***THIS FORUM WILL CONTAIN MAJOR SPOILERS***

This discussion forum is for the debate of changing the plot of books to fit the writers of the movies. Being a huge fan of the books, I read them and imagine the story line in my head. I don't mind small changes, or small plot details left out. The first three movies met my expectations. What started to irk me was the MAJOR plot change in the end when it was a house-elf that was supposed to instigate everything. In the fifth movie, Cho's friend Marietta was supposed to tell Umbridge about the DA, but they had to have Cho do it instead, and now the people that don't read the books have a loathing for Cho. Instead of putting this Nigel character in, they could have put Marietta in and done it right. Now in the sixth movie, Arthur gets mauled, Ginny and Harry don't even kiss and Bill isn't in the movie. Why are they changing stuff that isn't even in the books. I feel that this is an insult to Rowling. She wanted to kill Arthur in the 5th book, but couldn't bring herself to do it, but they can injure him in the sixth. He wasn't injured in the sixth book. I feel that all of these changes are wrong. What do you think?

I think tiny changes that don't affect the plot would be ok but some changes they make are too much. I don't think they should remove any characters from DH since they all are a major part of the plot!!!

WHEW! I don't want to get started on this topic...I can really run away with it. I just want to say that I COMPLETELY agree with what you both are saying. It bothers me how they are changing everything..it's not even Harry Potter anymore. How can you change such big parts of a book. I'm surprised JKR is letting them do this. She has to give them the "okay". All I know...is that they are messing up this movie and in turn it's going to mess up DH and a lot of fans are going to be up in arms. At least the ones that read the books are. Maybe someday down the road..someone with half a brain will re-make these movies and do it right. I have no film degree or anything and I know I could do a whole lot better!!!

I totally agree with you Hermione17. I just don't understand why they are doing this. Having read the seventh book, crucial plots are now affected by what they are doing. They should of thought about the books before their own egos.

I have no idea donutboy8u. Funny name by the way! HAHA
I wonder if they come on sites like vtm and read what the fans have to say? From the looks of things I'd say NOT! But like you I have no idea why they are doing this either.

1. So what if Arthur gets mauled? he doesn't die, it doesn't change the plot in anyway whatsoever, and it just supports what people said in DH about "We don't want another weasley injured" or something along those lines. They just switched it from Bill to Arthur!

2. that almost-kiss was just a moment to build up the tension, and a very smart idea from david. but it doesn't mean they don't kiss. it might just be part of the pent-up tension. even if they don't, definitely expect one in DH!

3. They don't need Bill. it'll take more money, more casting, more time...it won't change the plot. they can easily change the Bill/Fleur significance in DH to Tonks and Lupin, including the wedding and shell cottage.

------->Remember, everything they do is approved by JKR!!! we know they'll have the beginning, including the attack on the bridge, plus harry and dumbledore alone and going to see Slughorn. they'll have the burrow in the beginning, they're even going to have Weasley's Wizard Wheezes!!! they will have the train scene, in which harry's nose is broken, they'll have quidditch, lavender/ron/hermione, harry/ginny, the love potion scene with Romilda Vane, i THINK the poison scene with ron, the amortentia scene with hermione in slughorn's class, the sectumsempra scene, slughorn's xmas party, i'm pretty sure the attack on Katie, some harry-dumbledore lessons, the cave scene with the inferi, i'm pretty sure the fight in hogwarts, DD's death, hagrid's cabin burning...

many people were really worried about the movie after hearing some tiny little details about the movie. but we should really look at the fact that the glass is More than halfway full...i can't wait for the movie, and of course there will be changes, but what can we do? they are most definitely not changing everything!

Regarding #2 above:
I think that their 'near kiss' was made up to tease the audience. However, when they do kiss, it isn't like it was in the book, but in a silly, non-canon scene where Ginny ties Harry's shoelaces. Somehow, I can't imagine that scene as being romantic at all. But, it will probably draw a lot of "ohs and ahs" from the shippers in the audience.

