I really am very curious about this too. I read in one of Jo's recent interviews that the veil was not used for execution, but for study. They studied death. So...I re-read the part about harry looking at it and he was being lead there by the voices. he was curious about them. But..only the people thatknew death could hear the voices. There is some connection between veil/ and seeing or knowing death to completly understand it. That's my theory anyway.

I think that the veil is the future because in book 3 Trelawney says something about the veiled mysteries of the future and the veil was in a room near where there was loads of stuff to do with the future and time like time turners and that jar that turned the death eaters head into a baby and prophesys.

I think that the Sirius is not dead, because it JUST so happens, that Harry and Neville were the only children to see him "die", but had it been Ron or Ginny, when they saw him "die", they would have been able to see Thestrals now, meaning that he actually did die. But J.K. Rowling made it so that people who were able to already see Thestrals saw Sirius "die".

Hi nestea_king, welcome to the forums!!

As you're new to this forum, I'd strongly suggest that you spend a few moments reading this thread before you post again. It contains all the information you'll need as a newbie, including the rules that you'll need to abide by when posting.

Firstly, your post is off-topic. This thread is for discussing general thoughts/theories about The Veil. If you want to talk about it in relation to Sirius and whether or not he really is dead, you can do so here. It was pinned like this thread so I can't see how you could have missed it. Please be more careful next time okay?

Secondly, you aren't allowed to double post. If you want to add/edit something, then please use the "Edit" button at the top right of your post. As you can see I've done it for you this time but don't expect me to make a habit of it.

If you have any further questions, feel free to contact any one of us mods via PM (Private Mail).

but what if the veil was atually a portal of sorts to a different dimension so those who pass through it exist but in an alternate dimension from ours, so it would have nothing to do with death or life?

i think that the veil is a portal to another world and sirius cant get out untill harry defeats voldermort and that the final battle will take place behind the viel

J.K Rowling didn't say much about the veil at all, so I think it will play an important role in book 7. It seems that everything thing mentioned in the Potter series is always important. Maybe there is a way to reserect people who fall through the veil.

MOD EDIT: Hi there, Potion Druid! Minor netspeak was spotted in your post('ppl'...). Please take a quick swing by the rules! Thanks!

the veil is simply the place that symbolizes sirius's death. as we all know, the veil's in the death chamber of the dom. well it definitely means that dead people are in the veil. like what luna said, there still a way to be connected with sirius, and that's by talking to him in the veil. since the voices of dead people are heard there. i do believe that sirius is already dead. (but i hope his not) coz' if his not dead, then he could not be in the veil. i think it's a bit of an impossible thing that you are in the veil but you're alive. i was also thinking that harry could be back again in the department of mysteries to communicate with sirius or even his parents, since he already knew that there could be a way... well this is just an opinion.

hahaha! good question! actually the answer would be no! of course a person cannot be in the veil if he's dead. come and think of it, if you're not dead and you just put your foot in there, then nothing will probably happen. the veil's not like a vacuum cleaner at all. this one reason why i was thinking that sirius really dead because if he's not dead, then he should not be in the veil.... just an opinion.

I didn't read all the comments, SO if I reitterate something, I'm sorry.
First of all, Lupin knew right away that Sirius was dead right? Sirius's closet friend, knew it and DD said it was true. Therefore I beleive that the two of them, and hte rest of the order are 100% sure he is dead. My question is that was it possible for Sirius to apparate as he was falling. I know that this was highly unlikely and very doubtful, but WHAT IF???? Where would he be if no one knew where he was?? I'm not asking for an opinion about whether he is alive or not, I am asking that if he was alive and did apparate before falling into the veil, where would he be and what would he be doing? I fear that i am shooting an empty barral and I truely feel that the veil is the death chamber and that all that were sentences to death instead of Azkaban were forced through this entrance. I stongely beleive that in the old days that type of sentence was a spectacle, for not only the judge and jury but by those who where related to or friends with the deceased via the accused. In other words, like watching a convicted murderer getting lethal injection.
What do you all think????

