mother. Apparently, the NEA is trying to interfere with homeschooling.

The National Educational Association in their 2007-2008 Resolutions has taken a stand against homeschooling. It reads "The National Education Association believes that home schooling programs based on parental choice cannot provide the student with a comprehensive education experience. When home schooling occurs, students enrolled must meet all state curricular requirements, including the taking and passing of assessments to ensure adequate academic progress. Home schooling should be limited to the children of the immediate family, with all expenses being borne by the parents/guardians. Instruction should be by persons who are licensed by the appropriate state education licensure agency, and a curriculum approved by the state department of education should be used.

The Association also believes that home-schooled students should not participate in any extracurricular activities in the public schools. The Association further believes that local public school systems should have the authority to determine grade placement and/or credits earned toward graduation for students entering or re-entering the public school setting from a home school setting."

Personally, if the NEA wants to interfere with anything, I think they need to start by fixing the public school system first. There is nothing wrong with homeschooling as it stands right now. There are so many homeschooled kids out there that have far exceeded most public school system taught kids. I'd like to know where they got their information to claim that "home schooling programs based on parental choice cannot provide the student with a comprehensive education experience." They really need to do some more research. That's absolutely false. Most homeschooled kids score well above average on their SATs. Anyway, you've heard the saying, "If it isn't broke, don't fix it." Well, homeschooling isn't broke, so they don't need to try to fix it. They need to start with something that is broke-public school education.

Most parents pull their kids out of public schools because of the lack of quality the public school has to offer. And when it comes to advanced kids, the public school is even further behind the times. Most parents' only option with advanced kids is either homeschool or let the child suffer in public school which could greatly affect them down the road. I think the government needs to keep their nose out of homeschooling's business.

Now don't get me wrong, I know that not all public school systems are behind. I'm sure their are some excellent ones out there that are able to accomodate every type of child, but the majority just isn't able to do it.

What does everyone else think?

Laura, I am not at all surprised by this assessment of homeschooling by the National Education Association.

The reason I am not at all surprised is that the NEA is a professional organization and union for teachers. Teachers in the public school system, university professors, etc. They have a vested interest in keeping our kids in school--it pays their wage! So of course they are going to find fault with anyone who tries to circumvent their notion that they are doing the job right, for all students, when in fact they are not. It's the parents who know this, and feel they can do a better job, that pull their kids from the system.

I find it also not at all surprising that they want the laws changed so that any parent who decides to homeschool their child must hire a teacher for them. A lot of this is financial. If it got a teacher a job, they wouldn't be squawking so loudly!

Also, they feel that kids in homeschooling should be penalized by not being allowed to take part in any extra-curricular school activities. Parents of homeschooled children pay property taxes just like anyone else, and property taxes help pay for schools. So kids of homeschooled parents should, in my opinion, be allowed to play football or whatever else they wish to do in the school system. However, schools receive a certain amount of money everyday for each child who attends classes. Homeschooled kids don't bring that money to the schools because they don't attend classes. I feel the NEA is just trying to punish kids for what they feel is the 'mistake' of the parents.

Actually, schools in South Dakota, where I homeschooled, don't allow homeschooled kids to do anything with the schools. My son never felt the loss. Most things that schools provide can be provided for just as well, or better, outside the system, such as music lessons.

So the NEA is playing politics, and since they support Democratic candidates almost exclusively, if we get a Democratic president and a Democratic Congress in the next elections, you can bet the NEA will be putting the pressure on to make their resolutions into law.

I am so sick of politics, from both major parties. It's their business to fuss and tweak and give rights and take rights away--that is, when they actually work. Bunch of wastes of space as far as I'm concerned. OK, I'm getting ornery and rambling now, so I'll quit.

But the NEA is pulling these 'facts' out of their hind ends, in order to suit their own prejudices, as you so rightly saw, Laura.

Hi guys,

My thoughts on this subject are really scattered so I'll do my best to get what I want to say across. Most of it is what I've gathered from my personal experience. (They are merely observations.)

I attend a public school. In general I have mediocre teachers who induce testing anxiety.
I'm really disappointed in teachers from public schools. I've come across a huge hoard of teachers who are unqualified.

I've had a zealous Christian teacher who tried to forbid me from reading Harry Potter in her classroom. She also dictated to the class that people from the Philippines are more deserving than Americans and read snippets from the bible aloud during S.S.R.

I have had teachers who speak barely any English and tell you to read the textbook when you have a question. I have had teachers so overwhelmed by rambunctious students that we spend an entire hour listening to a lecture on acceptable behavior.

One thing all these crazy teachers have in common is that when they stop talking about themselves, or their expectations, or what have you- they teach to the tests. Everyday in my public school I can bet on a teacher going into a passionate speech about the tests we must take and pass or otherwise be doomed forever.

Whether it's the Trig hobbit teacher who wants students to be serious about their work, or the hard History teacher who sees, "failing students as failing adults" I must have endured half my age listening to how important tests are, and how important college really is.

This leads to a huge amount of pressure when taking tests.

My chemistry teacher said Friday, "Quantum mechanics aren't really useful for this course, however we are spending this week learning them because they will be on your test." My math teacher said everyday for two weeks, "Memorize these functions or you will not pass the standardize test. These will no doubt be on your SAT and you need to know them."

However most public teachers do not ensure that you have learned it at all, or see that you master the topic. If you cannot learn it after a demonstration on the board too bad, there are no alternatives for you except maybe finding a peer willing to show you the way. Otherwise it's next week we're on a new subject because there's a massive amount you must know by the end of this year or we all fail.

Instead of a consistent mastery of a subject and an inevitable pass of these tests- we spend more time talking about the effect they have on your high school career and future.

Or a class can be held back trying to grasp the basic foundations of a subject then rushed into the deeper complexer teachings. Half a semester can be spent reviewing a subject.

I mean if you are confident in a subject there can be only a little, bearable pressure taking a test on it right? It seems to me that if teachers had the means (without NCLB for example) to educate their students completely or at least to the students capability it would eliminate the problems of test anxiety, and low test scores among others.