Regarding #3 above:
Bill may not be needed in book 6, but the whole wedding scene in DH anchors on him being the groom. Why create a scene in the movie involving Remus and Tonks getting married, when the wedding extravaganza was meant for Bill and Fleur? Why would Remus and Tonks be getting married at the Burrow, when in canon they had not publicized their marriage? Personally, I'd like for the opening scenes of the DH-Part I movie to be the Bill/Fleur wedding scene, as written by Rowling in canon.

There are times when the movies change things too much, even though Rowling apparently approves the changes. To me, a lot of these changes are not all that necessary. Either film it as in the book, or not at all.

why create the scene? because it instigates the trio's journey. why make it remus/tonks instead of bill/fleur? because the producers decided to pick a couple instead of spending more time on both. and why not pick the couple with the man (remus) who movie fans already know of and who will be familiar with? it already isn't 100% canon, why stop there?
of course we'd all like it to be canon! but unless they decide to suddenly introduce bill and re-introduce fleur, i'm pretty sure it isn't going to happen!



actually the 'near kiss' is the same scene with the shoelace. she ties his shoelace then stands up straight, and suddenly they are inches apart...



yea, seven 6-hour movies will appeal to alot of people ok, sure, they want the fans to enjoy them. but many people who don't read the books DO watch the movies, and there is a wide range of people that need to be pleased here! the most important thing is to maintain the main, most important plot, and everything that affects that specific plot.

I'm picky about HBP, espically the second chapter with Snape/Cissy/Bella. In retrospect, the entire book is really leading up to Dumbledore's death at the end, Malfoy being pushed into the Dark Arts by his family, and most importantly Snape's Unbreakable Vow. In my opinoin, if they don't show the scene between the three in the beginning, it'll confuse the audience why all of a sudden Malfoy is on the tower, trying to kill Dumbledore.

The whole Harry/Ginny thing they should have kept in my opinoin. It's not a huge part of the plot, but because there is Quittich this movie, they should have the kiss, and the detentions. Even though I don't remember how Harry got the detentions in the first place.

They shouldn't be mauling Mr. Weasley, it should be Bill. Because it shows the beginning of Lupin/Tonks in the Hospital Wing, and since Teddy is born in Book 7, I think they should have indrouced him. Acually, they should have back in Movie 4, when Harry snuck in with Hagrid to see the Dragons, like it was in the books.

Oh gosh, you know, i don't even want to start myself on this, because i get so worked up. All i will say is i totally agree with HarryPotterIsLife about the Mr Weasley thing, he already got attacked by Nagini! What is he a rallying point for all dangerous magical creatures??

And as for the Bill situation...missing him out....

I really must stop myself before i resort to pulling out my hair in frustration and using language that will most definately get me banned from VTM...

I agree with most of you. These changes take away from the general assent of the books and pull from the undying work that has been done for the books. Personally, I do not agree with Merlin_most_baggy_y_fronts. This stuff can't happen, and nothing makes it right for this stuff to be changed. If major changes are made, what was the point of the books in the first place.

From the stuff i have heard is being cut i am not holding high expectations of this film.

I went to see OoTP with high expectations as it was a new director who i heard was quite good, but they missed a fair bit out of that one and from what i've heard they will be cutting even more from this film.

Most the stuff people would argue that its not that crucial but if you've read books 6 and 7 then you know it is.

I've heard that Harry and Ginny dont even kiss. Is That true? That's quite important to the roles of characters so to cut that would take quite a big bit of character relationships out.

You can tell i just saw the title of this thread then went straight to add reply instead of reading the reply's you guys have posted, i will do that now

i agree with OllieHampson in terms of not having high expectations for this film. they seem to be changing everything! and personally, it bugs me when the movies stray to far from the books.
not only is Bill not going to be in it, but Myrtle is also cut. which means the Sectumsempra scene will either be cut or majorly modified. and ive mentioned this in the DODDD thread, that the movie will just not be the same if that scene is majorly modified.
but what really got to me was the whole near-kiss thing between Harry & Ginny. sure it'll be a bit of a teaser, but if they dont kiss at all, i will be majorly disappointed. one of this books major storylines was about their relationship.

I know I'm doing this out of order but oh well.

1. Harry/Ginny kiss: When I first read the article about them almost kissing, I just figured, oh, well, thats probably just an almost-kiss leading up to the real kiss. Then I got on the internet and people were saying there is no kiss. My friend and I flipped out because, yes, the series is about adventure and good vs. evil, but some fans love romance just as much as the adventure part.

I do think they will have a kiss, though. I think with the shoelace scene they will have Ginny tie his shoe, and then her face will be really close to Harry's. They'll be so close to kissing and then they hear the Death Eaters outside the Burrow(atleast thats where I think this scene takes place). I remember because they added in a scene at the Burrow where the Death Eaters attack, so I think thats what will happen.

2.Bill: I think they made a mistake in cutting Bill and Fleur. How hard would it be to add them in? They'd take up about 3 or 4 minutes at that, but atleast we'd still see them. J.K. told them not to cut Kreacher and he was in it for about 1 minute, so why can't they just add Bill and Fleur in there somewhere. Also the whole thing with Mr. Weasley getting attacked is just stupid. Fifth book he gets attacked. Sixth movie he gets attacked. Seventh he loses his son. Writer made a huge mistake.

I'm hoping this movie isn't messed up, because I'm really looking forward to everything, especially the Pensieve scenes between Dumbledore and Harry. They're going to be my favorite.

hey guys.

just popped in to put a really really nice link:

All- Inclusive HBP movie info

it's a really good page that goes chapter by chapter of the book, naming what's definitely in the movie. it's really good. take a look at it! i was even surprised at how much was in...

Ok, I'll try not to totaly lose it here *ahem* first of all, I am very unhappy with the decision to cut Bill. It honestly would be that hard to cast a guy to play him. I mean, there putting in characerts that arn't in the book (like Nigule (sp?) for example; he's not important to the plot at all) Why can't they have Bill and Fleur in the movie? Is it really that difficult? And also, why do they have to put Mr. Weasley in his place? If the mauling is that important to the plot than why don't they have Bill mauled? If there going to drop that plot line than drop it.
Also, if there cutting Bill and Fleur in the 6th movie does that mean no wedding in the 7th one? If there isn't a wedding there isn't the scene with the great aunt (whoes name is excaping me at the moment ) I guess that the wedding could be Tonks and Lupins instead but that wouldn't make very much sence considering that two of them are in a sort of hiding I'm sorry but this makes me very angry. Is it that hard to stick to what JKR wrote? I'm not a film maker so I don't know but, really, I don't think it would be that difficult. Or at least I don't think it would be anymore difficult that twisting everything she writes

To No George without Fred, I am in total agreement with you. That is exactly the point that I am trying to make. It is is very sad to see that the writers feel that they can change whatever they want just because they know they can. All they have their minds set on in making a movie appealing to most audiences. But what about the audiences that have read the book and expect the stuff to be true to the books? Its just not fair.

No George without Fred. You totally put everything I was thinking. By the way it was Aunt Muriel Nigel isn't in the book. They could make this look like Dennis Creevy but why not call him by his real name? Like you No George without Fred I really don't like how they changed Mr. Weasley to getting mauled. He's already been attacked by Voldemort's snake {I know her name I just don't want to spell it to incorrectly}. Bill and Fleur's wedding is also important because that's when the Trio leave the Burrow. It's also where the get the contents of the will and, like you said Aunt Muriel tells about the Dumbledores. If Bill and Fleur aren't married then what about Shell Cottage? Just because of them not casting for Bill a lot of things are changed in the 7th book that are important. We can't change it, but it is a good thing to talk about the changes and get ideas from them.
~Squish

I just saw the layout on the movie {see 1st page of topic}. It was awsome!!!!!!!! It made me mad about a couple of things though. Lupin and Tonks are already a couple. That means no argument at the end of the movie. The Burrow attack? I have no clue what that could mean. that is the only time Tonks is in the movie. If you haven't seen the movie layout I tell you. You have to go see it!!

I also read the HPB movie info link quoted above and was amazed by what is to be included in the movie. All the information has been gathered and sourced appropriately making the page authentic. The page even includes sections of the movie script.

I know for certain I am not the only one who has serious problems with how the Half Blood Prince movie is turning out, and it hasn't even been released yet...

A few things that concern me, and may concern you are:

-The "playful and funny" description that Yates gave the movie

-The rumor that Dumbledore's funeral may be cut

-Keeping and possibly adding to Quidditch scenes while more important ones are cut

-To tie in with the above, the Gaunt's being cut


These are in no way the full extent of the problems I have, nor what there actually are.
What are your personal problems with how the film seems to be turning out?

Is it Fleur and Bill's relationship being cut? How will Harry, Ron, and Hermione end up on there own at the beginning of Deathly Hallows if there is no wedding?

Is it aggravating that instead of merely casting the character of Bill and letting him get mauled by Greyback, they instead removed him, but let Mr. Weasley get attacked?

Basically, what do you find is going to be wrong with the movie upon release, based on quotes, rumors, interviews, pictures, or other sources you're encountered?

Ok, so I just went back and read through the think on the first page and I am appuled. I am angry for a number of reasons the biggest being Tonks is only in 1 scene!!! My absolute favorite part of the 6th book is the bit in the hospital wing after Dumbledore dies where we find out Tonks and Lupin are in love and Fleur really does love Bill and that scene can't be in the movie! I litterally squeeled when I found out that Tonks and Lupin were married in the 7th one and they totally take the 'magic' (if you will) out of that relationship for me. And I don't know if this apply's to anyone else but I'm takin' this all very personally right now LOL Tonks and Lupin are some very beautiful characters with a gorgously writen intertwining story line. I wish the film makers could at least try to give them, and JKR, the quality of movie that they diserve to exisit in.


(Now, please forgive me for I know that made no sence)

They should stay as true as possible to the books. JK worked really hard and the stories are fabulous as they are! Also, it's really stupid to cut out characters who will be significant in DH. If they had stayed truer to the books in the past few films they would have less problems introducing characters.

That said, I love all the films so far and I bet I'll love the rest of them.

I think the reason that changes are being made is because the movie might be too depressing for people who haven't read the books.

Hunt330 said


Dumbledore's funeral may be cut because it's really sad, and the movie might not flow as well if it was left in.

Yates made it funny, probably because it's a dark book, and if left so, would make a scary movie. It needs humor.

The Gaunts' scene may be confusing and to vast for people who haven't read the books, so that's why they might be cut...

And you see the point. I'm only looking at the situation through a moviemaker's eyes, it't not saying that I'm happy about any of this...

So I'm trying really really hard not to cry right now, but it's getting really really hard. I mean, the fact that it's PG, the fact that Dumbledore's funeral might not be there (that's like my favorite writing of the entire book), and the fact that Bill isn't going to be in it? Tears!

Oh, cutting out the Gaunts? I really liked that, just cause it adds a lot to the Dark Lords character. I mean, yeah, being a Death Eater, that's like old news, but still. I wanted to see them! Like, I can understand a lot of these changes, but I think they're taking way to much liberty here, and significantly more than they have for any of the other movies. Like, the fifth one, they cut here and there, but really, that just flowed so well without the extra, cause the book was way too long. And with the fourth one, they did cut, and change like with the World Cup scene, but I liked that flow, and cutting out the first chapter worked well too. Ooooh! They better have chapter one of this book, cause I squealed really loud when I read that, cause it was the first time we'd seen that deeply into another characters head, and it just opens up sooo much!

Anyways, I think I'm done ranting, but really, want I wanted to say in there is that they are taking too much liberty, and that with this book especially, it needs to stay true to the text because of what it contains. I would have cut out the humor if it was too long to focus on the drama, especially the last bit, cause that's just beautiful (the rubies line? yeah, my second fav in the book. my least fav? the sectumsempra chapter, cause he was being an idiot. followed closely by him kissing ginny, in the way that he did). But, then again, I am a Death Eater.

~Aeryn~


PS. I just said like waay too much. Shows you how not awake I am!

People chill... Makers are not in this for charity or to make others happy, they are in to make money facts be damned. They are giving what most people want? People wish to see a Candyfloss romantic comedy with sparkles and fairies so the makers are giving it to them. They put in dark scenes and all of a sudden there are howls of protests from parents saying how depressing the movie is and the kids are scared, not a family movie .....The makers also know very well, regardless of what they do, People will come to see the movie and the cash registers will be ringing. The same people who are shedding tears for Bill, for Tonks for James T Kirk or whoever, will be the first ones gushing about ... how awesome the quidditch scenes were.. or how romantic that Harry and Ginny kiss, Draco is so cute.... and what not. The fact remains whatever the films contain, there will be people to watch them and the makers revel in this while laughing all the way to the bank

Let's let the MODs tell people to 'chill'.

Of course the movie makers are in it for the money and they are not really concerned with staying true to canon as long as they get to the end result which is Harry destroying Horcruxes and Voldemort. How they get there is immaterial to them.

Unfortunately those of us who read and enjoy the books will be extremely disappointed with the chop-job and the direction Yates took this movie. I for one am sorely disappointed with the fact that the movie has a more comical/romantic feel rather then the steady dark progression that JKR intended. There is a way to stay true to the tone of the book without taking it into the 'R' category or diluting it so much so that it carries a 'PG' rating. The trick is finding the balance.

There are many scenes that I am concerned with. IF there is no wedding, how are they going to introduce the Ministry falling, Mr. Lovegood and The Trios escape/start of the Horcrux search? If they are going to specifically put Quidditch back in, at least let Harry and Ginny kiss. Why did the vampire have to be included? DD funeral shouldn't even be rumored to be cut...it is much too important. I find it hard to believe that they could cast the Carrows and Yaxley but leave out Bill/Fluer and reduce Tonks scene to just one!

Those of us who read the books are just going to have to try and see the movies as seperate entities...something else Harry Potter that has some creative freedoms in it to make it highly entertaining. Unfortunately with this is that the movies often mislead the general public (like the Cho/Marietta snitch thing). I have friends who have never read the books but insist that Cho is the snitch and only after physically opening my book and showing them she is not, do they say 'Oh, maybe I should read this thing.' Of course they never do.

I think that the directors should be able to cut little things out: the stuff that doesn't make a big difference in the plot. HBP is a massive book and they can't fit in every little detail. It is important that they stay faithful to the story, and not flip things around. I get really upset when they change things in movie adaptations of books, especially in the HP series.



I completely agree with you Amanda, and that fact makes me completely upset. As long as the end result is the same, they think they can change things around. Though I'm not sure how many Potter fans would like that. I, for one, wouldn't see it if the plot had been changed, or key characters cut out.

About those rumors, I think all of them should be put in. It says that they added a new scene in the movie-- probably why they had to cut something. I don't think that is fair to JKR, or faithful to the books.

I don't think it should be the 'comedic romance' that it is being built up to be. It is one of the darkest books, and the start of the big battle. I don't see anything wrong with trying to make it happier, but it also shouldn't be all lovey-dovey.

OK, time for my 2cents...

I agree with Amanda and HarryLFCfan in that the studios are in this to make money and they will do all they can to bring in the largest audience. I'm not happy about the cuts, seeing as how I really liked HBP, but if I may, here are some possible "reprieves" for why they're doing what they're doing:

Cutting Bill (and therefore Fleur) from HBP - if they are going to focus on actors who have already been cast (Lupin and Tonks) they can save money from hiring more actors. The movie-only audience already knows/recognizes Lupin and Tonks and the powers-that-be can capitalize on this. Somehow, they could have a "small wedding" at the Burrow for Lupin and Tonks and still manage to get all the necessary information in that happened at Bill and Fleur's wedding. Lupin and Tonks could also have Shell Cottage (or similar) for the trio to retreat to.

Don't know how having Mr. Weasley getting mauled is necessary only to make sure Greyback is introduced somehow since he is needed for DH.

I can understand not having DDs funeral. It was a very moving part of the book, but I can't remember anything significant that happened there that would affect DH if it's not included in the movie. However, from Merlin_ Most_Baggy_Y-Front's post to a chapter-by-chapter breakdown of the movie, here is what is said about the funeral:
The rumour is the funeral has been cut, however it seems it's just been "adapted" due to a comment made by Yates:
Quote:
"The film's playfulness is going to be great, and Dumbledore's death will be quite moving. Steve has taken the funeral from the book and written a beautiful scene. One of Jo's recurring themes is death and loss, and even though the sixth movie is playful and funny, Steve has adapted that Half-Blood Prince scene in a very poignant, plaintive, and special way"
This page is worth the read. This is the same page that Merlin_most_baggy_y-front directed us to (great name, btw!).

Ginny and Harry's "almost" kiss - that's because they are going to pair Ginny and Neville and Harry and Hermione in DH (JUST KIDDING - but perhaps they are keeping their options open for other ships/scenarios for DH, not that it would make anyone happy).

Nigel - is he now a character in the movies? I thought in OotP that he was Colin, until someone called him "Nigel" during the DA scenes. Kind of surprised me. I agree that it would have made more sense to keep "Nigel" as a character that already existed.

To answer Amanda's question about "why did they put the Vampire in " - it's because of "Twilight"! Vampires are very in vogue right now

Even though Moaning Myrtle has been cut, the Sectumsempra scene is in the movie, and from what I have read, there is a lot of blood involved!

Casting the Carrow's and Yaxley also makes sense if they are going to play important roles in DH, which they did, so at least those that did not read the books (heathens) can at least have some idea as to who they are.

It sounds like a lot will stay the same and a lot will change, so we'll all just have to sit back and enjoy the ride!

The obvious: Money makes the world go round.

I don't think, in a way, from their point of view it's bad - because that is how the production house gets their pay cheques.

But, some changes that really were unnecessary was the introduction of Nigel.

As ChannelingGinny puts it, they're doing away with Bill and Fleur - which is BAD - and moving on with Remus and Tonks because the movie audience is familiar with them and it saves new actors' payments.

But then, this is exactly why the casting of 'Nigel' is so ambiguous. They could have - should have, in fact stayed with Colin Creevey, because of hs obvious VITAL role in the DH.

Now, if they get him back, those who just watch the movies won't know what importance or lack of, thereof, was Colin. I'm not saying he wasn't important, but then cutting his character makes it like that according to the producers.

I don't know what's gone wrong with David Heyman, Steve Kloves.

I mean, these guys worked with the first three movies as well, and they were up to the mark, if not better.

I enjoy the movies overall, but sometimes I wonder why they do some of the things they do. Such as leaving out Marietta in OOTP, which had the consequences of portraying Harry's relationship with Cho completely differently to how it was in the book.
But that's old now, so regarding HBP, are they really going to include the vampire? I find that stupid, he was hardly in the books and I couldn't care less about a vampire being in the movie, as I haven't read twilight. People surely aren't going to go and see harry potter just because there's a vampire in one scene? They could have paid someone to be Bill instead!
Anyway I'm sure it will still be entertaining.

I really don't know why they're leaving out all the really important bits.
I mean, not having Dumbledore's funeral!!!! And what about the battle? They say they're leaving it out because there's already the big fight in DH, but come on! It still would have been good to see!
All of us could make the series way better than them, and we're not even filmmakers!!!
I'm really cheesed off about it basically.
Let's just hope they at least do DH justice, otherwise there's going to be a lot of angry people out there!!!

They said they arn't going to have the DH battle?! Why? Most of the character die there... I think I'd cry if they didn't have the final battle. What about the final Horucrux? It's at the bloody school! And how can they not have a battle but kill Voldemort? Ah! They better keep it in... for their own good.

I actually think they shouldn't make any changes at all, but as a compromise, I think they can make small changes that don't affect the plot, and change the movies for the better.

No, they're still doing the DH battle Aira, it's the HBP battle they're not doing. I wonder how they're going to do Dumbledore's death though, without it? Because in all the fighting and confusion, that's when Snape's supposed to come up to the tower and kill him.
I suppose we'll just have to wait and see.