I think that the veil might just be a sort of gateway to death. For those who choose to go they just die, for those who fight it, they become trapped in the veil. I also think it is for punishment. With all the seating around it and such. Maybe for people who are soooo bad that they have to be put to death.

i think that if sirus had apparated wen he fell then (grr i cant remember his name at moment) the house elf wouldnt obey harry because he would have still been linked to sirus not harry im sorry folks but sirus is dead

I think if Sirius was really going to die and stay dead, then J.K Rowling wouldn't have done it in such a roundabout way. If he was going to die, it would have been much clearer (not to mention easier to write) if he was just hit by the killing spell.

By having Sirius fall through the veil it raises questions about his death, making it uncertain. Everybody knows that if you're uncertain whether someone has died or not, they're most definitely still alive. It's a bit of a writing cliche, I think.

well, heres what i dont get,

do you remember when they first saw the veil, and hermione was like "stay away from it" well, why were they all transfixed, remember harry had to pull ginny away, and the only people who were not transfixed were harry and luna..because they have seen death? well, i am very confused, and i hope that rowling will ellaborate...i think that sirius is dead, but i also think that harry will get to speak to him again, wether there is a portrait some where like there are of all the old headmasters, or maybe harry will die, or almost die,and he will see sirius, or something like that, but i know that we have not seen the last of sirius black.

I agree with you Karen ! There are proves that Dumbledore made mistakes, not only in fifth book, in six also, and maybe that was cause of...(I won`t submit spoilers! . Besides I think the Veil is the secret entrance to the death But why Sirius didn`t became a ghost ?! Nearly-Headless Nick said, that only people who wasn`t happy in their life become a ghosts ! Sirius couldn`t be happy at all. He was wanted, he was stuck in Grimmauld Place, Molly was doubting his responsibility and Snape was nagging him ! He was nearly depressed !! His only hope was Harry, Harry was his light ! But he wasn`t happy ! I think J. K. Rowling will explain it in seventh book

Well you can't become a ghost if you aren't dead.

MOD EDIT: Hiya Darkened Rei, and welcome to the VTM forums! I'm going to have to ask you to take a swing by the rules. One-liners are not permitted. Thanks!

I really doubt the veil will play any more part in the series. The veil is not necisserily something to do with death, Sirius FELL through it and as he was dead couldn't get back through.

When I read about the Veil, i thought, what for vale is devised????? Why they don't desroy it??? it so dangerous, bu maybe they can't do that?? pity....

what a pitythat Siriuss died, he was my favourite character
stupid vale....

sirius is defenatly dead i trust DD

MOD EDIT : Please read the rules - one-liners are not allowed in the forums.

[FONT=Impact][SIZE=7][COLOR=purple]
I think the veil is a door into the world of the dead, i think the people who work in the department of mysteries are studying where the people who die and don't come back as ghosts, go.

I think that when you walk or fall throught the veil it is like a maze behind it and sirius might have fallen into it and can't find his way out and therefore people think that he is dead when he could be alive!?
That does sound a bit weird I know and I fined that coming into my head so I posted it to share my thoughts!

I do also think harry will someday see sirius again in a form that JKR has not discussed yet just to surprise us!

Sirius is definitely gone from and unable to come back to the world of the living. Rowling has explicitly sad this!

For me, the question is whether or not he is Dead. It almost seems like Dante's Divine Comedy, where there is a lone living person in the land of the dead, searching for the person they have lost. Will Sirius have to walk through hell to get to heaven. (I bet he doesn't have Socrates as a guide tho!)

Cheers,
Acroman

the archway with the veil: it is just a metaphore of death in my opinion.
think of it: when poepole die they sort of "desappear" one moment they are with us and next moment they are just..gone, they sort of fall behind that veil...
that's why i really think sirius is dead...it can't be otherwise..his is not a strange death, that's simple how popole die..