It's safe to say I am disappointed in the system of public education. Teachers try, but there is so much against them. One slip up and you're behind indefinitely.

From what Aethonon and LittleRed7771 have shared of homeschooling I only wish I had that opportunity. I've really only ever heard of the scary homeschooling people, you know the ones in cults?

I knew it wasn't true but I never imagined homeschooling could have such great benefits for the kid. It's just so radically different from what I'm used to attending a public school.

How do you decide on curriculums though?

Jumping to a new portion of schooling, it is important to note this article indicates a California court decision that challenges the right's of parents to homeschool their children.

I know many people that choose to homeschool their children where I live. We also have a member or two here at VTM.

How in the world can a court case over possible emotional/physical mistreatment of a child being homeschooled possibly go so far as to affect all homeschooled families within the state?
This is definitely a topic to watch in the news as it unfolds.

Speaking from a homeschooling parent standpoint, I can see the train of thought that the legal system is basing its rulings on. There are those few and far between parents who "homeschool" their children so they can be free to abuse their children without fear of being caught by teachers at school. In every situation in life, there's bound to be those few who try to ruin things for everyone else. Not that that's their intentions, but they abuse the system causing problems to those who aren't. And it really is sad.

I hate the idea of kids being abused at home without any way to go to someone, like a teacher, for help. It's sickening. But the system shouldn't punish all homeschooling families for those few. Maybe there should be more of a checks and balance system set up for homeschoolers. I don't know, some way for a homeschooled child to check in with an outside figure as part of the homeschooling process to verify that there is nothing to be concerned about at home. Maybe the occasional surprise visit by a Board of Education representative to make sure things are up to par.

There's got to be something that can be done to protect our children without taking our right to homeschool our children away. I seriously hope the CA ruling is overturned or every other state might start thinking about doing the same.

You know, if the education system in my area would get its act together, I wouldn't mind sending my daughter back to public school, but until then, she's going to stay at home for her education. At least I hope so.

Wow! I think that it is shocking that a persons right to educate their own child is being infringed upon. Where I grew up in Hawaii, the education system is seriously lacking. I didn't realize exactly how much...even though I was a TA in that system, until I moved to Kentucky and enrolled my kids in elementary school here. Both of my kids are behind and the standard of education in what they expect our elementary school kids to learn is so different. I mean in Hawaii my third grader was learning first grade Kentucky work. It is very sad.

Because I can't get a job right now due to my 2 year old that I refuse to put in daycare, I would have loved to homeschool my kids. The problem is that my husbands exwife has a say in our oldest daughters education and although I am qualified, she would NEVER consent to me teaching her. So for now I am just glad that my kids are getting a good education although I feel kind of useless. On the bright side my two year old can say her colors and count to 10 and is working on ABCs.

Yes, Laura, I agree completely that there needs to be some sort of controlled follow-up to assist with the prevention of child abuse that may happen in a more private educational environment. Children must be protected, that's the bottom line.

I hadn't heard of the court case before seeing the headline on AOL this morning. It is a bit surprising to see how far it got in a negative direction. At least there are many in politically influential positions that encourage and support homeschooling. I can't imagine this would go south and stay there.

Cases of home-schooling in Greece are very rare and concern mostly kids with health issues. So, I am not very familiar with the idea, and it kind of sounds bizarre to have a kid go to school in your house. How does this work? Does the government value the same these studies?

I really believe that there has to be a bigger control to it. Since it is so widely spread as a phenomenon, it is necessary to impose laws. I can not even imagine how many are being abused during home-schooling and it is terrifying that noone can actually find out what's going on behind closed doors.

I agree that the educational system needs to be improved, at least where I live. We need to have more wide education, better teachers and more practical exercise to apply our knowledge. When we finish school, we know a million things we will never use. However, I am glad I went to school cause it offered me a way of adjusting to reality and socializing with everyone around me. It formed my personality and helped understand better what's accepted and what's not among a society.

But that's just me!

Wow, it has been quiet in here.

Well, it is that time again. The tv ads are running and the newspapers boast of Sales galore. Back to school is in the beginning of its new campaign this year. I just got my first catalog for a department store and it got me to thinking about attire for school.

Do you think it is better to uniform children or let them have freedom of dress? Not really for private schools but more the public.

Do you think that the guidelines put on clothing is too strict or too lenient?

How do you feel about the marketing that goes into selling certain types of clothing to children. (Hannah Montana, Bratz, Cheetah girl merchandise etc.)

Do you feel the pricing is fair and attractive to the children's clothing market?

Thinking back on my high school days I know I would have been outraged if I had been told what to wear (even though I did not wear anything daring or funky, it would have been solely on the principle of the thing). At that age there are so many rules and regulations that what you wear is one of the few things you can control.

However, I am now a parent approaching my (cough cough) 40th birthday and I can see the pros of school uniforms or at least more conservative dress codes. I think any clothing items that promote alcohol, cigarettes or drugs should be prohibited as well as any "sexy" clothing showing midriffs, too tight pants or shirts or too short shorts or skirts. I have no problem if you've got the body to wear something that flatters you, but girls shouldn't come to school dressed as junior streetwalkers. Guys shouldn't wear pants that are falling off or be allowed to wear their hats in the school building.

Aside from distracting clothes, if you have a certain "formula" of what can be worn (khakis or skirts and polos or sweaters) then you could cut down on "class-ism" where certain kids feel they don't measure up because they're not wearing the latest trends. It would also cut down on the amount of clothes you'd have to buy your kids. My boys are "clothes horses" only because I am constantly finding them things (I shop at Target or consignment shops), so if I knew they could only wear navy chinos and white polos to school, then I wouldn't get them so many other things because they wouldn't wear them.

Bottom line, if you don't have a uniform dress code, then please enact (and enforce) a conservative dress code.

Having only been in a private school for pre-school and kindergarten, I don't really have much experience with any other than public schooling. While it has its flaws, I think the public schooling that I have in my hometown is very good, and I honestly wouldn't understand why anyone...in our town at least...would pick homeschooling over public or private education. But since we've moved past that topic, I'll answer the current questions.

Do you think it is better to uniform children or let them have freedom of dress? Not really for private schools but more the public.
Uggghhhh...... uniforms. I've never had to wear them, but my middle school (grades 6-8 for me) enforced a dress code my last year there that required students to wear collared shirts that had to be tucked in, and a belt and various other nonsensical things that had no direct correlation with my learning abilities. Private schools...yeah, they can do whatever they want because they cost a lot more and well, they're private. Public schools should not have dress codes that are anything more than the regular (aka, no ridiculously short skirts, nothing revealing, no hats etc. etc.).

I never really understood the point of having a dress code that wasn't strictly a uniform because it just makes things harder and kids can't wear what they want to wear. Getting rid of distractions and prejudice and cliques doesn't work if kids aren't wearing the exact same thing. (And I can tell you now, that cliques and that kind of stuff will still exist, uniforms or not. The reason cliques and prejudice are less in private schools is because there are fewer types of people that can afford it.) Besides, girls can still show cleavage and be distracting with collared shirts. I've seen it done. My high school did not have a dress code, and the differences that everyone had, and even the little groups of students made the school what it was. There may have been small groups, most of them sharing ideas of fashion, but all in all we went to the same school, and we were all united in that sense. It's silly for the public school systems to even think about getting rid of a teenager's way to be different, especially when that is the time when people are trying to find themselves.

How do you feel about the marketing that goes into selling certain types of clothing to children. (Hannah Montana, Bratz, Cheetah girl merchandise etc.)
Blech. I think it's disgusting. I used to have my fair share of Barbies. They thought the old Barbies were a bad influence on girls??!?!?! Have they seen those nasty pieces of plastic??!?! I'm not even going to continue.

Do you feel the pricing is fair and attractive to the children's clothing market?
Depends on where you're shopping. I've seen regular department stores that sell things that would easily fit into uniform codes, places like Kohl's or other major stores. Those outfits usually cost just as much as the other things. Course, I'm not familiar with the private school system, but if the parents have to buy the uniforms from the school, then they are probably going to be much more expensive. Then again, it was the parent's decision to throw all that money into that kind of madness anyway.

When I had the dress code at my middle school, it was very difficult for me to find collared shirts that were long enough to tuck in. Designers don't really think about that. And because it was so difficult and the dress code was stupid in my opinion, I was sent to all day SAFE--which is like an all day detention--for not having my shirt tucked in. Honestly?!??! All day!??! It was the last week of school too. Anyhoo....I think dress codes that aren't uniforms are very hard to keep up with. Useless to me really.

Regarding other things, such as cigarettes, alcohol, being sexually active, rebel-rousing teens..... Even at our two very well-known private schools here, one Catholic and one Christian, both high schools, and both as expensive as college (no joke)... They still do everything that the public school kids do. And they have uniforms. So much for that.

I have been in small private schools all my life and I think I have had a very good education.

My school from kindergarten to 8th grade co-oped track and football with the public school across the street and I used to ride the bus with kids from that school. I would often hear about things they were learning about and there were several instances when we had finished learning about things years before they just began learning about them. Perhaps it was the same way for them and we just had differently structured courses but I don't think that was the case.

My high school puts a huge emphasis on academics. Our academic decathlon team took state this year in the small school division and they took the national test over the internet and we were in the top ten nationally for academic decathlon. We took second at districts in speech (I'm on the speech team) behind a school that you have to pay 15,000 a year for because they are supposed to give the best education in the state but we beat them at academic decathlon. In my state this year my school had the second highest percentage for students scoring a 24 or above on the ACT test behind a class A school. However, that isn't really completely fair to other schools because we are so much smaller than a lot of schools.

The only thing that I really hate about my school besides the small size and bad athletic department is that the highest GPA you can get is 4.0 and there are very few honor classes. The only honor class we have is Honors English and that is for freshmen and sophomores who had As in English and so far I am going to be in that class and if I got an A in Honors English it would be worth the same as someone in the regular English class getting an A. They split up math classes depending on which class you are supposed to in and you can continue Spanish for four years (Spanish is our only foreign language offered).

My teachers are all excellent and they care about the students besides the science teacher I had last year. My Spanish teacher taught at a university for several years before coming to my school, my Geography teacher has been teaching forever and all of them are really good teachers.

My school has a dress code but I think it is pretty lenient even though I really hate tucking in my shirt. Basically for our dress code we have to wear a solid polo in red, yellow, white, gray, and any shade of blue with jeans, skirts, or khakis. Flip-flops are allowed which I am extremely happy about!

I went to private school for 8 years so I have a pretty good experience on uniforms. Yack!

Before junior high, we had to wear a uniform. It was a long red-like pants and a grey blouse. And during summer we would wear a blue shorts and a grey t-shirt. I didn't like uniforms. They were dull and boring and it was kind of annoying seeing everyone wear what you wore, every single day! The worst part was when we had to go on excursions. It was a bit embarrassing wearing these clothes: everyone could tell we were students of a private school. The problem was that my school was named God's Mother which was, you know...weird. Everyone would ask me if it was only girls, like these catholic schools around the world.

When I went to junior high and high school, we were allowed to wear our own clothes, but with limitations. No mini skirts, no short t-shirts etc etc. It was bizarre: they wouldn't let us wear short pants anymore but they didn't mind us wearing skirts. I mean...you show a lot more wearing a skirt than a capri. However, we had to wear uniform during the national parades. But this was alright.

The only good part about uniforms is that you don't have to worry about what to wear every day. Plus, the "rich" kids can't show off their brand named clothes, so we were all treated equally.

I'm very glad I won't have to wear a uniform again. I just don't like it.

Well seeing as this my first time posting in this topic I decided to first answer the questions and probably I might start some more discussion. So far from what I have read the majority of the posters here are homeschooled or private schooled. I on the other hand have always been in public school. I am about to start my Junior year of highschool. So I have no thoughts exactly about homeschool. Most of what I'm saying is my opinion and I may be wrong; Feel free to correct me.

Out of public, private, and homeschooling, which do you think had a greater positive impact on a child? In what ways?

This question is going to be answered with a full out opinions by me; Be warned lol. Well I can't really give a full out precise honest answer since I have always gone to public schools. I will say that from what I have heard compared to the others I think public is a bit difficult. I mean if you're use to undivided attention, small classrooms, uncrowded hallways, or being homeschooled this is definetly a change. Public schools you're exposed to so many good and bad things. My dad is a welder and he has worked in private schools redoing railings and stuff like that. So he has seen firsthand the lifestyle there. He has always wished and wanted to put me in private schools. He thinks that they're much safer and that I would have a greater chance to academically succeed, but I never liked the idea becuase I always had this thought that all the kids are rich there and they're snobby; You know the kinds that you see on TV. Homeschooled I for some reason always thought that they weren't all THAT social, but from what I have read I guess you are. Yet I can't help but feel it's a different exposure, but please don't kill me lol I am just giving my ignorant opinion So the academical succession. I always told my dad that the type of school system has nothing to do with how far you can go education wise. If you know what you're doing, public, private and even homeschooled, you have the same chances and opportunities as anyone else. That's my take on that. But of course my dad finally agreed with me. Personally [to answer the other part of the question] I think that public school isn't that bad. I have currently a 3.4 weighted GPA and a 3.1 unweighted. B average almost a B+ not all that great, but I work hard, and for someone who lives a low income, divorced all around family. So I have to honestly say that anywhere is good as long as you have a good head on your shoulders(:


Do you think it is better to uniform children or let them have freedom of dress? Not really for private schools but more the public?

Well I live in Miami, and my highschool was the only highschool in Miami-Dade without uniform. It actually since there opening year in 1950, they never had uniform; Unfortuently when I entered as a freshmen in 2006 they changed the rules and put uniform for the first time. I was personally upset. Becuase I have worn uniform since Elementary, and I have been dreaming since I was in 3rd grade to finally have freedom. I have always felt like a prisoner in uniform. Yea I know it sounds a bit dramtic, but it does feel like that. I have always liked the idea of expressing yourself through your clothes. Be comftorable. I understnad the purpose of it but I really don't like it. I mean now a days, the clothing style really isn't all that great, I mean people might as well walk around naked, but if they must make exceptions to what's allowed. I can hide my belly I don't mind. Small things like that, but not go as far as uniform. If it were up to me NO UNIFORM (:


Do you think that the guidelines put on clothing is too strict or too lenient?

Well I mean it depends what you mean. Like in my elementary it was pretty linient. Just as long as you wore the colors and that it was polo shirts that's fine. Then in my middle school same thing. It was pretty whatever, slack I should say. Again as long as you followed no jeans and you must wear a polo shirt. But there were times that they let us slide with the tee's. Now if you want to talk about my highschool, talk about STRICT! I mean first off if you want to go and walk in front of the school entrance, your school ID is consider part of the uniform, and you don't have it you can't come in. You have to go around the school and get a temporary ID. First time free, every other time after that a dollar. Now it doesn't matter if you're to the T perfect with the clothes no ID no entrance. And it will most likely land you a detention. Now clothes wise they are linient but they are more to strict. The school is so big that its sort of hard to be caught out of uniform. Now if you want to use he library and you no ID and/or you're out of uniform but you do have ID you're not allowed entrance. No matter what you need to do. I hate that. Now supposedly it is said that for the upcoming school years and after you're only allowed to wear sweaters that are school colors. Personally I thought that was ridiculous. To go to such great lengths as to tell us what jackets and sweaters to wear? No thanks I go with what I want.

How do you feel about the marketing that goes into selling certain types of clothing to children. (Hannah Montana, Bratz, Cheetah girl merchandise etc.)

I don't mind. I think that's cute for kids too walk around in that. I mean I wouldn't blow so much money on that either. I can make my own if I want. And thanks to this quesiton it remidned me of another thing of my school. I'm sure alot of you are aware of the brands such as Lacoste and Hollister and Abercrombie and Fitch , American Eagle and such; Well apparently those aren't allowed either [though we don't follow that rule and they don't enforce anymore]. But any shirt with a logo that isn't the schools, no matter if it's school color is considered out of unifrom. They don't enforce it anymore since more than half the school never followed that, and they are not going to give half the school detentions so they allow it now.

Do you feel the pricing is fair and attractive to the children's clothing market?

I don't think I understand but I will answer to the best of my ability. Umm I mean alot of kids think that well if they have to wear uniform they might as well wear it with style. I am one of those. I like to wear Hollister collar shirts and Dickies pants. Pricey and somewhat expensive [pshh kidding of course its expensive] but it's hard for some to stay away from the trend and what looks nice. I mean I think that if we didn't have uniform alot would be suprised to how many different styles there are and not just these pricey brands exist. I jjust feel real limited from this.


I hope I helped to strike up more discussion Love to read from more.


Nicky<3


My elementary uniform was pink or a darkish red with grey pants or short and the pink panther as the school emblem [sp?] logo on our shirt

My middle school was white, blue shirt [logo optional] and khaki or navy pants or shorts.

My highschool use to be uniform free but now its Red ; Black ; or white shirts & Black or khakie pants or shorts. And fridays are spirit day which we are allowed to wear aany school club or school related shirt with jeans. But of course many of us take advantage of that and come in no uniform BUT now supposedly also for the upcoming school year, they're thinking about removing that >:[ This saturday I have to go to a freshmen orientation, I shall find out the truth of all this...

Do you think it is better to uniform children or let them have freedom of dress? Not really for private schools but more the public.

I think all schools should go to uniforms. Because ok allowing kids to have freedom of dress which is what I had....I got made fun of all the time because of the clothes I wear mainly because I didn't pay $50 for a shirt! But with uniforms kids can't make fun of each other over stupid crap.

Do you think that the guidelines put on clothing is too strict or too lenient?

Well in my high school you wasn't aloud to wear shorts or skirts that came above your middle finger when you put your hands at your sides. However, if you were skinny or a cheerleader those rules got forgotten about. But if you were fat or gothic those rules were enforced to the point were you almost wanted to rebel.

How do you feel about the marketing that goes into selling certain types of clothing to children. (Hannah Montana, Bratz, Cheetah girl merchandise etc.)

Bratz is a serious no the heck go! I don't like the Bratz dolls and that is a different topic all together. Hannah Montana is ok, I like her clothes, I would buy them myself if they would actually fit me. LOL! Cheetah Girls meh, I don't really care to much for there clothes but there not as bad as Bratz.

Do you feel the pricing is fair and attractive to the children's clothing market?

Heck no, children's clothing is more expensive than mine! Its ridiculus!!!

I was wondering...now that the schools will be open soon, tv is flooded with ads for bags, pens, clothes etc etc, to begin the new year. It is very annoying, but also it is very dangerous for the sanity (and financial status) of parents.

What do you think about the ads policy applied on tv? Shouldn't kids and parents be protected? How much pressure do you, as parents, feel when this period comes? And you, as students, do you feel that you have to buy a trendy bag to be accepted by your classmates?

What do you think about the ads policy applied on tv? Shouldn't kids and parents be protected? How much pressure do you, as parents, feel when this period comes? And you, as students, do you feel that you have to buy a trendy bag to be accepted by your classmates?

As a student I do not believe I have to buy trendy anything. I'm sorry but I don't really believe in being trendy. I buy things that I like and are comfortable to me and are with in my price range. I bought a new book bag this year only because the one last year was literatly falling apart. As far as book bags sure I want it to look cute, but the most important thing is function.....can I use it for everything that I will need it for?......and with the book bags that I buy that answer is always yes. And for the record, they have to advertise or else people won't really know whats out there especially if like me they don't go out much. LOL!

Alright, here is another question for all the teenagers (and not) of the Duelling Club.

How would you describe the perfect school? What would you change to make school a less painful experience? Are you satisfied by the level of education offered to you? Do you think that school is a miniature of our society, and if yes, do you find this helpful? Last but not least, how do you feel about the divisions made at school (cheerleaders, athletes, "nerds" etc)?

Do you have something againt the Dueling Club? I mean I am an older teenager (aka 22) from the Dueling Club, so seriously why can't I answer? I'm sorry to say that I am answering anyways!

OMG, since when is school such a painful experience? Its the students that make it painful for themselves. Because they worry to much about getting friends and not enough about getting an education!! I don't know if I know what you mean by "level of education", but if you mean "Are we satisified with the teachers that tought us?" then my answer to that is yes I liked all of my teachers! Since when do we have a society of our own? I mean come on if we had a society of our own then we would have our own President and Vice President and all that stuff. Well as far as the "divisions" within schools believe it or not the students make up those divisions themselves. There doesn't have to be cheerleaders, athletes, nerds, etc. I was proof of that, because I had friends in all of the cliques! The reason for that was because I wasn't in a clique of my own.....I was....OMG....lets try something new......my own person! I am not a follower or a leader! I would rather be a loner and make friends with all diferent types of people than be a follower and have someone tell me what to do and when to do it or even be a leader and boss people around!

Ahem. If you read the question again, you'll see that I'm saying for teenagers and not. Seriously, I'm an IS, so how could I have something against the Duelling Club?

School was painful for me for two reasons. One was the fact that I had to wake up early everyday which was exhausting, taking in consideration the fact that I didn't have only school to care about, but also studying foreign languages and playing the piano. The other reason was that it was very stressful. It was very exhausting worrying every single day about the tests one teacher may make you attend. Even though I was always a good student, I couldn't help but worry a little bit.

The level of the education I received was very well. However, I'm sure that if I attended the public school of my neighbor, I wouldn't have the same opinion. The teachers are very indifferent and most of the times, they don't really care, they don't mind whether they do their job the way they should. No wonder that students in Greece have to take extra classes to comprehend math and the rest. There are a lot to be done, but I don't want to bore you all with the details of the greek educational system.

About the "miniature of society", you don't need to have a president to form a society. You have authorities, the principal and the teachers. There are "laws", there is control and punishment. And there are relations similar to the ones of the real society. This phrase is a metaphor. I wonder how come you've never heard about it before. It was the first thing they taught us back to school.

Last but not least, you said that there is no need to have groups like cheerleaders etc. But you admitted as well that you had friends in every clique. Unfortunately, the students are not totally responsible. These divisions have a long way back to the 80's or whatever, so it is not easy denying them. I believe that it is only reasonable that people get into groups. It's like in real life. If you are a doctor, you belong to this group. If you are a teacher, you belong to another group. Our roles, our choices form these necessary divisions. However, I do believe that there should be less discrimination against people who are not among the popular ones. How many kids don't want to go to school in order to avoid being "bullied" physically or mentally by others? It's the truth and we can't ignore it.

Geez, people these days...

How would you describe the perfect school? What would you change to make school a less painful experience? Are you satisfied by the level of education offered to you? Do you think that school is a miniature of our society, and if yes, do you find this helpful? Last but not least, how do you feel about the divisions made at school (cheerleaders, athletes, "nerds" etc)?

There is no perfect school, I'll tell you that right now. I don't care how much fun anyone had or if they were the valedictorian, there is no such thing as a perfect school. I would try to describe a perfect one...but I don't think it would be classified as school.

Less painful experience...not getting up so early. That sucked a lot. Still sucks. I think high schools should have maybe...some kind of student lounge or something. I feel like my high school was a little uptight and I think our student body could have benefited from having student areas for us to relax. Course...I guess that's what college is for.

I do kind of think that school is a little bit like a mini-society. Um...high schools are in a complete different dimension. It might as well be its own society. Sure, we don't pay bills or live in little houses near each other, but I think it's safe to say that each high school has its individual community. Oh and uh, by the way, not sure what your school is like, but most schools do have an executive board, consisting of class president, vice president, secretary, and treasurer.

Divisions are unavoidable. People make friends with the people who are most like them, and it's human nature to push away the unknown or the unfamiliar and not want to get to know someone from another clique. I've never been exactly sure what I was ever classified in...I guess I was kind of a mutt. But the cliques I my school were very pronounced. However, pretty much everyone mingled in and about other cliques. So...you're not special just because you have friends from every clique.

Just because a person has been placed in a clique, does not mean that they aren't their own person. Cliques are made up of individuals. Now, if those individuals decide to follow someone else's style or whatever, that's their choice, and it's what they want to do. I'm not even going to address the "leaders in cliques" thing because it doesn't exist. At least not outside Hollywood.

How would you describe the perfect school? What would you change to make school a less painful experience? Are you satisfied by the level of education offered to you? Do you think that school is a miniature of our society, and if yes, do you find this helpful? Last but not least, how do you feel about the divisions made at school (cheerleaders, athletes, "nerds" etc)?

I absolutely, positively, irrevocably abhored, despised, loathed, detested - and any other word you can think of that are synonymous with the aforementioned - school, high school especially.

I agree with Just the Droobles that there isn't a perfect school and there won't ever be. However, if I could go back and do my schooling again; that includes choosing where I would go to get my education, I would go to Japan. The Japanese schooling system is academic based for the most part, and the students are given fun activities such as the school festival week where each class hosts something or other (a play, selling food, a haunted house, etc. etc.).

American schooling is very lacking, at least where I came from. I have the same problem that a lot of people have - getting up early is a curse, and it has been from an early age for me. My parents actually video recorded my one morning before going to pre-school (Anyone else attend a La Petite !?) where I was hiding behind my bedroom curtain crying and screaming and throwing a fit in general because I did not want to get up (I also hated going because the two girls I considered my "friends" were always mean to me in the morning but warmed up to me in the afternoon... I think... Ah, the earliest form of cliques and shunning others: I am traumatized.), it didn't help my fits delayed us leaving and limited my breakfast timelimit - I had to eat cold poptarts on the way to school - blasphemy ! Of course, my stepdad cheered me up by drawing a little sharkface at the end of a banana and singing the jaws theme as it attacked... attacked as well as a shark-banana can. Anyhow, this isn't about that, haha, it's about how much I even hated pre-school ! I don't remember elementary school except for all of the stupid little girls (yes, I am included in that) always hating eachother for this or that and being two-faced little twits (again, I include myself).

When I finally hit middle school (5th grade) I couldn't even begin to tell you the amount of schooling I missed by skipping, yet I still made excellent grades and topped most of my classes - as well as recieved awards for "best student" and such at the end of year award ceremonies - what does this teach me ? That school was a joke and I could miss as much as I wanted and still top the class and be favoured. Kind of counter-productive if they want to keep students in school so they can recieve sufficient funding- which they didn't. I can tell you, in 8th grade I missed a month and a half of school over the course of that year and I still passed with straight As, awards, and "Most Artistic" for my grade (I wasn't even at school for the day that picture was taken for the yearbook for that little honor... funny).

When I hit High School, I should have failed or at least gotten in trouble for truancy, yet I never did. I held straight As or A-Bs for my first two years of High School (earning awards for good grades/outstanding student in French 1 & 2, as well as in Biology and Botany Zoology (made a 100 in this class as a tenth grader while everyone else was in 11th or 12th grade)). I reiterate, school was a joke.

Personally I think 11th and 12th grade are useless, but then I have to ask myself "Are teenagers really ready for college after 10th grade?" No, they're all immature and nowhere near ready to begin college. I didn't like the kids in High School, I had no close friends and never felt the need to put myself in social situations where I did foolish things and made myself looks like a fool or a disrespectful, arrogant child. I'm not a follower - most of the time I didn't approve of what was going on and wasn't going to bother with it - maybe that makes me a snob, but if it keeps the idiots away I don't mind. College students aren't much better for the most part, not until after they've burned a few thousand dollars of their parents or lost that scholarship for partying or low grades and have to pay for it themselves.

So I guess I have to say no, I wasn't satisfied with the level of "education" presented to me, mostly because I don't think school is really there to "Educate" is to teach us how to "Learn" and "Study". Most children/young adults "memorize" but don't "retain" what is taught to them. I've been taking math classes for years upon years, yet I really couldn't tell you any math formulas unless I'm going over them specifically in my class. The teachers were horrid as well. Most weren't qualified enough to teach their jobs - even if I did like the teacher- others didn't care. I hate the way the schooling system works today as well. Sure, Principles and Teachers act as "authorities" but they can't do anything for punishment. I remember when we used to get paddlings at school or in-school-suspension (not AP - pfft, Alternative Placement - what caused the chance ? Was ISS considered politcally incorrect or something equally as lame ?) where they made us do push-ups and write essays or sentences repeatedly before it evolved to working on the lessons you've missed in class (which the kids didn't do because they were sleeping) or just chatting with the teacher in-charge.

There isn't really a way to make school a less painful experience. We can't say "Oh, push back the starting time" because that's inconvenient to parents who work and take their children to school/don't want to leave their child alone to wait on the bus/ride to school, and any other numerous factors. Students also don't want to be at school longer into the afternoon. Getting rid of "cliques" won't solve anything and doesn't really cause that much of a problem in my opnion... I was a loner and I never got bullied... but then again I was also told I always looked "unapproachable"... maybe other kids that don't want to be picked on need to adopt the "Mess with me and I'll destroy you" look that I usually wore at school (Which wasn't because I was angry or mad at the world, but mostly because I was dead tired and wanted to go back to sleep... which I usually did whenever class started).

Is school like a miniature society ? Oh yes, to the nth power. It would definitely explain my disdain for joining the rest of the real world, as I dislike most people as much as I disliked school. Is it helpful ? Sure. It "helps" those of us that hated highschool realize that the real world is probably going to suck ten-times worse, because our country is run by idiots, going to be run by these idiots we left high school with, and then our jobs are going to be headed by idiots that are just as lazy and irresponsible as our high school peers. All I can pray for is that they grow up and realize there is more to life then the social ladder and who is popular, who is rich, and who is it acceptable to be seen with.

I had Adult Attention Deficit Hyperactive Disorder (really it's ADD, because I'm inattentive - not hyperactive, but they don't classify it this way anymore.) and I made it through schooling with good grades and I know it wasn't because I tried my hardest to get the best grades I could - it was because it was too easy and not at all challenging. I'm not a genius, I hardly even think I'm smart - I just know how to read and regurgitate what teachers what to know back at them. I can't remember a time in my schooling-career where I had to actually apply my own thoughts to a situation- like say... in American History - I had an awesome, excellent teacher that made us do essay questions on tests and yada yada, I loved the class... but never once did he ask the class what could possibly have been done to such and such Act/Compromise that could possibly have made it work better/more equally.

Ex. What could be changed within the Three-Fifths Compromise to ensure more equality for Black-Americans(slaves) being counted as people for tax purposes and the aportionment of the members of the United States House of Representatives ?

Never was something like that presented during my high school career (that I remember... lol) to make me think outside the box and apply logic and creative skills to real-life situations.

School was so lame and a waste of time.

~ihkny

Well, it's pretty much common knowledge that the American schooling system is behind most other countries. While watching the presidential debates, though, I heard mention that the American educational system receives among the highest amount of money than other countries. So, why is it that our education system receives all this money yet we are still rated as one of the lowest in quality? It's crazy.

I have to agree with what McCain said. Our system doesn't need any more money. Apparently, it's receiving enough already. What needs to happen is completely change the system and how it's run. That's where our problem lies. But I don't think the government should be the one to do the renovation. It should be done by actual educators in the system that would know where the strengths and weaknesses are. And it probably wouldn't hurt to take some tips from some of these other countries like Japan.

Of course, taking on a project like this would take years to do. And it might get worse before it gets better as things change and people get used to it. However, I think it would be for the best in the long run.

What you are talking about Laura is more of a State run educational system and less of a Federal Government run educational system. While I agree with this on the whole I see the problem.

The individual States are broke, or they are all claiming to be broke, therefore, they can't fund badly needed renovations on dilapidated school buildings, or feed free breakfasts to elementary school children. They don't have updated technology. The power needs to shift back to when teachers had more control over their lesson plans and classrooms. There is too much involvement from the STate Board of Educators and the Federal Government telling each state what the minimum standards are and how they should teach them.

Does anyone else remember when teachers stepped out of the box to reach their kids? Teachers know what the issues are with their kids and if given a little bit of freedom to actually teach instead of worrying about keeping their jobs or being mandated to go back to college and get more education, our kids would get taught.

I remember exactly what it was like. For 18 years of my life, I watched my father go outside the box, behind the box, and all around the box. That man knew how to reach kids that noone ever would lift a finger to help. My father would spend as much time as necessary to ensure that every kid got "IT". He was one of the few that didn't worry what the administration thought. My hat is off to educators around the world! For all of you that think teachers are evil, you will thank them eventually.

I'm in a bit of a mood about this topic and found it ironic that it just happened to be on my msn homepage. Homework: How do you guys feel about it? I found THIS article and it talks about parents who are making changes in their children's schools in regards to homework policies. Basically the parents are fed up with the amount of homework their children are getting and have been proactive in getting the amount reduced significantly.
My son has two pages of math and a reading story everyday. He also needs to do some independent spelling because the teacher doesn't require him to write down 'study spelling' every night. There are days when this is a struggle and days when it seems very simple. My issue comes when they add on other projects or subjects and still expect the daily math and reading stuff to come back to them totally completed. Does anyone else have issues with homework from your child's school?

I tend to agree with Amanda. My son is in 3rd grade and (usually) has math, spelling and reading to do, with the occasional extra project. Normally, I wouldn't complain, since this seems to be somewhat manageable, but it seems that recently all his homework stays in his homework folder, which indicates to me that it's not even being checked! If the teacher isn't going to take up the homework, why should he (and I) stress over making sure that it's done?!

I will say that they have a book report project due, and have not had any spelling homework while this is going on.

I do not see the point of having homework for the sake of homework. If it's reinforcing what is being taught in class, then I'm ok with it. However, if it's to get things done that aren't being done in class, then there is something wrong with the teacher's planning and time management skills!

I think was created to torture us, at least our brains. No, I'm kidding, but the homework factor is ridiculous. I am in high school and homework is almost always part of my daily routine. I usually have 3 hours of homework a night because honors classes aren't limited to the amount of homework they can give.

I think our county's policy is that the amount of homework allowed to be given each night is 15 min. multiplied by your grade or age. Either way, most people have more than that. It's dumb, and most of the time, it's just the same thing we did in school except more of it. It's just gives us more work in the evenings, and a lot of times, they don't seem to register that most older students have after-school activities that don't end until usually 6 pm. During the regular school year, I'm booked with stuff.

Back with what they were saying about the school system, ours is terrible. We have one high school in the whole area which houses 1400 students. The local middle school was in too bad of shape, so they now put 300 students more up with us, and then another middle school is so bad, 200 more might be coming! We don't have enough money to have adequate learning centers, and I think it's time someone else takes charge. But the state won't do anything. It's crazy.

I believe that in some schools, a student MUST be trendy to be accepted. If a boy is wearing vneck shirts with short shorts, they will be looked down upon. Although they should be judged by who they are and not by what they wear, this just isn't the case.

I completely disagree with cutting down homework. Elementary school kids get out of school around here at like...2:30 or something. It's obscenely early. I know it's because kids of that age really can't pay attention or sit still for that long, but they have ample amounts of time to get their work done. I got my work done. And while I hated it, it was just part of school.

Yes. Let's reduce homework so that our children have less practice and less comprehension therefore making them...more successful? I don't think so.

Now, I don't have kids (and I definitely shouldn't!!) but I think parents are just getting lazy. Please do not think that I am pointing fingers. It is my belief that even though the homework stay in the folder, it is a parent's job to make sure that their child is practicing and comprehending the work that their child is doing in school. Plus, I think it is silly for them to reduce homework now, because those poor kids are going to hit high school, think the load is ridiculous, and then want to not do their homework, complain about it and get bad grades. I think the parents and the students need to suck it up. Quit taking the easy way out. Education is the single most important thing that a child can have right now. I would rather have my child have homework than be learning next to nothing. I can help my child and bond with them in that sense. There's more than just math to learn when kids have to pick up the responsibilities of their work.

I am not saying I disagree with you on some aspects. But I never had much homework until I started high school. Now, I have loads of it. I think for students who are headed down the road towards honors courses should be trained in getting more homework from a younger age, that way they're not as overloaded and overwhelmed like I was, along with many of my friends. The high school here gets out at 3:30, and we are a very rural area, and most students don't get home until at least 4:30ish. It just makes the evening more difficult, in my opinion.

Hmm. I think it does depend sometimes on what classes you're taking, especially in high school. Homework loads in high school can get ridiculous because teachers like to give you obnoxious amounts of work. But now that I'm in college, I appreciate that. What happens in college is all your tests and all your exams are all at the same time. I don't even mean final exams, but all the little exams that I've had throughout the semester, somehow they're all within the same week or two. So kids have to learn how to manage their time and learn how to cope with having a big work load.

In high school, we got off at 3:20 (freshman-junior) and since I had to ride the bus home, I didn't get back until about 3:50. Senior year, we got out at 3:15 and I got home much earlier, at like 3:35. Senior year I had more time, but I also had less work because I had taken all my necessary classes--give or take a few. However, unless high school kids are going to bed at 9, which I know they're not, then 3 hours of homework should be no big deal. A kid would get done at about 7:30, and if they stay up till midnight like most high school kids do, that's still 4 1/2 hours to...be on VTM. Now that seems fine to me. The only way I feel like a student could get cramped is if they were doing sports or other things. I was in band, so I know how that is, but I could still manage my time. Schoolwork is a part of school, and college will be HUGELY overwhelming to those who don't get used to it now.

It was for me.

I agree. I am involved in after-school activities which last until about 6. I participate in the theatre program, so when we have dress rehearsal or show nights, I don't get home until about 8:30 or 11:30. That's little time for me to do homework without being exhausted the next day. Most over achievers are involved in these kinds of activities. It's not that I don't need these courses. Believe me, I was involved in our Gifted Program until I entered high school and I still lose attention in some of my classes because they bore me to death. I need the extra work because I get done so fast and my attention span only holds so long, but I've learned to control it.

I do usually stay up. But even if I don't I'm still tired. IT just is the odd way I am. College sort of scares me, though. I'm afraid that I'll not be able to keep up. My mother is going back to school right now, and she complains about the work all the time. I just hope to be able to have the one-on-one teacher/student relationship I need because sometimes, certain subjects just go *whoosh* straight over my head.

Ha, your schedule sounds almost exactly like mine. In the fall I had marching band that lasted till about 6. Then in the Spring I would do theatre (tech...but it still took up a few weeks) and sometimes I wouldn't get home until very late. It wasn't too bad during senior year cause I wasn't really doing anything, but the rest of the years and especially junior year it took a toll. I think my average sleep a night was about 5 hours, if that. So it was pretty exhausting. However...I do admit that I generally didn't start any homework until very late cause I was too busy doing things on the computer!

I'm the same way about sleep. Some nights I would be like HECK YES, I'm going to be early. Then I would get up and be all akgkadngjknag I'M TIRED. College...yeah, it's definitely not high school. I really had to change my study habits. That translates to I actually had to start studying to get a good grade, unlike in high school. I never studied in high school, got good grades. That doesn't work in college.... About the class size, it definitely depends on which college you go to. My friend goes to a college where the biggest classes are maybe in the low 100s, but those are Gen Ed classes. Otherwise they're about 65 people. But at my college, our Gen Ed classes can reach up to 320 (my class) and be as low as 15. But unfortunately, there's not really a teacher-student bond like there was in high school. Maybe a little bit in the smaller classes, but I just don't feel a real connection to any of my professors. They just seem a lot less personable to me.

Out of public, private, and homeschooling, which do you think had a greater positive impact on a child? In what ways?

I think any kind of schooling is great for a child. i went to public school for my elementary years and right now I am currently going to a private school and it is really the same, except in my public school we got to wear whatever we want and we were much more rowdy. the people in my private school now are very well-informed and very quiet at all times. also they turned out to be very smart. i'd had no idea they were that well-read. i have never experienced homeschooling but I have a cousin that currently is homeschooled, and he is very smart too and well-behaved. everything turned out mostly the same to me.

Out of public, private, and homeschooling, which do you think had a greater positive impact on a child? In what ways?


I've been to both public and private schools. The difference I trace between those two is the certainty they offer. In Greece, there are times where public schools go on a strike (either the teachers or the students), which means less classes for us, and less knowledge, which can be crucial during our final year. This never happens in private schools, and thus, you know that you won't lose a single class. Plus, there are no drugs, bullying, etc in private schools. At least, not in mine. Everything was strictly controled, and they even had cameras outside of the building so that they could monitor who comes and who goes, just in case something happened. This is the biggest differnce between the two. Good teachers and bad teachers can be found in both. So, basically, you choose private school to feel more secure.

As for homeschooling, I find many advantages in it. There is a personal relationship between the tutor and the student, the tutor can find where the student lacks skills, and help him/her get over their problems, and in general, it is great for a student with many weaknesses. However, the element of ones socialization is equally important to the knowledge they gain. I can see how a famous actor would need homeschooling, but a normal child misses a lot. School helps us in many levels, and the older you get, the harder it is for you to change. Your early childhood forms you, and so does school.