You've got a point, and Hermione probably wouldn't have given Ginny advice concerning Harry, one of her best friends.

Another example is in GoF; when Viktor Krum asked Hermione to the Yule Ball, she wouldn't tell Harry or Ron about it, but she told Ginny. She also asked Ginny not to tell them either, and when Ron did ask, Ginny kept her word and refused to tell him. And in DH, when the Weasley family is gathered around Fred's body, we see Hermione comforting Ginny. We see the two of them laughing together as Mrs. Weasley tells a funny story about a love potion in PoA.

There are examples scattered here and there all across the series of Hermione and Ginny being good friends; true, Ginny doesn't hang around the Trio all the time, but she has her own circle of friends and she's a year behind the Trio in school, so she can't hang around them all the time.

Yes, Harry and Ron do seem to be Hermione's best friend, but I think all girls also need to be good friends with another girl. There are some things that would bother Hermione that she wouldn't be able to confide in Harry or Ron about.

Besides, Dumbledore's Widow, it is perfectly possible to be best friends with somebody who is two years older or younger than you. It's happened to me plenty of times. Two years isn't even a huge age gap. A lot of my really good friends are six or seven years older than me. And I'm also really good friends with my next-door neighbor, who is about fifty years older than me. Age gaps don't determine friendship.

I agree with what you say. I should have phrased it differently when I said that Ginny was a couple of years younger and a year behind Hermione because I am not at all saying that they aren't friends ... just not best friends. I also feel that Hermione is closer to Harry and Ron than to Ginny. I'm sure that in the Gryfindor dorm and while spending time at the Burrow, Hermione relates to Ginny as girls tend to do. (ditto for the guys in the boys dorm! )

I think everyone has provided more information about Hermione and Ginny than I could even think of...and that's why I'm participating in the HP re-read. I need a refresher!

About the Diary thing though, Ginny tells Riddle that he is the only one she could trust. (To be honest, on the trust issue, I think I could trust a book to not go off and tell other people things if I kept it in my possession. How would it tell?) But I think it's clear that Ginny had trust issues and possibly still does, so I don't think that she would tell anyone anything. And judging the looks on people's faces when her and Harry finally kissed, she wasn't telling anyone about her "new" (?) crush. Hermione must have known something because "Hermione was beaming" but everyone else was in shock...including best-friend-Ron. So after that terribly written paragraph, I do think that Hermione is one of the few people that Ginny confides in.

Haha, I think there would have been waaay to many hexes and jinxes if we had to watch Ginny to an excessive amount of magic. There was one time when I remember Ginny being cool-headed, and I believe it was in OotP. I was flipping through yesterday while looking for evidence that she's a good witch ( ) and she was talking to Harry about something...oh, there was the scene when they were in the library talking about something. I prefer her when she's cool. But since I can't give you a page number, I'll just shut up.

I wrote a long reply due to a complete misreading of what you said. Having re-read that she's a "good witch" and not the...other thing all of my original comments make no sense.


The change (or off page metamorphosis as vega nicely puts it) in Ginny is not so much the issue. The issue is that claims have been made of Ginny possessing certain characteristics (either as a result of puberty or not) which does not appear in the books. This may very well be accounted for off-page, but since that is something drawn from each individual, it's not something that can be critically examined or "proven" outside of one's personal opinion. The metamorphosis is just one example of Ginny's poor characterization on paper.

Ginny being a good witch (she is often characterized as an exceptional witch...ergo, worthy of being more than Harry's trophy) is another example of poor characterization. We are told by Slughorn that she is based on his observation of her bat-bogey hex...if anything, this is telling of another characteristic of Ginny, but these tricks don't lend as much weight to the claims made that she is perfectly suited for Harry due to her competence as a witch. Rather than showing us Ginny's skills, the author has to tell us that Ginny is of a certain quality. While that may still establish that characteristic, it's part of the poor literary characterization that Ginny faces.

...and cue the citations (but not from me, since I'm at work )

Mind you, I'm not a fan of Ginny, but she was really disappointing as a character, especially at the end of the series. Having inserted herself with Harry, it really distracted from the original focus of Harry and his story and I really wished she could have been better developed.

Glad to see the thread comes alive again,
Sad to have so little time to entertain.

Ginny's characterisation is an evidence how complex Jo Rowling's writing is. There are so many aspects to discover and rediscover even after all has been said and done.
Ginny is a good character to study, because Jo provides much more information about Ginny than most other characters. That keeps me coming to this thread.


This happened in her first year at Hogwarts. She was a new student, not knowing her classmates yet. Jo made sure we notice that Ginny had to ask her Dad to go back home to pick up the diary on their trip to the station. Thus, the diary was her first friend at Hogwarts and first "person" she could confide.
Does she have friends afterward? Obviously, yes. Harry noticed Ginny among her friends several times in the books. Ginny had her own world and her own friends.
Why don't we know any names? Because Harry Potter didn't bother to know Ginny's friends.
Harry didn't bother to notice girls anyway, except his classmates and Cho Chang.

Does Hermione treat Ginny as her close friend? Certainly yes. Hermione didn't have much social life other than with Ron, Harry and Ginny anyway. Hermione was not that easy to get along with. She insisted to hang around with Harry and Ron, instead with her dormmates. In OoP, she spent some evenings talking to Ginny while knitting. Thus, there should be no doubt, that Hermione treated Ginny as her close friend.
Is Hermione Ginny's only close friend? Jo introduced Luna in OoP, who stuck herself closely to Ginny in some classes. Hermione and Luna could not be said to be close friends, but Hermione-Ginny or Luna-Ginny could.
Does Ginny have many friends apart from the two? That's where the word "popular" is used. Apparently, Ginny had a significant number of followers, wherever she went. Thus, many noticed Ginny as "popular". Ginny was even a favourite among the teachers.
This is another aspect of Ginny's character.
In short, Ginny is an independent girl who attracts many.

I just want to point out a common pitfall in reading Harry Potter series. Some people thinks Ginny is a shy girl, because she was shy in front of Harry, from Harry's point of view.
However, Ron and others stated Ginny is not a shy girl. She is always talkative and not shy to say what she is thinking. Jo uses Harry's misconception to brilliantly disguise Ginny's real character until Harry discovered it in OoP and beyond.


Exactly. Just as Ron and Hermione are Harry's sidekicks in his adventure against Voldemort.
To become Harry's spouse is Ginny's ultimate role in the series. Jo wisely didn't make Ginny a superwitch. Ginny was deliberately limited in her assistance in the Battle of Hogwarts. Her function was shown as a comforter, something she would do for Harry in his daily life after Hogwarts (even hinted in the Epilogue). It's enough to have one Super in the family. Harry is the One. Ginny is his closest supporter. This is why Ginny's characterisation ultimately is suited to Harry's needs, just as someone sang "When God made me, he must've been thinking about you". God in Harry Potter series is the author. She created Ginny already with a mindset to eventually pair her with Harry.

Sufficient information in the books? No, not quite. We want more!
So many things can be expanded in the series. It would take many more books or other media to complete them. Just as Tolkien's or C.S. Lewis' masterpieces, we are hungry for more to "fill in the blanks". That will make Harry Potter series a classic for years to come.
With what we were given by the author, we have to put imagination to connect the dots.

One other thing that I find amusing: some people complains that if more is written about Ginny, there would be more about hexes and jinxes. What would we expect? It is a wizarding world. Many things are apparently settled using hexes and jinxes. We have seen many times, when adults quarreled, they also pull out their wands.
The reason we didn't see much is because Harry was brought up in our world, muggle world. He was not used to do everything by magic. He was astonished to see that Mrs. Weasley uses magic to cook, to knit, to do many things. He was amused to see the Weasleys didn't lift their bags, but hexed them to float up or down the stairs. The same thing also with Hermione: she stood out for carrying too many books in her schoolbag in her first year. I think if she grew up in wizarding world, we would not see that happened. She might find a way to leave the books somewhere and summon the one she needed when she needed it. Here is where Ginny's role for Harry becomes significant. Ginny can really take Harry into the common life of the magical world, where hexes and jinxes are as common as the use of electricity and electromagnetic wave (wiress phone/internet) in our world.
We see how Ginny is quite proficient with hexes for daily use, such as to remove the nasty spray of Neville's plant on the train, whereas Harry didn't quite know what to do.

I completely understand this point of view. However, don't you think that sometimes it's ok to assume some things outside the book? For example, I don't really find it that weird that Ginny started out as an outcast in book one, and then by book 5/6 she's "too popular for her own good." I would think it's ok to assume that after spending 5 years at Hogwarts Ginny had made a name for herself and now she's popular and relatively well-liked.

Now, assumptions that Ginny is a lovely girl who is perfect for Ginny and she would take care of him and clean up after his messes (or whatever)....I dunno.

I disagree with this. I have never viewed Ginny as a comforter. I would maybe view Hermione as a comforter, but not Ginny. She is very independent, and I don't see her as wanting to coddle someone and hold their hand, as she wouldn't want that from anyone else.

However, I also don't see her as some cold-hearted girl who yells at people as a hobby. If she was cold-hearted and ridiculously independent, Harry wouldn't have stayed with her for as long as he did. So I think it's hard to say how Ginny would be in a relationship. (Unless there's something in book 7 that I don't remember...I've only read it once. )

Oh absolutely it's ok. It's not in the assumption that the criticism lies. The criticism is on the claims that these assumptions are universal/incontrovertible and is fact when really they are a product of personal preferences or off-page deductions, the latter being having no real basis for critical analysis.

Where it applies in terms of Ginny's characterization is that, for the most part, many of the positive claims seem to lack the actual contextual support necessary for critical analysis...again, which is fine, but in debating and discussing said characterizations, the lack of cited support does not really support the positive claims. The best that has been seen are sweeping generalizations and other such statements that merely illustrate the (posted) author's personal opinion. Again, I'm not criticizing the opinion. But as Hermod had already stated nicely that:

There are several levels of credence to a post.

There is FACT (i.e. canon) for example: "Ginny is the youngest of seven children and is the only girl". This is pretty much indisputable unless someone wants to fantasize that Ginney had a twin which was secretly given away at birth or that Arthur has a second family in London and leads a double life.

There is INFERENCE drawn from fact: "Ginny is the youngest child and only girl, therefore it is likely that she ................"

There is INFORMED OPINION: "I think that Ginny is quite popular among her own year group."

There is OFF-THE-WALL OPINION: "I hate Ginny, I hate her, I hate her, I hate her."

Well, even with informed opinions, often times the basis is pulled from speculative sources in order to support a conclusion that is really personal in nature.

To use the example Just the Droobles provided:

In fact, we don't really know that. It does seem to be the sensible conclusion, but we're speculating that this may be the case. Who know, maybe Harry is suffering from battered-wife/husband syndrome and that it's just not revealed to us. Maybe he's a bit of a masochist. Anyway, that is neither here nor there.

If we are discussing (for example) that Ginny is cold-hearted and ridiculous, appealing to the longevity of Harry's marriage as proof (or disproof) is just a fallacy of cause. There is no necessary cause and effect between Ginny's cold-hearted and ridiculousness and Harry's staying with her. No doubt, as every married couple knows, there is so much more to it that that So basically, the example would merely illustrate a personal, if somewhat informed, opinion. To argue/debate the point absolutely as fact would require an appeal to logic and what is universally accessible for everyone to examine, which is the text. We only know what Rowling wrote. To claim any of the above scenarios as absolute is absurd.

As sensible a conclusion it may be, a good many of us don't buy it based on Ginny's portray and development on-text. We look at what she does and says, and are not convinced that she must have matured, or she really is sensible, etc. Not that it's exclusive a problem with Ginny (Harry and others suffers from inconsistent/out-of-character scenarios), but the faults in her characterization (not her character) are quite numerous.

Anyway, for the most part I find the discussion here focuses more on each individual's personal opinions and I can see where they are all coming from.

By the way, I would just like to point out that Ginny started dating Michael Corner at the end of her third year. So...timeline that.

Honestly...you really think Harry would have stayed with Ginny if she had been a total...brat? (For lack of getting to use a better word...) I know I wouldn't and I'd like to think a little more highly of Harry!!

But I say this because of a passage from OotP. You'll find it on page 654-5 of the American hardback. Chapter 29. ...They talk about Quidditch for a bit and how terrible it's going...then Ginny brings Harry an Easter package from Mrs. Weasley.
The reason I bring this passage to light is because I feel like this is a textual instance of where it shows that Ginny can be a good listener and she can be delicate and caring. If you pay attention, JKR uses phrases and words such as "said Ginny quietly" "Ginny persisted" "watched him closely" "thoughtfully" and so on and so forth. I think it shows that Ginny did actually care about him during this conversation. Also, it shows a lot about Harry and Ginny's relationship (not as a Ship, but how it has evolved) in the sense that Harry just divulged to Ginny that he wanted to talk to Sirius. So this is where I gather that Ginny can be kind-hearted, and she listens and can be quiet when she wants to be.

I honestly just...see Ginny as a typical female teenager...and I don't see what's wrong with that. She goes from sweet to sour, just like many other characters do, but she's the only one that is knocked for it. So there's textual evidence in my eyes....

Well, in the beginning she was really shy. You would almost feel bad for her being the youngest and having older brothers all the time to deal with. slowly however I believe she has changed. She can easily defend herself in almost any situation from annoying brothers to merciless death eaters. I just love her maturation through the books and films. I believe she is a likable character. Who wouldn't like her. She has wit, humor, intelligence, solidarity, independence and a whole lot more.

Playing on AryaForce's wonderfully articulated post, here is a quest-ee-on:

What were the main factors in Ginny's considerable character development throughout the books?

There have probably been many similar if not identical versions of this question but I've never really found any good answers.

Ok, in my opinion, Ginny's exposure to boys played a big part. Also, being able to develop friendships independant of her family would have helped her step out of her shell somewhat, that because she didn't have her siblings in her classes, she would have been forced to make new aquaintances.

The main factors in Ginny's character development throughout the books:

1. Her great longing to follow her brothers' footsteps, especially Bill, to attend Hogwarts.
Bill set a great example for his brothers. His academic achievement on paper was even better than Hermione's. Ginny looked up on him.
2. Meeting Harry Potter
This was an unexpected event for Ginny, basically ruining her original dreams.
Her life plan would never be the same again.
3. Occupied by Voldemort
Definitely a horrible experience that left deep scar for life.
4. Giving up on Harry
Which boy could replace Harry? None obviously, but you never knew until you tried. This affects Ginny's reputation, especially for jealous competitors who knew Ginny was definitely suited for Harry.
5. Harry wants Ginny
6. Harry wants Ginny to be far from him.
7. Harry wants Ginny for life

Cheers,
muggleview

Thank you, I didn't expect to be so accurate with Ginny. Well, here are some of my main factors for her development:

1. She has been born the youngest of seven children and has only brothers to live with. Result: Is naturally shy and also some wit, cleverness, and ferocity.
2. Meets Harry. Result: More shy in the beginning and somewhat follows his style of fighting back with people who mess with her.
3. Hermione joins the gang (Weasleys and Harry). Result: Has a another girl to look up and rely on for support. Which brings some ground level for Ginny and perhaps learns some hexes that she uses on Fred and George.
4. Neville asks her to the Yule Ball and accepts for she wanted to go to the Yule Ball. Result: Begins to catch the eyes of other boys. She is in the game.
5. Dumbledore's Army forms in her fourth year. Result: She can fight back more easily. Brings out her wit and flair.
6. Harry loves her, which both do not really expect. Result: Gets the boy of her childhood daydreams. So more outgoing and in the main crowd.
7. Marries Harry and shares three kids. Result: Brings out more loyalty, care, and the mother in her.

Voldemort's posession over her has surly left her scarred and perhaps more determined to change herself around and prove herself more capable of handling herself. Bill probably would have some impact on Ginny's life for he is the oldest and with his reputation in school, would only make Ginny want to follow his footsteps.

Was Ginny shy?
Some readers believe that Ginny was shy, because Harry said so.
However, sources outside Harry (including his own observation for the readers) largely dispute it. The right statement should be: Ginny was shy in front of Harry (mainly in books 1 to 4).

In the first book, being left alone at King's Cross Station, Harry heard a girl's voice stated the number of platform he was to go. Ginny was the first girl of Harry's age he knew by name in the whole series (and the last woman he talked to in the the whole series as well).
The first encounter should give the readers enough impression: Ginny was talkative and not shy to express her minds. She wanted to follow her brothers to Hogwarts. She wanted to see Harry Potter, once she was told that Harry was on the train. She might not realise yet that she saw him earlier, until probably later Ron wrote to her more about Harry from Hogwarts.
Ending the Philosopher Stone, Ginny's voice was the first to greet Harry back at the station. Again, we read that this girl was unstoppable to speak. Ginny was not a shy girl in this book.

A few chapter into the second book, Ginny was introduced as she walked into the dining room unaware that Harry already arrived there. She was so shocked that she ran back to her room, but she still took a good peek at Harry passing by (in which Harry, who was supposedly blind to girls, managed to note Ginny's eye colour, just in that split second before she closed her door).
Ron mentioned how Ginny couldn't stop talking, especially about Harry, before his arrival at the Burrow. The other brothers concurred.
The author again played the word tricks, to show how Harry actually paid a great deal of attention to Ginny, without ever said any statements about it. In a series of lines, Harry described in detail every movements made by Ginny and his childish interpretation of her silliness. Ginny was not shown as a shy girl. She was described as fighting her infatuation with Harry very hard. She was a fighter.
Finally at the Diagon Alley, Ginny had to speak in defense of Harry in front of the Malfoys, as nobody else seemed willing to do so. This was not a typical shy girl. Ginny was suddenly herself again, because of her character to defend a helpless friend.
At Hogwarts, Ginny was not often seen by Harry. She seemed confused and pulled her self away from the trio. Some might think that she was shy. However, she managed to send a valentine for Harry, let many people know that she was Harry's fan (including Hagrid), and break into Harry's room to steal the diary.

If my memory didn't fail me (well, hopefully not until I reach at least 50 years old), in the Prisoner of Azkaban Harry stated that Ginny was shy in front of him. That was in Diagon Alley. To be fair, Ginny actually said (muttered) "Hello" to Harry, but Harry didn't say anything at all. Harry couldn't bring any conversation to Ginny, but still paid attention to her coming and going. If Ginny was shy, than Harry was ever more in front of Ginny. But, Harry never admitted it for the readers, and so some may fail to see it. Ginny also personally delivered a home-made get-well card to Harry (while Harry noticed more about her blushing furiously) at the hospital wing. That's not an act of a shy girl.

In book 4, we read Ginny as a happy girl going to the World Cup, didn't want to miss any actions, even as she fell asleep earlier (again, only Harry noticed in detail, whereas others including her parents, were still too excited to talk and temporarily ignored her).
Thereafter, Ginny was not as shy in front of Harry as before. She went to the Ball with Neville and danced before Harry's eyes. She conversed openly with her family with Harry present on the eve of Harry's third task, which Harry felt as a beautiful moment.
Subsequent books never showed or stated Ginny as a shy girl.

Therefore, I feel that the notion Ginny being "shy" was embedded in some readers' mind through the explicit statements from Harry's point-of-view alone, and this was not the real Ginny.

I just kind of skimmed through the last couple pages but anyways, a question that I saw keep popping up was why Ginny is bashed so much more than other characters. And well, I thought, I don't like Ginny's charcter so why don't I answer that question!

I think one reason why Ginny gets bashed a lot is because she is a secondary character, a background character, who as the hero's girl is unexpectedly being thrusted to the fore front. We never really knew much about her and whenever JKR attempted to describe this girl to us, for me it was like, ok who cares, next sentence! I never bothered to get to know this character. She was a secondary charcter, but not just that, she was a low class secondary charcter. She never really played a large part in the books. With Neville, we got to know him a bit each book and he shared the same birthday with Harry so we always kind of knew, hmm he is gonna be some one to watch for later on in the series. And with Luna, JKR developed her character so beautifully and with the way she interacted with Harry, I fell in love with her character immediately. Fred and George were always meant as comedic relief. That was obvious. But with Ginny, it was like, she has a crush blah, blah...! And we need to know this why....? I felt like by the second book, I already had her all figured out and that she was already 14 minutes into her 15 minutes of fame. But no, it didn't really become clear until the 6th book what JKR was doing with her. And for me, it was too much, too late. Voldemort just came back to power for goodness sakes and it was annoying when JKR tried to add little Ginny stories in between all the action. She picked the worst moment to try and develop this character which is why it all seemed cluttered and put together so hastily. Moreover, with all the new fun and exciting qualities of Ginny that we were supposed to learn, it all just seemed fake.

Long paragraph short, Ginny is bashed on my part mainly because as Harry's girl, she doesn't meet up to my expectations and I believe that her character is very poorly developed.

I don't like her character and I don't like her with Harry.

HBP is an extremely choppy book. JKR produced a real masterpiece in OOTP which was very rich in descriptions and devlopment of characters (Tonks, Luna, Sirius, Lupin, Molly). OOTP was also huge in size. I think the publishers got on JKR's case about that and decreed that the next book had to be shorter. JKR also had a lot of stuff to do in HBP. As a result, it was very skimpy on details after the first third of the book where narcissa, Bellatrix, and Slughorn were developed. If HBP had been half again as many pages, I believe you would have seen better development of the relationship.

UnknownLocket, you and I are on the same page here. The other secondary characters, e.g. Neville, Luna, Tonks, to name a few, were developed sufficiently enough for the reader to understand their characterizations and for the most part these characters were endearing. But, not Ginny. Not to me. Her characterization was choppy, to say the least.

We first meet her briefly in book one - and I have to say, she did not endear herself to me because she acted like a groupie, a behavior I do not condone. I don't care that she was only 10 years old. I hated the part of the book where she is described as being disappointed that she had actually been in the presence of the boy that lived and she hadn't known it. In CoS, we didn't know until towards the end of the book that Ginny was the one in danger. Here again, I thought of her only as a silly little girl. Then she all but disappears into the woodwork until OotP where she, Neville and Luna had more on-air time, if you catch my drift. The library scene was absolutely nauseating! As I recall, she reminded Harry (when he was in a snit) of her having been a puppet of sorts for Voldemort her first year, but whose fault was that?! Harry has been Voldemort's target from day one through no fault of his own. Suffice it to say, I have always thought very little of Ginny, and even more so when in HBP she has suddenty become very pretty (when did this transformation happen?), she was well liked by her peers and popular (when did this happen exactly?) and she was a wiz on a broomstick in quidditch (again, since when?) and she had a wicked bat bogey hex ( ). But, it all happened off page, and it just wan't good enough for me.

Like UnknownLocket said, I also do not like Ginny and I especially don't like her with Harry!

Edit: I forgot to mention the part in GoF where silly, immature Ginny finds out that Harry might have asked her to the Yule Ball and is bummed out because she had already said yes to Neville. I can only hope that Neville didn't find out about this ~ that would have been an insult in the first degree.

BTW, I don't want to hear about Ginny having behaved like any other teenage girl. I was a teenager once myself and I don't recall acting like she did. And so it's another negative for the girl in my book.

It wasn't in the library scene. In OOTP after returning from St Mungo's to visit Arthur, Harry worries that his visions of LV's mind mean that he is possessed and hides out in Buckbeak's room. When Hermione coaxes Harry out, he says that the others don't understand. Ginny then is angry and says she knows what it is like to be possessed by LV. Harry calmes down and listens to her, then realizes tht he has not been possessed.

The library scene is where Ginny finds out that hary wants to talk with Sirius and helps him set it up.

I stand corrected. Still, this doesn't change how I feel about Ginny's characterization.

It would have been a lot better if Rowling had shown us Ginny's character more and more with each subsequent book instead a vignette here and there (prior to HBP of course). Then Ginny would have been better written and subsequently more people would have accepted her as Harry's love interest. But, as it is, I for one, don't accept her at all.

I think this is one of the milestones of Ginny's characterisation.
From then on, Harry started to pay more attention to Ginny, and thus, we, readers, get more information about her.
It may seems cliche to say a boy don't pay attention to a certain fan girl until she is found attractive by some boys, who are competitors. But that's what Jo Rowling makes us believe in the series. Without the challenge, the boy seems to be content that the fan girl will forever waits for his time to pick her, and so no need to notice more than necessary.
When no boys pays attention to Ginny, Harry didn't pay too much attention either. He only occasionally checked on her, during which we get to know her a bit more. Therefore in book 2 and 3, Ginny took some initiatives: making sure many people knew she was Harry's greatest fan (in the league of Collin Crevey), sending valentine poem to Harry (apparently the only girl dared and were willing to do so), and delivering self-made get-well card. The author used Ginny's forceful character to provide the essential data.
However, Harry dismissed Neville's "threat" rather easily, pointing out to the readers how Ginny suffered throughout the night due to Neville's erratic dance steps. Therefore, this challenge was not seen as big enough to make Harry pay significant amount attention to Ginny, other than in GOF, Ginny was mentioned more than in book 3.
In OoP, another challenge was issued by Michael Corner. This news could penetrate Harry's mind, even as he was still dreaming about Cho Chang. Ron came to the rescue, by saying that he didn't like Michael. However, it was enough to make Harry actually looked at Ginny more often than before, noticing her catlike behaviour and her passion to cat (which symbolise feminine traits) even during very important meetings (at 12 GP, for instance).
More information about Ginny than GOF, but still not threatening enough to pay enough attention.
Only when Harry saw that Ginny was physically linked to yet another boy, Dean Thomas, that Harry started to feel the urge to get Ginny for his own, and he really took serious looks at Ginny. So it is in HBP that Ginny became more dominantly described by Harry.
It is a brilliant writing style, taking detailed consideration on Harry's mind state towards Ginny to provide the readers not only the necessary information, but also the time-points of Harry 's growing attention to her.
In the DH, the romantic attention was concisely yet beautifully delivered as Harry opened his Marauder map only to trace Ginny at Hogwarts. Such a genial pen-stroke!

It is indeed frustrating and seemingly unfair that Harry-Ginny romantic conversations were not written in more detail. If there are more pages dedicated to these dialogues, we may see better on how deep the relationship grew. We only know it was deep only when the relationship was challenged by temporary separations. That's again as a conclusion, instead a narration. Well, that makes Ginny's characterisation even more interesting, because it was not plainly written as the other characters.

OK so Ginny's characterization is made more interesting because it is vague and not obvious? Well I guess that's a matter of opinion. For me, it would be a whole lot more interesting if Ginny was actually a complex character then the whole 'mystery girl' thing would make a lot more sense. But she is actually rather normal, whether we think she is little miss evil or little miss sunshine, there is nothing endearing, unusual or captivating about Ginny's character. She's the one character who I think could have died or disappeared off the pages and not much about the series would have changed. . .

I think the opposite is true. Ginny is a complex character. With many dedicated threads, she is still an enigma to some. She cannot be definitely defined nor universally understood. To some, she can be shy or not, good or evil, friendly or selfish, powerful or weak, etc.
Will the storyline change if Ginny died or disappeared somewhere in the series?
Yes.

In a way, Ginny was used as a kind of guide for the storyline.
In book 1: She led us to the Weasley family.
In book 2: She led us to the first horcrux and the Young Voldemort.
In book 3: She led us to the horror of the Dementors
In book 4: She led us to Yule Ball pairings
In book 5: She led us to Luna Lovegood, Dumbledore's Army etc.
In book 6: She led us to the romance etc
In book 7: She led us to wars and families.

If Harry was a marked man, Ginny was a marker.

I guess when I said complex character, I meant it as someone with an interesting background and story. For Ginny, it is a pretty simple story. She is the only girl and youngest child of a family of 9. OK... but not as intriguing as others such as Luna or Neville.


Really? Wow, I don't think I would give her that much credit. Forgive me, for I don't have a book to quote from (mom has packed all my books up, we're moving), but from what I remember, what drew Harry's attention to the Weasley's was the fact that they were a family unit with red hair talking about Platform 9 3/4. The only part of Ginny that I remember is her chasing after the train. . .

All I'm saying is that I think Ginny was a useless character. Besides being Harry's end partner, her existence was rather useless. If she had died in the chamber of secrets the books would have pretty much remained the same and ended the same (except that now Harry is without a partner).

Of course, some may argue that you could pretty much say the same about several other characters in the series. However, as someone who plays a large role in the hero's life in the end, her value added compared to some other common and well known characters is next to nothing.

I know it seems unfair to always put Ginny on this pedestal because she is Harry's partner but JKR did this herself when she decided to make the claim that they were soul mates. In my opinion, JKR should have given Harry someone with more of an impact to the series. If they had not ended together then maybe I would not judge Ginny's character so harshly. But either way, I still think I won't like her.

I'm sorry, but I completely disagree with this! If Ginny had died in the chamber of secrets Harry would not have destroyed that Horcrux and brought it back to Dumbledore. This was the first Horcrux to be destroyed, and it was what intrigued Dumbledore to learn more about Riddle's horcruxes. Also, she proved that Voldemort will use anyone close to Harry to get to him, which caused Harry to break up with her at the end of HBP.
Ultimately, without Ginny there would be no leading up to this "horcrux business". JKR cleverly introduced us to horcruxes through Ginny without us even realizing at the time.

I also disagree with this completely! Ginny was not completely useless! She gave life and romance to the story and if Harry had let Ginny die in the Chamber of Secrets, the books would not have ended the same. The Weasleys would be forever grieving about her death and Harry would too. Plus, it wouldn't really make a good story unless she was saved from the Chamber of Secrets.

The last two books would be completely different because you can't really use Ginny in them any more. One of the things that motivates Harry to find all the Horcruxes (along with just being able to get rid of Voldemort) is that he will be able to love Ginny in peace. That is why Ginny is so important. She gives Harry reason.

Ginny has never been one of my favorite characters. She was a notch below the Weasley twins whom I really enjoyed. The twins gave life and comic relief to the story. If Ginny had not even been a character in the HP novels, it would have suited me just fine. Another female character - like Hermione, since I ship H/Hr in the first place - could have provided the "life and romance" to the story.

But, as it is, Ginny is a part of the HP novels, albeit she was mostly in the background for most of the time. As far as I am concerned, she should have died in the 7th book. In fact, I would have preferred she die instead of poor hapless Fred! Think about all of the drama and angst Harry would have gone through. It would have given him all the incentive to go looking for the horcruxes and battle Voldemort!



Well, I disliked HBP, and it is my least favorite book in the series, and, I would have preferred a much different ending to book 7. So, for me, a "completely different ending" wouldn't have been so bad.

I have to disagree with you about giving Ginny such importance. She really isn't, nor should she be. The trio is important to the story line, especially the lead character Harry. After all, the books are really about Harry Potter! Any other girl - Luna, Cho, the Patil twins, Hannah Abbott, Susan Bones, etc. - could have done the same things that Ginny did. e.g. be the one to have been suckered into the Chamber of Secrets, provided the romance for Harry (although I still feel Hermione should have been the one), and so on.

I understand where UnkownLocket is coming from. I too don't see Ginny as all that necessary a character.

Fine, fine. Let's not kill Ginny off in the Chamber of Secrets . I will admit that the second book was Ginny's time to shine. But afterwards, besides her introducing the trio to Luna, I still agree with the statement that I made earlier that Ginny was a useless character. Ginny also did not bring life and romance to the story. I can hardly call what she had with Harry romantic. It was rather shallow, lustful, and obsessed love.

The point still is that her characterization was very sloppily put together. And the fact that she is now the hero's girl only heightens her flaws. Ginny is a shallow character, with no depth and no complexity at all.

Book 1
We become aware of Ginny as she is with Molly and the boys heading for the train when Harry asks Molly how to get onto the platform.

When Fred and George say that Harry Potter is on the train, she, like a ten year old, wants to "see him." As Hagrid noted, being from a wizarding family, she has grown up knowing his name.

Book 2
You can infer that after the Philosopher's Stone/Sorcerer's Stone incident that Percy, Fred, George, and Ron have talked a lot about Harry during the summer. Ginny built up a picture in her mind of this great hero that she would be going to school with.

Harry's unexpected arrival at the Burrow flustered her and caused her intense shyness around Harry.

She did show some of the determination and fire that later became apparent when she confronted Malfoy.

Now she is away from home the first time, she has this embarrassing (like the Valentine card) unrequited crush on Harry, and she is suckered in by Tom Riddle's diary. She shows some strength of character in trying to destroy the diary, but is unsuccessful.

She goes through the horrifying Chamber of Secrets ordeal.

At the end, she is still treated like the little sister by the brothers.

Book 3
At the beginning, she is embarrassed to meet Harry (part crush and part because he rescued her the previous spring).

She pairs off with Hermione and first is accepted into the "girls ring" with Molly and Hermione.

Book 4
Again, she is Hermione's roomate and the two seem comfortable together. Per Book 6, she begins to exchange confidences with Hermione at this time.

She attends the Yule Ball with Neville.

At the end, she begins to see Michael Corner.

She is fully accepted into the Weasley/Potter/Granger group on the train as an equal partner.

Book 5
She is now open with being with Harry at Grimauld Place and on the train (where Harry meets Luna).

She is a full participant in the DA exercises. She helps recruit for DA.

She convinces Harry he isn't being possessed by LV.

When harry is suspended from Quidditch, she takes over as seeker and shows an amazing talent at the game.

She arranges for Harry to talk to Sirius.

She fights against Umbridge and in the Dept of Mysteries battle.

She dumps Micahel Corner and takes up with Dean Thomas at the end.

All leading up to Book 6.

I think this is the disconnection between some readers and Jo Rowling.
Many literature has been written with two protagonists tying knot at the end. This should not be a fixed rule. Jo Rowling is a unique few who didn't follow this habit.
Just like Superman should be alone in his quest, with little help (or even added problems) from his love interest(s?), Harry Potter should be alone facing Voldemort, as prophesied. His love interest should not overshadow the final battle. Similarly, Robin Hood was one main hero on a quest, with little help from his lover. And so was Spiderman, James Bond, or Jason Bourne, to name a few.
Jo Rowling has followed her script carefully and brilliantly hinted Harry's romantic choice cryptically (maybe for some "sloppily") throughout the series, through the view of an innocent young boy who gradually turned into a hormone-driven teenager. However, she wisely decided that Ginny should not overshadow Harry's quest and Ginny should also not be Harry's burden. It would be unfair if she was cast as a weak damsel.
Ginny had a limited contribution to the main storyline. Her main contribution was along and after the main storyline. Without someone like her, Harry would just be a lone martyr without place in the peaceful world he helped to produce. Follow the spiders summed nicely that "Ginny gives Harry reason"..."that he will be able to love Ginny in peace".
After the death of Voldemort, vacuum would be resulted. Harry's task in this world would end. No more Dark Lord to defeat, what's more for Harry? Ginny has been there all along to give Harry the joy of living in the wizarding world as he dreamed but had little experience to realise due to his early life with Muggles.
Therefore, the author cleverly gave Ginny the tasks as a guide ("Take my hand"?). As Padfootx3 stated, Ginny led us to the key point to defeat Voldemort, the horcruxes, which we would know only in Book 6. Hermod summarised Ginny's role in Book 1 to 5, showing Ginny's additional contributions especially in Book 5, consistently without overshadowing Harry's achievements. The only problem Ginny would give was in book 7, when Harry was on his way to sacrifice himself before Voldemort. Would his love to Ginny stop him from doing the sacrifice? Fortunately, Harry decided that to give his life for Ginny was the greatest love he could give to her, so he went on and had Voldemort killed the horcrux in Harry. One way or another, Ginny is a significant character in the series, who must be there until the very end, so readers can see that everything was fine with Harry ever after.

I read the same HP novels written by J. K. Rowling, but, my opinion of Ginny differs from those from people who have posted pro-Ginny. However, the topic of this thread is:
Ginny's Characterisation V.2., Formerly - Do you think Ginny is likeable?

We all know that not everyone likes Ginny and therefore, not everyone will hold the same admiration for her as do the people that like her. If I, and others who feel as I do, claim that Ginny's characterization is shallow, unimportant, useless, senseless, having no depth, etc., etc., then that's what she is to us. This is how we interpreted her character to be from what little we read of her in the books prior to HBP. To me, Ginny just isn't likeable. I have given my reasons several times as to why I feel this way in previous posts.

Ginny was placed on a pedestal by the author herself because Ginny was the anointed one and Rowling created her for the sole purpose of becoming Mrs. Harry James Potter. I say this because I fully believe that Rowling wanted Harry (and Hermione too) to become a part of the Weasley family, and how better to do this than to marry them into the family making it all OBWF.

Love, love, love. Yes, of course it was love! Because when I die, the last thing I remember about the person I loved most is their lips against mine.


Ginny is accepted in their group? Oh, so that is why Harry was so adamant that her Luna and Neville not join him, Ron and Hermione to the Department of Mysteries.

I think you guys have made great, lengthy points as to why you like Ginny and felt like her character was meaningful to the series but I'm gonna keep mine short. Her character was not very meaningful. Her presence was not very necessary. She lacks likability. But that's just my opinion. It's quite amazing how some people can read so little about a character and yet get so much from it. Maybe they are just better in reading between the lines. But what I saw was a character whose good qualities were only told (beauty, popularity, kindness) and whose bad qualities were often highlighted and elabortaed on (hot-tempered, bully, shallow).

Ginny was always here and there, but never for the long haul. She was here one minute, gone the next hour. Here for a sentence, absent the next book. She's a flimsy character.

Dumbledore's Widow said it best.

At the end of Book 7, Harry seeks out Ron and hermione to "close the loop" with Dumbledore and to end the Deathly Hallows (the Ressurection Stone is lost, the Elder Wand/Deathstick is neutered, and the Cloak is harmless). After that, he just wants to be al;one and go to his bed.

Like Frodo in Lord of the Rings (the Shire is saved, but not for me, Sam), Harry is sort of out of place in the new world and wants to duck out of the public eye. I see him as suffering very much from PTSD from all of the loss of close friends (Fred, Remus, Tonks) in the final battle plus his killing of LV.

All of Harry's father figures are gone except for Arthur Weasley (James, Sirius, Mad Eye, Remus, Dumbledore). Harry is truly lost

OBWF is Harry's redemption in the Epilogue.

I don't like Ginny either and I'd rather JKR left the whole "relationships" part out of the books. I think it degrades the last two books- which are in my opinion the best- into teenage reading.
If it was absolutely necessary for Harry to have a girlfriend though, I'd prefer her to be Luna.

Ok, I'd like to ask that all the OBHWF stuff be ignored. I have stated before that if JKR would have wanted OBHWF that Fred would have still been alive and Bill wouldn't be a werewolf. It is quite clear to me that the Weasleys have had their own bits of woe, and I'm almost insulted that many readers are so hateful toward the Weasleys when they're really the only family Harry ever had. It most certainly is not OBHWF, and knowing that that stamp comes from H/Hr shippers, I would like to remind everyone that this is not a thread about love. If you would like top bash Ginny because she's not good enough for Harry, we have Venom threads for that. If not, then stay.

I do believe that muggleview was referring to the fact that he heard Ginny's voice first out of all the Weasleys. I think she said something that clearly wasn't Muggle-ish, and that attracted his attention to them.

I do not believe that Ginny is unimportant or useless, but I do not believe she as important as some people make her out to be. I also do not believe that JKR favors her. If JKR favors anyone it's Hermione (IMO). I think what JKR was trying to do by making Ginny Harry's partner was give Harry someone who he didn't have to worry about, someone who wasn't clingy and someone who wouldn't break down constantly if something bad or scary happened. I think by doing that, she made Ginny seem very cold and hard to relate to.

I also do not think that any character could have been sucked into the Chamber. Yeah, Harry has a hero complex and he probably would have saved any of them, but I don't think he would have felt as compelled to do it if it hadn't been Ron's sister.

You know, as much as I don't like to think it, sometimes it does cross my mind that Ginny was an afterthought as an important character in Harry's life. I really got no inkling at all until the 5th book that she may actually end up putting them together. So I'm not entirely sure that JKR did favor Ginny throughout the series. Why do you (and anyone else) believe that JKR made Ginny into this character on a pedestal? (That's a serious question, not a sarcastic one)

I say this because of an interview I read back in 2005 ...
http://www.accio-quote.org/articles/2005/0...et-anelli-3.htm

Ever since then, I just felt that Rowling had all along planned H/G.

Here is an excerpt from that interview (ES=Emerson Spartz; MA=Melissa Annelli):

JKR: ... So you liked Harry/Ginny, did you, when it happened?

ES: We've been waiting for this for years!

JKR: Oh, I'm so glad.

MA: Oh my gosh, that kiss!

JKR: Yeah.

ES: It actually materialized!

JKR: It actually happened, I know! I felt a little bit like that.

MA: Had you been trying to get them —

JKR: Well I always knew that that was going to happen, that they were going to come together and then part.

ES: Were you always -----ing it? [We can’t figure out what Emerson actually said here.]

JKR: Well, no, not really, because the plan was, which I really hope I fulfilled, is that the reader, like Harry, would gradually discover Ginny as pretty much the ideal girl for Harry. She's tough, not in an unpleasant way, but she's gutsy. He needs to be with someone who can stand the demands of being with Harry Potter, because he's a scary boyfriend in a lot of ways. He's a marked man. I think she's funny, and I think that she's very warm and compassionate. These are all things that Harry requires in his ideal woman. But, I felt — and I'm talking years ago when all this was planned — initially, she's terrified by his image. I mean, he's a bit of a rock god to her when she sees him first, at 10 or 11, and he's this famous boy. So Ginny had to go through a journey as well. And rather like with Ron, I didn’t want Ginny to be the first girl that Harry ever kissed. That's something I meant to say, and it's kind of tied in.

One of the ways in which I tried to show that Harry has done a lot of growing up — in “Phoenix,” remember when Cho comes into the compartment, and he thinks, ‘I wish I could have been discovered sitting with better people,’ basically? He's with Luna and Neville. So literally the identical thing happens in “Prince,” and he's with Luna and Neville again, but this time, he has grown up, and as far as he's concerned he is with two of the coolest people on the train. They may not look that cool. Harry has really grown. And I feel that Ginny and Harry, in this book, they are total equals. They are worthy of each other. They've both gone through a big emotional journey, and they've really got over a lot of delusions, to use your word, together. So, I enjoyed writing that. I really like Ginny as a character.

In that one question, where it isn't sure what Emerson asked Rowling, I think that he said, "planning", and she answered that she hadn't plan it that way. However, I still feel that she planned for Ginny to end up with Harry. Otherwise, any one from a number of other girls at Hogwarts would have ended up with Harry, OR Rowling would have kept him a bachelor. Just my opinion of course, I'm not saying that Rowling was less than truthful.

Just to set the record straight: Ginny was never absent in any books in the series (nor in the movies, as Jo Rowling insisted). According to the author's plan, she was introduced slowly to Harry and the readers as the ideal girl for Harry. First, the readers need to know Harry enough. Then, the readers are shown more of Ginny. True to her nature, the author could not resist to place hints here and there, one minute but not the full hour, until the time is come.
As much as we still get surprised on Harry's character development (the angry boy in book 5 and 6), Ginny's character is full of unexpected turns as well.


If I understand correctly, Jo Rowling wrote the series for teenagers. The publishers decided to market the early ones as children books, but in reality, the Philosopher's stone is a bit too dark for young children. The main young characters were introduced when they were 10 to 11 years old. Ginny was 10 in the first book. The series chronicles Harry at 11 to 17 years old. Romance fulfills the expectation of most readers for that age group. Being J.K. Rowling, she didn't write a straight line, but a twisted one. Therefore, it is necessary to cover Ginny up for some period, before Ginny was discovered.

I believe the movie HBP played on "shippers" dreams to sell it to as many audience as possible, with some scenes for H/Hr, for H/L, even for H/others. In the books, however, the author consistently drove the readers to the inevitable, that Ginny was the chosen one for the Chosen One.

As Dumbledore's Widow quoted the interview, Ginny was prepared for Harry's life after the main storyline ended (Voldemort dead), as someone that Harry required.
Therefore, Ginny has to be introduced with some fleshes and bones that suit Harry's.

It's my opinion that Ginny was written not to be liked by all readers, but to be liked best by Harry alone. Understanding Ginny's character is a way to understand more about Harry's character.

Well, honestly, I don't quite remember what happened in the book. All I can recall right now is the scene that happened in the movie and the movies are definately not that accurate.



I wasn't at all surprised with Harry's character development. All of his actions and emotions were understandable, whether we felt like he was being stupid or not. Due to the certain circumstances that he was under, it made sense. Ginny, on the other hand, her development only made me skeptical. It wasn't that it was unexpected, but there was just something about it that made it all fake. Her character was never a believable character to me and knowing now that JKR had alterior motives for Ginny's developmenet, it all makes sense why I was never able to accept her or like her later on in the series.

You are right. In the movie, Ginny only said "Good luck". Apparently with so much to show, Steve Klove decided to play down Ginny in movie 1, for future "awakening", which was in movie 2.
The movies establish a different storyline. There, Ginny was a cute shy girl, which turned out to be aggressive after movie 4.
In the books, the author hinted a number of times, that Ginny was not a cute shy girl. She was a witch (honestly and sarcastically). We should expect her to behave like a witch (odd and sometimes downright scary, see Merope, Bellatrix etc.), not like a descent human being. Aunt Petunia is a typical asocial lady, but she would not lay a hand to murder someone. Molly Weasley seems to be a nice lady, but she was a warrior witch in the Order of the Phoenix and didn't refrain to kill Bellatrix when the chance came.
Ginny is a witch, not a normal human being. We shouldn't forget that.


I see that actually the author's comments really triggered division in readers' perception.
Some would detest that it was not as they hoped for. This may cause resentment to the character. Well, it couldn't be helped anyway. The series is flawed with human errors.
It was easy to pick the imperfections. In term of Ginny, the biggest defense for the author should be a more detail romantic conversation between Harry and Ginny. It was not provided well. From the conversation, we would have known more about what bothered Harry the most, in war or after war. There, we would have known how Ginny would provide the assistance for the moment and after war. As we didn't see pages with those, it was easy to claim that no clear evidence that Ginny fully understands Harry, or Harry fully understands Ginny. What we read are mostly how Hermione helped Harry, how Luna helped Harry. Ginny's contribution was not few, but less spectacular, or even, seemingly trivial.
Nonetheless, we know these facts from the series:
- It was full of twists.
Just like a good detective stories, sparse information is given to the readers, so the author can claim never to deceive the readers, but often not enough for casual readers to get the point, until finally it was revealed openly. For a murder case, the readers would accept happily (while praising the hero), because justice is served. For a romantic twist, it caused resentment, because many broken-hearted readers would demand more information beforehand. That Harry finally fell for Ginny was one of the big twists in the "shipping war" (or "ship war"?). I remember, I doubted myself a few times, before decided to put my bet on Harry/Ginny. When I knew HBP would reveal it, I felt quite unsettled, and fully prepared to accept that the author would go totally a different way. I felt lucky I didn't have to change my perception.
- It was under pressure to reduce printed pages.
Many details are excluded, forcing the author to provide supplemental information through interview. If I am not mistaken, the statement that Ginny was the first girl born to the Weasley family in several generations was from an interview, not from books nor movies.
This diminishes Ginny's value for the purists, who rely solely from books as the source of information. For example, in the books, Ginny was special by birth simply being a pure-blood girl (same as Luna and Pansy Parkinson). In the books, only one hex was repeatedly mentioned as Ginny's signature. In the books, only one sentence to inform how Ginny could be a good Quidditch player, and many more. We just have to take the face values to build Ginny's characterisation.
- It was not a romantic novel
There are romantic moments, but not for the sake of building a solid foundation of romances. They served just to inform readers, who loves whom. I would say there is no depth in the romances of Bill and Fleur, Lupin and Tonks, James and Lily, etc. Readers were simply told, they were in love, they got married and were somehow happy.
Arthur/Molly, Ron/Hermione and Harry/Ginny at least got some details to ponder on.
Thus, we cannot expect to understand the romantic side of the series. We just have to take what the author provides. Yes, the author plays tricks using Harry's eyes to wander to Ginny many times, most obviously in book 5, where, for instance, in the meeting of the Order, Harry twice set his eyes on Ginny playing with Crookshanks (which were unrelated to the conversation and just bystanders) to show his unconscious growing affection to the girl. But, what exactly attracted Harry to Ginny was never discussed. Ginny did admit she liked Harry because of his quest to defeat Voldemort. She knew the risks he had to take, she admired him for that, she was happy he liked her back and so she was willing to wait (end of HBP). Was that enough for a lady to put her life for a man? I don't know, I am not a woman. To me, it was the message the author (who happens to be a woman) gave.

I said a long time ago, and I think some may never read or heard, that Ginny was not my type of woman. In fact, I wouldn't want to live with her (or any witch, not to discriminate anyone of them). However, I was intrigued with how Ginny's character was presented in the series. Glad to know that Jo likes to write Ginny's character, although she wouldn't say that Ginny was her favourite one (as Droobles suggested, Ginny may not be the best favourite). I love to discuss Ginny's characterisation.

Rather than Ginny leading the reader to the Weasley family, in the book, Ginny is the last Weasley that Harry notices. Initially he overhears Mrs. Weasley not Ginny say the word "Muggles".
"At that moment a group of people passed just behind him and he caught a few words of what they were saying.
'-packed with Muggles, of course-'
Harry swung around. The speaker was a plump woman who was talking to four boys, all with flaming red hair. Each of them was pushing a trunk like Harry's in front of him – and they had an owl.
Heart hammering, Harry pushed the trolley after them. They stopped, and so did he, just near enough to hear what they were saying.
'Now what’s the platform number?' said the boys' mother.
'Nine and three quarters!' piped a small girl also red-headed, who was holding her hand, 'Mum, can I go…' " (PS chapter pp. 69-70 Raincoast)


Harry would probably feel compelled to rescue any character because of the potential that Hogwarts will close and he will be sent back to the Dursleys if the student is not rescued. He calls it the worst day of his life (to date) when he overhears " 'We shall have to send all the students home tomorrow, ' said Professor McGonagall. 'This is the end of Hogwarts' " (CoS chapter 16 p. 217 Raincoast). Harry considers Hogwarts his home and uses his memory of learning he's a wizard, going to Hogwarts and leaving the Dursleys as his happiest memory when learning the Patronus charm "He racked his brains... a really really happy memory... one that he could turn into a good, strong Patronus... The moment when he first found out he was a wizard, and would be leaving the Dursley's for Hogwart's! If that wasn't a happy memory he didn't know what was... " (PoA chapter 12 p. 179-179). So, I think Harry has the motivation to rescue any student. That said, I agree that there is added value in having the student be Ginny, not because of anything intrinsic to Ginny herself, but because she is one of his best friend's little sister.

While not specifically noted by the author, you can certainly deduce that Harry spent part of the summer at the Burrow at the beginning of CoS, Gof, HBP, and DH. He also spent time with the Weasleys in Diagon Alley in PoA and at Grimmauld Place in OOTP. He spent Christmas with the Weasleys in OOTP and HBP. Ginny also lived in the Gryffendor dormitory with Harry for five years.

During that time, Harry and Ginny must have gotten to know each other as intimately as possible in the non-sexual, non-relationship sense. They were not total strangers meeting on the street at the time of "THE KISS".

They both liked and admired each other.

I'll play devil's advocate ...


I'm with you so far.


It's true that they were not total strangers at the time of the kiss, but I disagree that during the times mentioned above that H and G got to know each other "as intimately as possible in the non-sexual, non-relationship sense". Harry knew Ginny enough to be able to pick her out in a crowded room, and not just because of the red hair, but did he really know her as anyone other than as the Weasley youngest sibling? Not according to canon, that's a certain. Ginny wasn't all that visible a character until CoS and even then .... well, we've debated this several times over. ... IMO, the kiss occurred the way it did because Rowling was trying to make a statement (like, "this is the girl Harry's ending up with!")


It was during HBP, when H/G was being built up, and with the advent of Harry's pants chest monster ), did I see that Harry gave her a second thought. He didn't start liking her until he notices her as not being the little girl he has always seen her as. She's now this popular and attractive young girl. As for Ginny, well, she's always liked Harry! That isn't a secret.

We know that Ginny has long admired Harry ~ probably since she was on her father's knee listening to the stories about the boy-that-lived. As for Harry, he might have admired her for her being fiesty, a good quidditch player, etc., but this only happened AFTER he began seeing her in a different light (when he develops his monster and his hormones kick in) ~ he now sees her as someone other than as Ron's baby sister.

I was using "like" in the sense that Harry "likes" the other Weasley siblings. Harry "likes" Fred, George, Mr. Weasley, Bill, and Charlie. Harry isn't quite as fond of Percy since Book 4 and into the epuilogue.

Harry "loves" Molly. Harry just "likes" Ginny until he begins to have boy-girl feelings for her. If Harry had fallen "in love" with and ended up with Cho, Parvati, Luna, Pansy, or any other girl, he would still have felt freindship for Ginny.

It is very appropriate that the discussion for Ginny's characterisation is placed in the HBP book thread. This is where Ginny was finally revealed as Harry's soulmate, increasing interests in her (in positive or negative way).
To refute any suggestions that Harry was never interested romantically to Ginny, Jo Rowling cleverly used Amortensia to sum up all the related events. Amortensia can only enhance someone's feeling on something or another person, but does not create a new one. Obviously, amortensia is capable to reveal a hidden strong feeling which a person suppresses or is oblivious. Jo used Hermione as a reference to Harry's own finding. It was revealed that Harry has been harbouring feeling for Ginny.
Taken as face value, this is sufficient to show that Harry's feeling to whomever before was not the real feeling: Cho Chang, Luna Lovegood, Hermione etc. It was Ginny that Harry has been having a strong feeling for.
Looking back to previous books, we can start building the case. At the end of book 1, Harry remembered Ginny's voice and face, although he only saw and heard her briefly 10 months before. In book 2, Harry didn't object Draco's words that Ginny's Harry's girlfriend. Tom Riddle from the diary even understood the situation. Arguably being the best mind-reader even at that young age, he knew how to taunt Harry using Ginny in the Chamber of Secrets.
In book 3, Harry understood that Ginny suffered from hero-worship, so he distanced himself and found a surrogate: a petite girl, pretty, long-haired and good at Quidditch, named Cho Chang. In book 5, Jo Rowling pushed Ginny to replace the false desires to the correct ones. Ginny became pretty and popular (two words initially to describe Cho Chang in book 3),plus she was long-haired and good at Quidditch. Ginny defeated Cho-Chang in Dumbledore's Army (naming and recruiting) and Quidditch.
Now book 6 came to mirror book 2: Harry claimed Ginny as his girlfriend for real.

Amortensia gives the verdict: it has always been Ginny.

I see it as a contrived device put in place because real Ginny/Harry development & interaction was absent in the text.


The only verdict Amortensia provides is how Harry feels for Ginny at that moment.

The scenarios you chose to lead us to the conclusion that "it has always been Ginny" are speculative at best. But without having to go into all that again, it really doesn't matter that Harry never explicitly reveals his growing desire for Ginny. Readers will read into whatever they want to and resolve it in their own way.

It's just that as a reliable foundation to "build a case" based on these speculations, the ground isn't all that solid. If anything, it serves as a road map to understanding the rationale of the pro-Harry/Ginny camp. And I can appreciate that readers can be very passionate in their interpretations of Ginny's "journey" towards her final end with Harry.

...to lead it back to the topic of the thread at hand, though, it's really in the lack of available text that I think brings about this "disconnect" regarding Ginny's characertization on and off the page. There's so much room for interpretation that those who don't "see" it, for whatever reason, is left shaking their heads when suddenly Ginny seemingly changes within a span of a book or two. To me, this show Rowling poor characterization of Ginny on paper.

I don't think Ginny materialized in HBP...she was a pretty frequent shower in OotP. So she was around for that, but I maybe got one tiny inkling that Harry could have maybe been interested. But relationships aren't really the main topic in this thread...so making points about how Ginny was destined to be with Harry should probably be saved for H/G threads.

Wouldn't it make sense for a guy to notice a girl after she's gone through puberty and grows into a young lady? And Harry definitely had a "monster" before Ginny...his stomach and intestines were pro-gymnasts after PoA, GoF, and OotP, thanks to Cho.

I agree that the paper-characterisation (for lack of better word) is a bit lacking. However, I have stated before that I don't think that we need anymore from Ginny on paper. She was meant to be Harry's partner, and I think that's about it. It was Ron and Hermione's job to be the sidekicks...Sirius and the Weasleys (yes, I know that includes Ginny) to be the family...and Dumbledore's job to be the guidance. So...that leaves Ginny to be the damsel. I don't really want much from a damsel, so Ginny did her job.

I agree that we would be happy to read more about Ginny in the books. Not only Ginny, but more about many things as well. After reading all 7 books, I still want more.
Let's hope Jo Rowling will still write some more about the series.
An encyclopedia will be nice, as she promised a while ago.
I wonder what will be there for Ginny that we haven't know, presume or assume yet.
When I check on the character descriptions for HP series, there is a lot about her, much more than all average characters.
If this is a real life, I would bet Ginny will have her own autobiography books published. She was a professional Quidditch player after all.

The other day I followed a discussion about child development. If it is true, that a person's character will change a few times from childhood to adulthood, then this thread should be more specific. I think this is a thread for Ginny's teenage characterisation.

We saw the contrast between Ginny in book 1 and in book 2-3 and in book 4-5 and in book 6-7 and the epilogue. From a brave and jumpy Ginny to love-struck, "shy" Ginny to "rebellious" Ginny to calm Ginny. These are "different" Ginny characters based on her growing age and circumstances. The author already did a great job with this character, capturing the changes in time, although she won't be able to satisfy every reader.

Personally, i don't find Ginny a likable character to me. First of all, in order for a person to to liked is that they have to be relatable. Like (ok, a bit off-topic but a good example) Mia from Princess Diaries. She is like a real person who lives in our time and have normal teenage problems. Her personality is interesting. Ginny, on the other hand, is hard for me to relate to. One of the biggest reason is that i don't know her very well. She is constantly changing, quite hard to understand. I only know she has a fiery temper. And aggressive. But this isn't an endearing trait or whatever.

Why Luna is so popular is because her character is defined. Clear. Although we might not be able to relate to her, she is a very positive, lovely girl. And we can SEE that throughout the book. Neville, on the other hand, has changed quite a bit. But we can still see that good-natured dear old neville inside him. It is like seeing a friend you have known for so long and remembers him.

Ginny, she is changing too much. Her character seems to be quite unbalanced. You may see her standing up for her friends but the bad outweights the good inside her. You see a lot more of her 'angry side' than her 'nice and popular' side. For instance, her hex is great because she uses it very much, or has great practice with them. I don't take anyone who are good as hexes can come off as a very nice and popular person.

I agree completely with your whole post. Luna is, in my opinion, easy to relate to because she is constantly made fun of and is extremely unpopular. And I know that there have been times where almost anyone can relate to being alone and disliked and made fun of. Neville is just as relatable, as he is constantly trying to live up to his grandmother's expectations.

Ginny, on the other hand, was alright in the beginning of the series. In fact, I rather liked her. We've all had crushes on celebrities, which is why we could relate to her. However, in HBP she (quite out of nowhere, I might add) becomes this pretty, powerful, popular, quidditch star. In which case, I don't find her interesting or the least bit relatable.

In addition to this, I think she is rather mean and cruel in HBP. She hexes Zacharias Smith simply because he annoys her. Now, a lot of people annoy me, but I don't, say, physically hurt them every time they do so. Her treatment of Fleur is also mean and is, in fact, hypocritical, as she tells Ron not to call Luna "Loony". So, it's OK to call Fleur rude names behind her back, but not Luna?

And then, when Harry breaks up with her, she says something along the lines of, "It's for some stupid noble reason, isn't it?"

Uh, Ginny, that stupid noble reason is the reason why you're living how you are today. I have a feeling that if Harry had never had any encounters with Voldemort and had never decided that he needed to defeat Voldemort, everyone's lives would be a whole lot worse. And it is also the reason that you have a future.

To add to my previously stated reasons that I do not care for her as a character (more so in book 6 and book 7) is how she treats Dean. First of all, did she only go out with these boys to get over Harry? And why, after only just breaking up with Dean, did she allow Harry to kiss her in front of said ex-boyfriend? I don't care that she is dating, specifically, I care that she treats the boys she dates rather badly. Except Harry, 'cause she's had that fan-girl obsession with him from day one.

I'm sure I wouldn't mind Ginny as much if I didn't feel like her so-called amazingness was being shoved in my face. Other characters, like Luna, have been added to Harry's life gracefully and while making a powerful impact on me, I didn't feel like they were shoved in my face. I feel like I am obligated to like Ginny because she is Harry's one true love (apparently), but I just can't find it in myself to like her at all. And I'm not even sure if I'm making sense, but I'm doing the best I can to put my thoughts into words. I just felt that everything about her was overdone. She was too sassy and too fiery and too overly beautiful. I was hoping Harry would be with someone who had flaws, and quite frankly, was a little less popular, a little less rude, and a little more sensitive and stable and had her head firmly on her shoulders (*cough Hermione *cough). Ginny is a little to brash (like when she tells Harry in OOTP that he should talk to Sirius).

Also, in OOTP, I was annoyed when Ginny got angry at Harry for not remembering that she, too, was possessed. Well, Ginny, quite honestly Harry has other things on his mind then your possession that you hardly even can remember. And Ginny thinks that she had been through so much as she was possessed by Voldemort, but compared to Harry, she hasn't been through anything.

I'm so surprised because I think that J.K. Rowling is brilliant when it comes to characterization. So, why was Ginny hardly characterized at all, and why was she hastily (and poorly) developed in HBP?

And don't even get my started on DH. I occasionally had to put my book down to gag when reading some of the horrible scenes with Ginny.

Totally. Somehow JK Rowling kept showing us how 'brilliant' Ginny is. But it come off to me as one of those snobby girls you have in your high school. Who everybody loves, is pretty, is popular, is 'nice', treats her boyfriends like scum except for that handsome popular guy.

Actually, i think Ginny only calls Fleur names because Fleur is prettier than her!
Ginny just expects Harry to remember everything about her because she thinks she's all pretty and is a huge person in Harry's life and everybody should remember what happens to her because she is popular.

I think the reason why Ginny is so poorly developed is because JK Rowling likes Ginny too much. She wants people to interpret her and like her instantly. Like, transform that 'angel' into the girl whose perfect for Harry in your own mind.