I think Sirius is dead, but I think Harry will find a way of talking to him again. In the fifth book 'Order Of The Phoenix' Luna Lovegood, said near the end of the book, that 'they never really leave us'. I'm sure the veil will be an important part in the seventh book.

i agree with margueritadolcevita... i believe that the veil is a metaphor for death.
but then i have another theory..i think that Sirius is trapped in a place between life and death. like a dimension. there was someone who mentioned *forgot who it was* that they thought that maybe depending on how old the person was in which you saw die or in which way (ie. harry-serderick*young*, Luna-mom*young*, Neville-grandpa*old, ginny-encountered death in a sense) there's a passage in the book where it explains that Harry and Luna both come to look closely at the veil, but Nevile and Ginny are staring at it. could this mean that they heard it also? i think so.
but back to what veil and if sirius is alive...I think that Sirius is alive, but is unable to communicate to anyone from behind the *thin curtain* and to luna and harry hearing voices, maybe those are the voices of spirits, either coaxing them to get closer *maybe a spell* or souls of the dead asking for help to be free. from the dimension or place that is behind the curtain...
well. comment on anything, and feel free to not agree
[COLOR=green][FONT=Arial]

I firmly believe that Sirius is dead..... but I also think that there has to be more to it than that. To me, the veil is a little bit like the thestrals. Luna could hear the voices, right? She could also see the thestrals, and, after reading the sixth book, we know she isn't as crazy as she appears. I think the veil sort of..... holds the spirits of those who have passed away. The whispers are kind of like the people who have died, talking to you, and for Harry, I think it will mean a way for him to contact Sirius. But I DON'T think Sirius will (or can) come back to life.

On a related note, Harry was with his mother when she died, right? How come he couldn't see the thestrals before Cedric died? It is unlikely that his vision was obscured, and he did not see her die. Also, in their fourth year, the imposter Moody showed them the three unforgivable curses. He killed a spider for everyone to see. Why could Ron and Hermione not see the thestrals? Just something to think about, I really have no clue.

I think Sirius is dead, but I think the veil will come up again in the seventh book, and we will find out a lot more about it, I think it's a way of communicating to the dead, the people who have lost someone close to them, could hear the voices, Nevile had lost his grandad, Luna had lost her mother, Harry had lost his parents (later Sirius dies.)

Well, I think the veil is a place wher some ppl's spirits or ghosts go. They all go to different locations, obviously-they're not all at Hogwarts.
So teh veil is just one of those places, excpet maybe they're trapped.

Ive forgotten what a metaphor is, will someone remind me what it is? Sorry if I seem really thick!

I thought it was interesting that Harry and Luna could hear the voices while the others could not. So, I agree that to hear the voices, you have to have witnessed death.

It is curious, then, to wonder if that is because Luna and Harry so want to hear from those who are dead? Sort of like the Mirror of Erised where you see what you most desire, but not truth.

Along that vein, I wonder if the Mirror of Erised will appear in the Department of Mysteries at some point?

Another curiousity for me was the way the veil moved as if there were a light breeze. I can't quite figure out why that would be.

Omg when I read the 4th, 5th, & 6th books i cried for days! Seriously! In the 4th movie i burst out into tears. I really hope J.K. brings Serius back, but she probably wont. Man Serius was too good to die. Maybe the Viel is like a portal to a new world, but then what about what Luna said, her mom was behind the viel. I feel bad about saying this but, Serius is gone forever!

MOD EDIT : Hiya, could you please drop by the rules page here before you post again, thanks? Netspeak is not allowed in the forums - "4ever" should have been "forever" which I've now edited. Please make sure you type in full next time.

I agree with you 'Cwitch', I've finally come to a decision, that Sirius is really gone for ever! I really didn't want him to die, we only had Sirius for three of the books. But I think there is something very mysterious about the veil, and I hope we find out about it in book seven. I acn't wait for it to come out!

