yes I agree on that point..it doesnt really change him as DD or the plot to be honest...just the fact that I already mentioned maybe...but otherwise DD stays DD and the plot is as it was...I dont know but as I have imagined him and McGonagall and a few others always asexual it just shows that they arent actually and that there is more to their character...

QUOTE

I really do believe that the topic about Dumbledore being gay should now be put to bed. The character as written has so much more depth than this and so keep harping on about it is detracting from other issues that arose within the seven books

Perhaps I didn't make myself clear on this point. I am getting far too many 'anti-gay' feelings from comments in this thread and so I am putting a stop to the discussion on his sexuality.

Although it is not strictly written in the rules that being opposed to a person sexuality is not allowed, it is against the rules to insult the posts and opinions of others. Also, coming across as a homophobe can be deemed as offensive to some members of this site.

That said, let's get this thread back on track. What other hidden aspects were there to Dumbledores life? Why no mention of his family until book 7?

If I have to come in here to to steer the topic away from Dumbledore being gay and the negative feelings about it again, I will have no option but to delete the posts made by those members and they will be placed on Moderator Preview.

Most probably because she didn't want to give too much away. It was very important to the plot to have his family hidden in the background, there is a quote about this, I cannot precisely remember where it is something to the effect of, "Dumbledore's family would be a profitable line of inquiry.", there was more DD in this book than I had ever imagined, I thought he would come back in DH in some way or another to give Harry guidance, but not in the way he did.

DD being gay is useless trivia. There is nothing in the text that lead one way or another.
Jo decided at some point that he was gay, who cares.

The important point about Albus is like Tom Riddle he couldn't handle power, but unlike Riddle he could walk away from power. That took real guts.

i didn't NEVER EVER think that all that happened in dumbledore's past.
i thought it was very creative, and it made me squirm in my seat (:

I think of Mr. Teatime everytime I see the word Grindelwald.


Apart from the weirdy eye, o'course.
*cough*

Mod Note: Could I remind members posting in this or any other discussion thread on the forums, that one liner and short posts are not permitted. You must have at least 2 full lines of text without smilies and quotes from other members.

If you have questions feel free to send me an Owl

Thanks etphonehome
Forums Moderator

I enjoyed looking into Dumbledore's past because it showed that he was not a perfect person like so many people thought that he was. I really like how when Harry died that he found Dumbledore in a place like kings cross. I knew that Dumbledore would come back but I had no idea how. When he and Harry where talking it explained a lot about how Dumbledore reacted and how he responded to the things that Harry went through, because he also lost things and his dreams were shattered. In the begging I just thought that Dumbledore was off his rockers, but turns out that there is a lot more to Albus Dumbledore than I thought, which is a good thing.

I agree, there was more to him than I could have ever imagined. I was somewhat surprised to find out that Dumbledore had orchestrated Harry's death perfectly, so that there was no way for him to know until the very last moment. I feel bad for Snape though , it wasn't fair that he ended up preparing the boy that he tried tirelessly to protect.

What other hidden aspects were there to Dumbledores life? Why no mention of his family until book 7?

Dumbledore’s past is not crucial in the life of Harry until book 7 or if his past was revealed early on in the book it would ruin the mystery of the entire series. It was mentioned only when Harry was searching and wanting to know more about Dumbledore and we are reading the book almost entirely from the point of view of Harry.

Dumbledore's secrets are weird, really weird... I mean he was always blaming the Dursley's for the way they treated Harry for being a wizard, but he was planning to do almost the same thing to muggles... What would he win out of conquering the muggles?? I don't quite realise.

And what about the battle between him and Grindelwald? I would have liked to read more abot it. Dumbledore's life raised even more questions, if possible, and JK haven't answered a lot of them

omg is dd gay seriously i didnt know that haha funny lol well i loved the hole dd life story about his brother and crazy sister and stuff i thort that it was good

I really want to still like Dumbledore after reading DH! I guess in a way I kind of still do because he kind of redeemed himself in the very end...But I don't like him as much as I did before reading DH. I feel like he really betrayed Harry and he's not the hero I thought he was. Oh well, I guess everyone makes mistakes....Anyway I am absolutely DYING to know who killed Ariana?!

Dumbledore, as I have read these previous posts has been described as a traitor, a homosexual, and a heartbreaker. However, if you follow this series and dig deeper than the initial feelings that come to you, one will realize who Dumbledore really is.

Dumbledore, is the man that everyone thought he was; a semilunatic, ingenious, old, and charming headmaster. He is amazingly gifted at being a wizard and everything discovered about him in DH does not change that.

Referencing the opinion that DD is a traitor to Harry; I find that a bit of a stretch. The fact that he had that past is what made him into the man he is today. You see, he had his wild visions with Grindlewald that would advance the wizarding population and ultimately help the greater goal. After the struggle that killed his sister he started to become the Dumbledore that we know today, as an old headmaster. Yet how can we call him a traitor for one, having different opinions for two months when he was fresh out of Hogwarts (so 100+ years ago), and two allowing those ideas to eventually turn him into the man who would challenege Harry, teach Harry, prepare Harry for his ultimate journey/sacrifice, and love Harry? We can't. DD is by no means a traitor to Harry or anybody, in fact the only person he was a traitor to was Grindlewald; for DD never followed the dreams both of them planned to fulfill. DD's relationship with Harry is the same as it ever was, if you want proof, look at the way he interacts with Harry at King's Cross and in the Headmaster's office after Voldemort's defeat (and in Harry's youngest son's name). Harry and DD still ahve the same relationship as they always ahve.

JKR stated at one point that "DD was not gay, he is just a character that happens to be gay." The homosexuality of DD is about as relevant to the series as Fabian Prewett. Both interesting aspects, yet in the big picture not very important. DD could've been straight, married, and be the proud father of six, and still would have followed his heart and fight against Voldemort. I think I will follow JKR on this one and stick with her description of DD.

As for DD being a heartbreaker...heck yeah he is. He is extremely likeable and unfortunately for the reader, the relationship between DD and Harry is the same between DD and yourself. One always wants to turn to DD, for support and advice. When DD is gone you can feel lost, crushed, confused. DD will always be an extraordinary character that people will fall in love with and be crushed when they find that he passes just one year too early.

First of all...I want to read "The Life and Lies of Albus Dumbledore".

The things we learn about his past just prove that he's human...everyone has good and bad thoughts even Harry. When Dumbledore was young he got a little ahead of himself. But I think it says a lot that he straightened up. Grindewald didn't. And Dumbledore ended up fighting him...I think to try and make things right from the past. My feelings of Dumbledore haven't changed...I still love the character. He did so much good in the wizarding world. By the way...reading the books I had no idea that he was supposed to be gay. If JKR wanted him gay...maybe she should have hinted...if she did I didn't get it .

As for letting Harry figure out things himself...I don't think he did. He told Harry what he needed to know before Dumbledore died. Harry had a lot of help. He told Ron and Hermione everything...Hermione kept him look for horcuxes instead of hallows..Snape lured him to the sword...Griphook helped them get the cup of Hufflepuff...Ron had the diluminator...Hermione the Book of Beetle the Bard (which I would LOVE to have). Dumbledore left the trio a trail and they followed it. Harry had to do it on his own...or else I don't think the finale result would have been the same.

hey dag i really dont like the histroy of albus dambledore
the thing is why to make such a perfect impression of albas with the long and wasted history which ruins the image of dambledore completly

I think to really understand Dumbldore we eed to look at his history more. It would explain a lot of things. It would be interesting to compare his life to Harry's life (as a teenager) and see what they were like. If you think about it, both f them have had parents die, both of them were outsiders, but both of them turned out to be heroes.

I was pleased by the direction the Deathly Hallows took in regards to Dumbledore's character I feel that it opened up Harry's perception of his hero, that it is okay to have a hero, but to understand they have flaws too. It is reflective of our society today and the idea that people are placed on pedastals and when they fall, people turn their backs on them instead of realizing they are human too. Harry's growth over seven years was tremendous and discovering the flaws in Dumbledore allowed him to grow more as a person and see that with the perfection and imperfections combined a hero can still be made.

I will say though that the one part of Skeeter's book that upset me a little was Dumbledore's reflection and acceptance at first of the "pure blood" mentality, and I know that he was young and idealistic, but I can't pretend it didn't tarnish my opinion of him slightly. Though he did redeem himself over the course of time and all the things he pushed for. It was sad that the way he had to learn his faults was through the death of his sister and the estrangement with his brother.

The history of Dumbledore does make him more human in the eyes of us readers but I was for one really put off that we heard most of the tidbits from Rita Skeeter. Last I knew she was still a bug somewhere and maybe she should have stayed that way. I wish there could have been some other source because I hated her in GoF and I hate her now. That said, I think that it is not suprising to me that Dumbledore had the feelings that he did for muggles, I mean look at what they did to his family, especially his sister. I think it was very mature of him to grow up and realize that that was an isolated incident of people who were ignorant and cruel. That shows a growth in intellect and maturity. As for the gay thing, if JKR didn't talk about it I wouldn't have known or care....although no biggie for me I still don't care. This is fiction after all.

Dumbledore is certainly a character who stirs up strong reactions! (by the way I really like Harry James Potter's posting, above, which I read after I wrote this.)

Interesting ideas here, and here are my main observations:

Dumbledore is human and Rowling's brilliant writing is precisely brilliant because her main characters are human. From Harry to Mrs. Weasley we see their weak moments, their faults and preferences, bad choices, helpful moments, desires and fears. This is the human condition. Dumbledore is a human character and she has drawn them all so well.

Dumbeldore's character - In stories when a character takes on a Christ-like role, there is a formal name for it which I can't remember. I think many readers have confused Dumbledore with this role. For example in LOTR, Gandalf takes on this role, and Aragorn to a lesser extent (read the paragraph just after they honor him at the Field of Cormallon. 'Ancient of Days'. Sends shivers up my spine!) In Narnia, it is Aslan whose role is actually Christ,( and you won't find anything he says or does that Jesus wouldn't.) The point is, don't confuse Dumbledore in this role because it's not what his character is. If there is any character that takes on this greater good for all, laying down life for friend, it is Harry, but even with it's subtle Christian undertones, this is not the kind of overtly redemptive book Rowling is writing, really, although the references are beautifully done. Just because DD looks like Gandalf a bit, they're not interchangeable! I think the expectation has created some confusion. Might as well confuse him with Magneto and come up with the same misleading expectations!

DD youthful misconceptions - it is these mistakes he made in his youth that have built his character. Instead of agonizing that this hero had such feet of clay, which I don't believe anyway, the point is that these very mistakes caused him to choose the path he was on by the time we meet him. It's the whole remorse idea, that is discussed in another thread. Anyway, one's choices do make one's character. If he still believed all that nonsense about might is right, he would indeed have been more powerful and terrible that Voldemort. ( Olivander might have been a fascinated fan, maybe!!)

DD Motives - I notice several people going on about DD manipulating Harry for his own purposes. What purposes? Saving the world? And as one writer pointed out, DD was under no obligation to do so. But he saw what needed to be done and did his best to bring it about. To misquote: With great intelligence comes great responsibility... ha ha, great line, overdone though!
It's tiny bit like the Star Trek episode where Kirk realizes the woman he has fallen in love with must die or else Hitler will rise to greater power in peace talks with Britain and the US, so she has to die, and he can't save her. He doesn't kill her, but he can't save her. This has to happen.

Rowling outing DD - there is far too great a reaction to this, and far too much interest in something which is irrelevant. It has as much relevance to his character development as if she has revealed DD plays the cello. I overheard a very young friend speculating who DD had 'done it' with, which I found horrifying, not only because a 9 year old was calmly speculating on a general subject which rightly is none of his business, but more or the realiaztion that there is no general concept of people having desires but not having them fulfilled, out of either lack of opportunity or self-discipline. I'm glads Rowling apoligised for this information - it was not terribly helpful!! Made sense, but not helpful. TMI!

Dumbledore's age - this is an interesting exercise in time, partly I think because I am so bad at math that it gives me an extra challenge! I found it interesting that Aunt Muriel keeps going on about how she's 107, so I figured that number was significant. If Muriel overheard her mother talking about Ariana's peculiar death when Muriel was 7, then that puts DD at 19-ish when his sister dies.

James and Lily are two years older than me (same as Lady Di I just realized!, whose wedding I watched here in Canada, getting up at 5:00 am and going to a friend's for a very early breakfast/tea while we all watched the live broadcast before we went to work! A great party!) This makes DD death in 1996.

So if Muriel is 107 in 96, then DD was 19 in 1890. This is starting to be very confusing, and reminding me of horrible math word problems, so I am going to give in to the desire to write 'and so if DD is travelling at 3o km/hr and Trelawney is only doing 26km/hr, and they leave in opposite directions at the same time, who will get there first?)

Conclusion: Was DD born in 1867? Was he 143 at his death? Or has Rowling revealed this date/age somewhere else, that I have missed?

Things Going Wrong - a few people were put out that things went wrong. This is one of the very believable bits that makes the story real. Of course things went wrong! Not only is it plot, but it shows how no one can control things. The extreme exception is Chaos Theory in Jurassic, Park, (which is a great read and much better that the movie,which is still okay.) Anyway, the things going wrong, and both LV and DD's plans going awry is what makes things tick along. Who could have seen the Draco's wand would be so important? Especially when he himself is such a weak character.

Last But Not Least- there was some discontent that DD did not give Harry some great revelation, or that Harry did not have some Great Inner Power Revealed At Last to show why he did so well, etc. Like "Harry, yes, you really are the true son of Kal-El/Dumbeldore /Spiderman/James Bond/Weird Al/John Lennon" or some such nonsense. Finding out how strong and brave and scared you are is the greatest thing we have in us, and that Harry found this out, and took us all along with him, is marvelous and astounding. This will make more sense over time!( Ha - such a condescending statement, but true)

(Thanks!!! - This is a great venue for those of us who like to write!! A lovely indulgence when there is a little pocket of time to wheedle away and one can't get out of the house!)

Dumbledore is/was always one of my favourite characters. His reputation wasn't tarnished in any way with his back story being revealled in Deathly Hallows, nor with JKR's revallations at Carnegie Hall.

If she were to write The Life and Lives of Albus Dumbledore, I'm sure that I would find it utterley facsinating.

I have really enjoyed reading your post sdoane. I particularly like this statement....



condescending or not, I think it's a pretty profound thing to say. It sums up the essence of JKR's writing beautifully. Thanks for giving me something to read in...how did you say it...my little pocket of time in which I needed something to wheedle it away

Reading about Dumbledores teenage years was fascinating.

Like Harry I never thought about Dumbledore as a teenager, he in my mind sprung into being a fully matured teacher at Hogwarts school.

Dumbledore has had as many horrors in his life than Harry has had in his. Makes me wonder if Dumbledore would be affected by dementors in the same way Harry was.

As said in previous replies it made Dumbledore into the man he went onto become.

This was what I think made Dumbledore look for the good in everyone and give them second chances to redeem themselves.

It is such a pity he did not seem to have forgiven himself and Harry had to reassure him in the Kings Cross Scene.

Dumbledore and Harrys life seem to be just as closely entwined as what Harry and Voldermorts life was.

But like Harry said Hollows not Horcruxes.

My views about Dumbledore would probably be what many share. It is unfair to call Dumbledore names (the way the Skeeter woman did ) It is hard, of course, to accept that he did these things in the past because we have seen the wise DD from the first book. However, we need to accept the reality. He is not a superhero. Come on! We all have better understanding and common sense than Rita Skeeter to call Dumbledore anything. Anybody in their youth make mistakes. Harry's father and his friends were good people (except Wormtail). Yet, in the fifth book, when Harry goes into the pensieve, he finds that his father had jinxed Snape just like that and Remus says that he was young when he did that. I think thats what JKR tries to tell us that everyone makes mistakes. Dumbledore was a very gifted wizard but still a human being. Unlike LV, he learned from his mistakes and became what we saw. The remorse, ability to learn from mistakes, not repeating it, makes him a great wizard and not evil. And there lies the difference between DD and LV. As he says "it is our choice that shows what we are, far more than abilities."

Dumbledore is one of my favourite characters in the series. The spells he uses are amazing and I wish he had more to tell in Deathly Hallows. The way he died was sad though, because he was begging Snape to spare him (I know it was planned, but at the time I was sad).

The book Rita wrote was foul, I thought, it didn't aknowledge much about Dumbledore, just what mistakes he made in the past. I never liked Rita Skeeter and to be honest hoped she was killed off in Deathly Hallows.

DD was my favorite charecter. Now not so. First he was a trator, he was out there for himself (and not for others), he didn't care for his sister, and ended up as a Homosexual.

Some interesting ideas have been touched upon here. I'd like to comment on what you say, HGrh fan lover. First, I think it's a pity that your affection for Dumbledore have been influenced by what you've learnt about his pre-book life. But of course, you are fully entitled to such opinions.

I'd only like to point out that I don't think Dumbledore didn't care for his sister. Wasn't it his sister and the whole of his family together again he saw in the Mirror of Erised? And also, wasn't it the horrors of her death that he suffered from when he was drinking the potion in the cave at the end of HBP? I know that it's not said explicitly that he cared for her, but I believe that from the innuendos it can be concluded that Dumbledore cared indeed greatly for his sister and even more greatly mourned her death.

Of course, I may be wrong, as it's been some time since I went through my copy of DH for the last time, but still, it's the impression I got from reading it.

~Jana

Yes, I agree with Potions Mistress. Dumbledore never "not cared" for his sister. He just became blinded by his goals and Grindlewald that he forgot his duties as an older brother. Based on the Mirror of Erised, his visions in the cave, and the talks with Harry. It is clear that Dumbledore felt terrible about the neglection of his little sister and wished he could take it back. This is not an emotion that is felt by one who cares; Dumbledore cared very much, he was just a little late in showing it.

As for Dumbledore being a traitor...to whom was he a traitor to? Did he believe in a pure-blood wizard dominating society at one point in time, yes, but once Grindlewald went off the wall and Dumbledore's sister died; he felt that urge no more. In his teens he was out there for himself but it seems like a different way than most people think. Dumbledore was out there for his beliefs and what, he thought at the time, was best for the wizarding community. So in that sense he was out there advocating what he thoguht was best, not just for himself. Then he shifted views and advocated equality and peace. This is no different from his previous advocations except for a different side. Both times he is doing what he believes is best for the wizarding world.

JKR did state that he was a homosexual but in reality was more neutral on sexual feelings. He wasn't openly gay or anything like that, he just never felt attracted to women. But it's your choice to hate him due to his sexuality.

Thank you for your opinion and backing me up, Harry James Potter.

As for Dumbledore's traitor status, I can see why some people may perceive him like that. At a certain point in his life he really might have seemed a traitor because of the ideology he believed in, but I think what matters the most is that he realized soon enough that this was not the path he wanted to follow. And this is what should count when one judges his character. Also, what in the final effect speaks for him not being a traitor is that he was strong enough to gather the courage to duel Grindelwald himself.

And seeing that Grindelwald was obviously the love of Dumbledore's life, it becomes clear how hard this decision was for Dumbledore and how much he believed in the good, that he was even able to fight a beloved person for that.

I find it peculiar that you say his sexual orientation leads you dislike him, may I ask why? Does this change his characterisation in anyway? Does it make the choices he made in through the books any different? Does it make him a bad person?

Personally, it changes nothing for me, it's a back story and for, all it explains is why past loves and marriage were never mentioned.

Why do you think he was a traitor? Because of his past ideals? He was young, we all make the wrong decisions in our lives and experience leads us to tread the right path in the end if we so choose.

As for you saying he didn't like his own sister, what leads you to believe this? Is it because he left her in the care of his brother to chase afetr his ideals? Yes he did do this, but he never stopped caring for her. She was the most cherished thing in his life and he never once stopped regretting or feeling guilty about how she died.

The real reson his sexuality upsett me is because little kids are not soppost to know that stuff(yet)and little kids read and see the Harry Potter series all the time, (not that there's anything wrong with it).
And as for his sister you are right he did care for her. That was his worst memory( potion+ he wanted the ring. So I'm now fine w/ with those but I still think he's a stuck up tratior.

Mod Edit: Could you please refrain from using netspeak on the forums, it is not allowed. w/ should say with. Thanks.

Thank you for answering etphonehome's question, HGrh fan lover. To address your two arguments, I would say that there's no general agreement on what and when kids should know. I think it all depends on the cultural context they come from and on what their parents deem appropriate for them at what time.

I, on the other hand, think that Dumbledore's character is a great example the parents can use while explaining to their kids the problems and harmfulness of prejudice. He was a great, brave and immensely knowledgeable man (even a role model for people like Harry) and I don't think his sexuality has had any effect on what he did and why he did it. In other words, is it really that important what sexual orientation one has?

As for your second argument about kids reading and watching HP series, I don't think there are any explicit hints to Dumbledore's sexuality throughout the series - be that in the books or in the movies. Which is one of the biggest arguments for people who don't agree with Dumbledore's sexuality: "It's only said by Ms. Rowling afterwards, but is there really any evidence of Dumbledore's homosexuality in the books?" In other words, I don't think kids will learn anything about homosexuality while reading or watching Harry Potter, unless their parents decide to be open with them and draw their attention to it.

~Jana

I agree Potions Mistress, just because JKR said Dumbledore is gay so many months after DH, doesn't mean that kids will learn anything about homosexuality from the series. That said, why are kids not supposed to know this stuff? My nephew is gay. That is the cousin of my 11 year old daughter. She asked why he never had a girlfriend, I told her. She accepted it. She was 7 at the time. It's no big deal, it's part of life and I think by explaining matters properley avoids misconceptions and prejudices later in life.

I still don't understand why you think he was a traitor, perhaps you could elaborate on that point?

Sorry to interrupt your discussion but personally i feel learning what we did from The Life and Lies of Albus Dumbledore actually made me like him more as a character.

Now i never thought in anyway Dumbledore has been boring and in fact he has often be one of my favourites but i have always wondered what Dumbledore did in his past and how he came to be the great Wizard that we have always seen him as.

It makes the fact that he is such a noticeable Wizard more believable as we now know what his motivation was and how he developed into the Wizard that Harry saw him as.

Just expressing my opinions

James

Dumbledore will remain one of my favourite characters of the series. There was just something about him that made him likeable. The way he defended Harry and let
him test his own powers and limits. I wish the JKR would write about the battle between
DD and Grindlewald more as i believe it would have been epic to imagine as it is said to be
one of the best duels of all time especially if Grindelwald had the elder wand. RIP DD

Yes, I am still agreeing with Potions Mistress and etphonehome.

I'm glad that you have dropped the whole, "Dumbledore didn't like his sister case" because on the whole that was never true. As for when it is permitable to tell your children about homosexuality...there is no right or wrong time. That is all left up to the individual's parents to decide. Since parents are responsible for the upbringing of their child/children; that also makes them have the capability of telling their children what they want, when they want.

I used to have a gay couple as my next-door neighbors. They were, in my opinion, the nicest guys I've ever met. They adopted three children from an orphange that takes kids away from their abusive parents. This gay couple took them in and provided a much better childhood than their original parents. These children, when adopted, were from the ages of 2-7. They found out right then and there, and were completely fine with it. However, not only were they fine with it, but so were all of the neighbors and friends of the couple. That not only says there is no right or wrong time, but that most people agree with this idea.

Another point on the Harry Potter series and how tons of kids read it all the time. I agree with you that there is no problem whatsoever about that. But also, you've got to remember it is a choice. No one is forcing them to read those books and they choose to. This then makes those readers responsible for any knowledge they gain from reading those books. So if they somehow picked up that Dumbledore was gay, and figured out what that means. Then that's fine, but they are responsible for that and mustn't get upset at the series or JKR.

And I also would like to agree with etphonehome and incquire about why DD was a traitor...if you could please elaborate on that point, it would be much appreciated.

The truth of the matter when I first heard that Dumbledore was gay was, ok? I assumed that there would have been more to it, but after hearing that, not one bit did it change my mind about him. Dumbeldore was still the man that I thought he was after I closed the Deatgly Hallows book & hearing that he was gay had no affect what so ever. & persoanlly if that influences peoples thoughts on him then most unfortunate for you.

As for kids & sexuality. There really shouldn't be a problem. First off his sexuality is not mentioned in the book, so that shouldn't be a problem. Second off if they heard it then like any curious child they would ask quesition. & if asking the right person they would say that it shouldn't matter. & if the child decides not to read the series for that then that's there decision. But you can't say that it isn't a good idea.

okay i checked the master list and i couldnt find this thread but by all mean merge it if it needs merging

when dumbledore said some thing to harry along the lines of i was scared of what he (grindlewald) could do to me, more than magically

i stopped feeling angry that DD had done all the greater good stuff and realised he did it for love he always said love was beyond magic and that is what he refers to here

i think that the idea of homosexuality could have been explored more but i think that would have spoilt this moment of realisation
and rowling my have been hounded too
but honestly DD had a huge fanbase before hand he was gay then he wasnt a different person, so why should parents disliike their kids knowing about this stuff now just because this information arose?

any non-supportes out there of any homosexual couples not just these two i have several words for you

some people are gay- get over it

Hmm.... The whole Dumbledore is gay, to me just came across as some little freebie thing. I cant explain it. What is the point of saying he is gay? What does it add? I feel there was no point to it! Sorry but i dont. Im guessing it was to add more attention to the books. im thinking if she had announced it before. it could have influenced the sale of her books. but i doubt that it would have the least bit.

I always appreciated the kindness and the sacrifices that Dumbledore was willng to do for harry. I think the world should be more like dumbledore. Its funny cus i never suspected that he was intended to be gay. You dont really think about that when reading the harry potter books. Well i didnt. The books always took me to a different world i didnt think about the realities of my world when i read them. That is why i love the books so much.

But to be honest hearing that j.k. rowling made him gay doesnt change my appreciation of the books or him as a character. Its a book. Oh well. I love harry potter books no matter what....

I love Dumbledore. He was just strayed and was blinded by his infatuation with Gellert. He made a mistake (not unlike Snape) and dedicated the rest of his life to redem himself. I think that is another reason as to why he trusted and helped Snape to redem himself; they were very similar. Of course DD loved his family, he's the one always going on about love, ay? I read somewhere that Rowling state's Dumbledore's bogart is the corpse of Ariana. And, like Harry he saw his family in the mirror. I was thinking also, that Dumbledore couldn't get Harry himself from GH because it was too painful for him.

Yea i actually liked The Life and Lies of Albus Dumbledore . It made him actually seem human. He always had this sense of awe because he was so powerful and always right. I really hated how it made him seem like he hated Ariana though he just wanted togo on to be the greatest wizard ever and conquer death.

The Lord Sirius has Spoken

Well AD is great no mather what his homosexuality should never make you think he is bad or whatever you think..He was and will be the greatest wizard of all times.And DD being homosexual is brought up even before the Deathly Hallows So dont missjudge him or say anything bad about him

When I read the books I never even thought about what kind of sexuality Dumbledore had! It wasn't really important to me. So afterwards when I heard he was gay, I just thought... Ok! I dod not really matter to me. I stil think Dumbledore is a great character no matter how gay or straight he is!

And as pointed out before, there is nothing in the books saying that he is gay so parents doesn't have to "worry" about kids reading about that!

I think it was great to find out more about Dumbledore, in DH! Not necessarily the way Rita Skeeter thought was great, but you know... there's always been something missing, I only realized after reading DH that I really wanted to find out more about DD. We'd had hints and glimpses as his past life (note the broken nose that he never bothered to fix) and I should have figured we would get more. I guess I just was never as analytical and obsessed as I am now. When you start discussing stuff, it kind of opens your eyes and makes you wonder about alot more while you're reading. But anyway, I find Dumbledore's past fascinating, I dont know why, I just do. I don't mean he had a good past, it's really terrible, actually, but what I mean is that it was interesting to read. As for him being gay, I don't care. It doesn't change the way I see him, I barely remember it when I see/read about him.

I see Dumbeldore being gay as irrelevant to the series. JKR should not have mentioned that at all. Thus, his sexual orientation has not caused me to lose respect for his character but rather for JKR. But that's a whole other topic.

Dumbeldore is still a great character, but no longer the perfect wizard that I once saw him to be. He was like the 'god' of the Harry Potter series. Nothing ever got too far out of hand as long as he was there. He always seemed to have control and he was feared greatly by Lord Voldemort. Hearing about his past, however, reduced his status of someone almost 'god-like' to merely a man. Not many people have a problem with that, but for me, it hurt slightly. It's like feeling as if you knew a person all along only to realize that you never truly knew him/her.

Dumbldore's past definately was troubled. I never could have guessed anything that we were told about him in DH. I wouldn't say that he is a traitor but I stiill can't help from feeling a little betrayed. For the Greater good. I never expected wise old Dumbledore to believe such a crazy thing but I guess he wasn't always as wise. The entire storyline between him and Grindewald was great, but as always, I still sort of expected more.

Although slightly offended in Dumbldore's true character, it is very appealing to know that he made mistakes yet rose above them, never allowing too much power to tempt him back to his old ways. His sister's death was the turning point in his life which made him into the great man and wizard that he was. For all that, I say Kudos!

I loved how the whole idea of DD being a muggle hater as a child kind of tied into the story, he didnt like the idea of being held in secrecy so he was going to do something about it, until the fight which killed his sister and made DD realize what he was doing was wrong, and he spent the rest of his life trying to make up for it, by encouraging muggle protection acts and laws, and by defeating his old friend grindelwald and winning the elder wand.

I Think itd also be pretty cool if JKR tried to make a whole book called The Life and Lies of Albus Dumbledore, and made it like the whole HP series but through dumbledores angle, and if JKR also explained all about DD's life as a kid and stuff, she could make an entire new series.

I think it would help with all these people that are depressed about "the end of an era"

Dumbledore was always a great character!!!!! As for him being gay it doesn't bother me plus I don't think I had read most of the books at that point (I got a late start). My sister didn't want to believe it but she's fine with it now and I personally think it's great!!!! He has such an interesting pas I would love to read a whole book about him as long as it ISN'T the one by Rita Skeeter because yes his past was bad but I think she made things a lot worse then they actually were but she did keep them truthful. I was having some of the same reactions as Harry when he read the passages it was anger, rage, sorrow, and hurt . It was so amazing that someone who came from that background and caused so much pain could bring so much relief joy and feel so much love and joy. I believe that his past caused him so much pain that he never wanted anyone to feel the same way he didn't want anyone to feel it so by spreading love he was trying to prevent people feeling those same feelings. I want to know more about ONE of the two greatest headmasters Hogwarts has ever scene. He will be forevermore missed in my heart (even though he was just a character in a book).



P.S. In the interview when J.K.Rowling was asked if Dumbledore ever finds true love and she responds with the fact that Dumbledore is gay but in my opinion she didn't answer his/her question because you can be gay and still find true love Personally it's not for me but I have no problem with people who feel that way

Forgive me, but I've only read the first and last couple of pages, there's a lot to read, but I will get through it all. Promise! I've also just lost this post once, so I may miss some of the points I meant to make

Dumbledore was, I think, the perfect portrayal of the message the books (and he) seem to be trying to get across to the reader (and Harry); it is the choices and mistakes we make that ultimately shape who we become. Harry could easily have taken his anger and grief at his parents death, and they're betrayal by one they called "friend" and chanelled that into lashing out at everyone around him, much like Voldemort used his time in the orphanage and his treatment for being different and "strange" to turn his skills against others, for his own gain or mere amusement. Dumbledore, in the same way, initially used his childhood, especially the way the muggles treated his sister and channelled that into his "greater good" plan with Grindelwald, seeking dominion over muggles, perhaps for some sort of revenge. To make them experience what they inflicted upon his sister, or simply because he truly believed he was justified and right in his plan, blinded perhaps, by his hurt over his sister, as any human has the right to be.

Later, the death of his sister and the blame he put on himself for it, drove him on to protect and help the muggles, presumably so that something like that wouldn't happen again. His past mistakes, and the choices he made afterwards, shaped who Dumbledore would ultimately become - the only wizard Voldemort truly feared, where he could so easily have become an ally to Voldemort if his choices had been different.

The lies to Harry throughout the series were, I think, mostly necessary. Dumbledore never claimed to be perfect, or even as great as others said he was. In fact, he himself once told Harry something along the lines of, becuase he was so brilliant, his mistakes tended to have much larger repercussions than most people's. How right he was; his mistakes that lead up to his sister's death, lead up to... well, his sister's death and then his decision to go towards the side of good, rather than bad. It was perhaps only this decision (and through backtracking this mistake) that made it as difficult as it was for Voldemort to become as powerful as he did, although by the same train of thought, it would also have been this choice and mistake that lead to Harry's parents' deaths in the first place and the beginning of the prophecy. It's amazing to see just how far one choice can ripple outwards and just how many people it can affect, either for good or bad.

Supposing, just supposing, Dumbledore had made one more mistake in trusting Snape. Just imagine the kind of repercussions that could have had on the overall outcome. Sure, maybe nothing would have changed, but maybe, everything would have. Perhaps the whole thing would have been over a lot sooner, but I can't help but think that if it were, the outcome wouldn't have been good. Snape's loyalty to one or other side seemed to tip the balance significantly in favour of that side, especially given how far in the trust of both sides he was.

Overall though, I think Dumbledore did what he had to do throughout (at least during the time span of the seven books). He couldn't lead Harry by the hand, or he wouldn't have been strong enough or smart enough to work things out when Dumbledore wasn't around. Perhaps not brave enough, either, Gryffindor or not. He could have told Harry everything from the beginning, but again, that would have been leading him by the hand somewhat and really, could an eleven year old cope with or understand such a vast amount of knowledge of that kind? To know he was destined to kill or be killed and there was no way he could escape that destiny because of one catastropic event in his past that he couldn't really even remember beyond a green flash, a scream and a high-pitched laugh.

It seemed to me that Harry was drip feed information as he needed it and was mature enough to handle it, a smart decision on Dumbledore's part, I believe. I loved that the two of them got their chance to talk over everything in "King's Cross" too, it tied things up nicely and gave them both the closure they needed after such a sudden and heart-rending separation. It must have been terrible for Harry to watch his mentor being murdered by a man Dumbledore had trusted, without knowing what plans had been wrought in secret. Just the same, it must have been terrible for Dumbledore to go to his death having not explained everything to Harry.

I love the character of Dumbledore as a literary concept, particularly in this series. He seems to be the thing that ties everything together. On one side, we have Harry, this ultimate portrayal of goodness, a banner for witches and wizards to band around together. Then, on the other end of the spectrum, there's Voldemort, the ultimate evil, an image to fear above all other things and for power seekers to weak or scared to go looking for it on their own to fight alongside. Then there's Dumbledore, sat in between them. He's seen both sides, started out on the path to darkness, towards Voldemort, then turned back towards Harry's side of thing and goodness. He alone can truly understand both sides of things, the kust for power, the feelings of superiority and at the same time, the effects of love and compassion, and guilt, that can sway a person.

Everywhere in this series are opposites, Harry and Voldemort, Slytherin and Gryffindor, good and evil, lies and truth. Dumbledore brings them all together; he could so easily have been evil, he became good with time, he loved Harry in his own way, but probably respected the power Voldemort had to an extent, perhaps even evied it at times, he lied when he thought he needed to lie, but in the end saw to it that the truth came out somehow. He was the balance that tied the books, and the characters together.

Dumbledore may have been the greatest wizard of all time, but he was still just a man. And for that, I love him.

Hi folks
Havent been here for a while......
Thus, I may indeed have missed good discussions of this question: Why DD did not reappear when Harry used the stone?

As to recent posts, I agree with Rachel that DD's humanity really made the whole thing wrap up for me. I think his past--all-inclusive, including secrets revealed after the fact--is the condition of his greatness.

wow rachel_ 1989 I loved your post! I've never thought of Dumbledore as a middle way between Harry and Voldemort. And you make excellent points throughout the post that I couldn't have agreed more with!

As for this question: Why DD did not reappear when Harry used the stone?

I don't really know. Maybe because Harry was a bit frustrated with him at that moment. Feeling that he hadn't told Harry the truth. I think Harry felt a bit used by Dumbledore at that moment, and that he would rather have people around him that loved him and told him the truth.

I'm not sure about this either, I sort of agree that he felt somewhat abandoned by Dumbledore, but I also think that it may be more to do with him not wanting to disappoint Dumbledore by failing. Dumbledore died and passed on his mission to Harry and, at the time of using the stone, believed that he was going to die and fail in the misson, even though he, in a way, passed the mantle onto Neville by asking him to kill Nagini I still think he felt guilty for not being able to see things through himself.