I don't care is some one already said this, but I'm just gonna chuck it out there.
I think the Department of Mysteries is going to be Harry's weapon against Lord Voldemort. The room of love, the Death Room, and the weird brains. I am thinking Harry is going to somehow harness the power of love and use it against Voldemort, and then thrust him through the veil. I believe Sirius to be dead and gone, but if he's not, then he will make another appearance in Book the Seventh.
However, what if Harry never becomes powerful enough to bring down Voldemort? Of course there's the horcruxes to deal with, and I hope he finds them. But how did Dumbledore ever destroy them? Hmm... the veil perhaps? I don't think Voldemort's body could ever be put in a tomb, it's just not right.
If you have read the Silmarillion, think of this. I'm not completely 100% on this, but I know Morgoth was thrust through a door to the Void. The veil leads to the Void, and Voldemort is going to be sent through it, somehow.
Just food for thought, and althought it's untidiness may make you not want to eat the food, just think it through.

I agree with you, 'JRC11828', I do think Harry is going to kill Voldemort by using the Department of Mysteries', and I think the veil plays a big part in the books about death.

I think that, in order for Harry to kill Voldemmort, Harry will have to use something simple, that Voldemort did not think of. For example, love. There is a lot of ways that HArry could kill Voldemort with, but I dont' think J.K Rowling has let on too much.

just a thought. what if the 'souls' of those that have been sucked out//kissed by the dementors reside behind the veil? or what if the veil has to do with dementors, I only thought of this because the description of the veil is similar to the description of how a dmentor looks. Like the ragged cloth...similar to the 'cloak' of the dementor. I dont know...sometimes weird theories come about...

That is a really good idea, 'glamourchochang', maybe the veil is like a Dementor, it sucks the happiness out from people, by killing someone.

Nicky_92...thanks but I didnt mean it the way you interpreted it...I meant maybe the souls of those who had the souls sucked out of them went to the veil so that behind the veil lies several lost souls...

...I wonder if dementors come from lost souls, craving happiness so they suck it out from others...even though they are seen as dark creatures...

Nicky_92...no problem

okay so i'm kind of waiting for someone to disregard my theory....anyone?? always up for a good debate!

or any new ideas?

A thought: Dumbledore never told Harry how to destroy Horcruxes. It's a banned subject in the library. Harry's going to have to find out for himself. But I've just realised a dead simple way that he can destroy them: Chuck them all throught the veil, and then push Voldy after them! That would solve soooo many problems for him...

I have a few questions:

Hermione is the only one not to be attracted by the veil. Why? She's the only muggle born, could it be that?

If it's because she knew what the veil is, she would have tried to explain some things to Harry. And she would have said something to the others in the DoM to be careful not to fall in.

I doubt it was used for execution : I think that Hermione (who reads a lot) and all the others who have grown up in a wizard family would know about it and not been so attracted by it.

On the other side, some (at least) of the adults know that veil (how much?). If it really was a nasty piece of dark magic, why wouldn't have Snape granted himself the pleasure of at least mentioning it in one of him lessons?

The benches? I think that Voldermord just put them here to have his deatheaters witnessing "comfortably" his killing of Harry (comfortably : not because he cares about his deatheaters, but rather as an expression of his megalomania : they have to have the best conditions to witness his victory).

Another question : do people have to be near to "get in"? Luna thinks her mum and Herry's parents are in there. If she is right, they weren't nearby the veil when they died.

Well, I know, only questions, no answers (or attempts to). But what do you think of it?

I agree with you that Hermione is not attracted to the veil due to her being muggle-born. Why? I can only guess that if the veil "holds" witches and wizards who have passed on, and she has never really experienced the death of a witch or wizard, she would not be attracted to it. Thats my hypothesis.

I comletely disagree with you for multiple reasons about your second comment: