We all know that DD was famous for "getting rid of" the dark wizard Grindelwald, so does that mean that DD could have had on of his own? He did say that he thought that seperating his soul was cheating nature but would DD have done it for a greater good?

DD always did say that there were worst things than death but he may have found a way to cheat death just for a little bit until he completes his destany. I find that a logical explanation for him to seperate his soul for a good purpose.

If he does have a Horocurx(s) what would it be? I believe that when Harry pulled the sword out of the sorting hat and was GG's, he some how knew that he would have to be there in the end. Therefore i thing that it is the sword because it has a powerful history.

They said Horocurx's were the darkest of magic. Dd was a very very good wizard, and Prof. Slughard (sp?) said that Dd would be mad if he heard him talking about horocurx's to LV. So I think he didn't have one.

I really don't think so. Even apart from my not believing that Dumbledore would try to evade death (as he does not fear it), I still don't believe that he would have a horcrux. I don't believe that DD would think it necessary for him to be there at the end. He knows that it's Harry's fight, and I think that he would believe that his part is over. And if that isn't enough for you, there's also the fact that a horcux is a piece of very dark magic. I don't believe that Dumbledore would have anything to do with the Dark Arts. He knows that there is great power to be found elsewhere (Love), and would not consort with the dark side in a vain pursuit of power or immortality. That's just not the Dumbledore we all know and love (and will deeply, deeply miss).

The book said that Horocruxes (SOrry however you spell it) were dark and evil magic. Why would DD, the leader of the Order Of the Pheonix, the secret organization AGANST all the bad and evil things that Voldemnort does and did, have a hororocux which splits up the soul a pure essence. Besides Voldemore looked really twsited bacsue he split up his sould while DD looked completly normal.

I like that theory, except, could Dumbledore really kill anyone? I mean, sure he's the greatest wizard of modern times, but he has mroe love than even Harry i think. So even if we could somehow kill a person, I highly doubt that he'd part with a peice of his soul.

Actually, I thought that at first as well, but then I remembered he was known for defeating that one wizard. I don't remember his name though. How else would you defeat the wizard if not by killing him?

Dd didin't have to kill Grindewald to defeat him. As he keeps reminding everyone, there are worse things then death. Whatever these 'worse things' are, I'm sure he used to defeat grindewald.

As for Dd creating a Horcrux, I don't think he would solely because he seems perfectly ok with the concept of having to die. Besides, JK said that Harry will have to face his destiny alone, so I don't think Dd will be comming back, unfortunately

I can't believe DD having a Horcrux of his own. First of all, because he does not fear death("to the well organised mind, death is but the next great adventure", and his is a well-organised mind, obviously). Second, because it is very Dark Magic and I don't think DD has ever done any kind of it, being the most powerfuk good wizard(and more powerful than the best of Dark wizards).

I would think that the evidence is strongly against DD having a horcrux.

As has been mentioned before, they are reported as being the darkest of the dark and so, instantly DD wouldn't be intersted. Also, I'm thinking that it isn't simply killing that tears a soul in two, beacause aurors may have had to kill before and what'not, it must be simply to do with the intent of one human being to kill the other, killing in defence shouldn't be the same as cold-blooded killing.

I would think that DD would maybe know of other ways to cheat death if he felt so inclined, I think that maybe he just knew that it was meant to be in that time and place and let go. Or maybe, in his weakened state, he was unable to perform any charm that would allow him to hang on to this plane of existance.

I don't want my theory to run endlessly into a long message.Itz simple and staright as this:

If Voldemort had the sense enough to stall his death by the use of HORCRUXES, wouldn't Dumbeldore have done the same?? After all, he was fully aware that at some point of time his life would be endangered and that his presence of extremely necessary.

Moreover, the hints given by Dumbledore, "I will only truly have left when none here are loyal to me" and those given by JKR all add up to the porbability that DUMBLEDORE UNDOUBTEDLY LEFT HORCRUXES FOR HIMSELF....YOu may say that he did not wish for immortality, but the scenario here is quite different!

And in a recent interview, JKRhas pointed out that "we still have more to know about Dumbledore..." and that his death is "THE BIG THEORY"!!

I see your point but I don't think it's very likely. The point of making a horcrux is that you're afraid of death, which we have ascertained Dumbledore is not - if he wanted immortality he would have used the philosopher's stone while it still existed.

Also, the process requires one to kill in a manner that you can never realistically see Dumbledore doing...

I wonder if Voldemort knows more about Dumbledore and we'll hear about it during the 7th book?

Some how I don't think Dumbledore would make Horcruxes, it seemed to me that it was dark magic since to create one you have to murder someone and I don't think Dumbledore would do that. Plus you have to split your soul and I can't see that having any positive affects on a person.

I don't think Dd would use Horcruxes because like the other have said, splitting your soul is very dark magic.

However I could see him taking other means which we don't know about yet to, maybe not come back to the living, but somehow I don't think we've seen the last of Albus.

Although I did think the same about Sirius . . .

Dumbledore would not consider Voldemort as having sense (as AlbusD writes) for splitting his soul and wishing for immortality. This is a theme that Rowling touches on in many (if not all) of her books. His quote of only leaving Hogwarts when they are none loyal to him talks about his spirit and not his body. Dumbledore highly values an intact soul and he wouldn't make a Horcrux "for the greater good". If you become evil to fight "the bad guys", you have lost.

No, Dd didn't make a Horcrux. Proof for that is that Dd said that you had to destroy all the horcruxes before destroying the peice of soul in the body. Dd's soul would have been ripped from his body but was still there, just like with voldy, but this did not happen so it would make sense that he doesn't have a Horcrux.

I actually thought about this the moment that Dumbledore was killed. But I think it was mainly because I wanted him to still be alive, not because I actually thought he'd have one.

I don't think Dumbledore would have a Horcrux. The reasons being:

1. Horcruxes are exremely dark magic. DD loathes the Dark Arts. I don't think DD would have anything to do with any kind of dark magic, with the possible exception of killing Voldemort or another evil wizard or witch.

2. Dumbledore seems comfortable with death, uncomfortable with having half a soul. He would most definitely rather be dead than live a cursed life with half a soul. He explained thoroughly to Harry how awful (in his eyes) that life is with half a soul. He would see no point in doing something evil to help the greater good. I think he would see that as defeating the purpose. And he doesn't fear death at all. He speaks of it as the next journey, the next adventure. The only reason, I feel, that he would wish to stay alive, would be to help Harry/The Order/Hogwarts students/etc. This is a possibility, because DD knows how important he is to the Wizarding World. But on the other hand, he also has full confidence in Harry's skills and determination in destroying the Horcruxes and defeating Voldemort. I think his confidence in Harry is so strong that he knows Harry can do it alone.

I don't think he has one, but I'm not completely against the idea....(I'm in denial.)

DD doesn't need a Horcrux!

He kept his soul entire and it became a phoenix. A phoenix can allways help anyone, who stays loyal to him. And his portrait can give Harry all the answers he needs.

I dont think that Dumbledore had a Horcrux, because even if for some reason he hade to take a life and split his soul, Slughong implied that this was nothing compared to removing part of your soul from your body which Dumbledore would never do.

And as for him becoming a phoeix, i dissagree. First off Harry saw him get hit by the AK and his picture went up on the wall with the other dead headmasters and headmistreses, and I think Dumbledore would think it an insult to hand his picture with the others if he wasnt really.....dead.

Im not so sure Dd has a horcurx, but there is a portait of himself in the now headmistress' office. I think Db will use that to communicate to harry and lead him on the path of killing voldemort.

Dumbledore is one of the greatest wizards ever, and he himself said that there are things that Voldy doesnt know or understand. Perhaps like love, their is something that can keep you alive after you are dead that isnt a horcurx. Maybe he really is still out there, after he knows magic that most could never imagine. Plus, if he really was completely dead, wouldnt he have talked to Harry in his portrait in the end of the book, i mean, what would be stopping him, maybe the fact he could talk to him becasue he was really dead yet? No one knows, guess we will just have to wait.

it is quite impossible for dumbledore to have a horcruxe since the hole point of retreving slughorns memory was to find out what a horcruxes was.

Hi there, please check out the rules here. One liners are not allowed on the vtm forum. Thanks Shane

No, ilovedraco, Dumbledore knew what Horcruxes were ... I'm sure if Slughorn knew, Dumbledore would've known what they were ... the whole point of extracting the memory, was to find out how many of them Voldemort had planned on making, since Dumbldore knew he had made at least two ... which was previously unheard of. Remember, he'd already destroyed one before he saw the full Sluggish memory: the Gaunt family ring.

Back on topic: it's very unlikely that Dumbledore had split his soul, in doing so it would have altered him, and he wouldn't have been the same Dumbledore we know and love.

What if Horcruxes weren't the only way for dumbledore to "survive?" I mean, He's always been compared to obi-wan of starwars, so perhaps he can project himself like that. Or perhaps the potraits might tell harry what he did to survive his encounter, probably with non dark magic, and get harry to re-instate him, so to speak.

I really don;t think that Dumbledore had a Horcrux. Remember, he didn't know much about them himself. How could he have a Horcrux, when he didn't know anything about them, is all I'm saying. Besides, Voldemort had Horcruxes because he fears death. Dumbledore never feared death, so he probably felt that there was no need for one.

While I do agree that Dumbledore would be unlikely to go in for the dark magic required to create a horcrux, there is a noteworthy amount of evidence that he might have:
- Dumbledore defeated Grindenwald in 1945, 52 years before Sorceror's Stone was published in 1997. The Chamber of Secrets was opened fifty years ago by the young Lord Voldemort. As these two happened within just a few years of each other, and Dumbledore is impressive at forseeing events, he could have created a horcrux upon killing Grindenwald in preparation for battle with the great dark wizard he then knew Tom Riddle would become.
- Noting again Dumbledore's gift for foresight, hiring Prof. Slughorn (an otherwise shady character and a not a particularly good teacher) makes sense, as he, being a potions master, would be a great help in restoring Dumbledore to life, via the horcrux.
- I also believe that if he does have a horcrux, it would be Fawkes. Dumbledore said himself to Harry that although making a living creature was a risky move, it was indeed possible. He then noted Voldermort's uncanny control over the snake Nagini as a potential sign that the animal was a horcrux. Dumbledore seems to have great control over Fawkes, especially during Harry's battle with the basilisk. Also, Fawkes flew away after Dumbledore's death, a good sign that he may be more important than he seems and is keeping himself in a safe place.
- That's all I've got for now, there were a few more points but I've forgotten them. btw, this was not all my theory, I was created with two firends and I figured I should give them credit.

Humoring you for this topic, I would say that if Dumbledore had a Horcrux, it would probably be Fawkes. I mean, Fawkes would be a likely object for his Horcrux.

Actually I thought about this one alot,,

My mind kept dismissing it cus it was dark and you needed to KILL somone to make one.

But now lets think carful about it ,, Who better to Kill to make a horcrux than DUmbledore,,, I mean what if he created a Horcrux as he died,,, say oooo HOWARTS for example .
Now , would not the prolific statement "As long as there are those who loyal to me I will have never left Hogwarts" make an interesting turn of events.
Take it one step further he wants to be buried at hogwarts,,, ummm No other headmaster has had that hmmmmmmmm..

yes DD was not afraid of death but maybe he felt his time will be over when riddle was dead and gone and not sooner,,

Anyway its just a musing ,,,

So Howarts would be DD horcrux,,,

maybe thats why Riddle wanted to come back to do the same , knowing NO WAY would hogwarts ever be destroyed,,
Just some fuel for the TWO YEAR WAIT fire.

Dumbledore and a Horcrux is the same like Dumbledore adoring Voldemort's work, so no, I can't even imagine him having this. Maybe he has another way to live, but a Horcrux? Big no

DD to be exact is 150 years old so stated by JKR and we know that a witch or wizard can live very long unless they incounter illnesses

so i dont recall reading of any one close to as old as he so he must have something that is keeping him so healthy and old 150 years is a very long time and for him to just die after being for so long it make sno sence

There is still anchient magic that we dont know about but DD does he used it for the school and to prtect harry so he must of did some thing anchient to keep him so healthy for that long
but no way does he have a horcrux

To me it seems very unlikely that DD had a horcrux. I don't think anyone could asosciate him with such dark magic. However, i believe JKR has put in a twist, she also said that we will know more about DD in book 7.
personally i think Fawkes, the phoenix, will be important, DD seemed really close related to it....

dumbledore would never make a horcrux because he was sooooooo against them he'd just be a walking contridiction.

I posted most of my arguments for Dd possibly having a horcrux earlier, but someone made a good point about Dd being 150 years old, much older than the average wizard. And that got me thinking, although I haven't officially looked back at this: Dd and Nicholas Flammel were the big creators of the Sorceror's Stone- the source of the eternal life elixar. It's hard to say the Dd wanted eternal life, because he was not that kind of wizard (the evil kind), but as he saw the Dark Lord rising, he must have seen the need for a prolonged life.

Well my guess is that Dumbledore did make himself a Horcrux. He new that Harry would need him inspite of all the normal run of story lines. I also think that JK would do this as a twist against the normal story lines. I think he made the Pheonix a horcrux and didn't tell anyone except possibly Pro. Magonagal. Harry was saved by his mothers love and I think that Harry will also be saved ( more so helped ) by Dumbledore's love, he made a horcrux even though he hated it out of love for Harry!!! Just my thoughts.

I doubt that Dumbledore's has a horcrux because:

1.He would have to kill a person on perpose and i don't think it can be done be kiling somebody very evil like Grindenwald,because it is isn't realy "a supreme act of evil" as Slughorn cals it.So that would mean that Dd would have to kill a good person.

2.I think that if he had split his soul he wouldn't be good anymore.Because when your soul gets ripped when you have killed a person.I think it's the good part of a wizard that come's out of your body and becomes a horcrux.

i think dumbledore has a horcrux... his death was like to chilled out and i think that if he hasn't any horcrux at least he should have something i don't know he has to appear in book 7

First of all Horcruxs are completely evil dark arts magic, why would Dumbledore do this, he would be a hypocrite if he did this, and would be tarnishing everything he stood for.

I don't think DD would have one, just because you kill someone doesn't mean you will automatically have one. It a dark magic that you have to perform in order to make them.

DD would not choose this because he has never been afraid of death. He has always shunted LV for this. I think there's a confusion of what horecrux really are, just because you kill doesn't mean you have one. I think you have to perform a dark magic first that will allow you make horecruxs.

I have to say that I agree with the people that agree that DD didnt make a Horcrux, he spoke quite negatively of them, or at least that was my impression. I think that when DD said that he would still be there as long as people were loyal to him meant just that, as long as Harry and others respected and lived by DD standards his presence would be felt because of the values he would have transmitted to his students. I believe that DD is gone and knew he would be, he thought for some reason that the best thing he could do for Harry was to show him memories because that way Harry would know his opponent better. These memories might play a roll during the final battle...

I really don't think Dumbledore has a horcrux. It's dark magic. Furthermore I think he's not interested in eternal life or what ever.
But : he had an extraordinary knowledge of everything and could analyse things.

I'd rather see him doing like the 4 founders of Hogwarts when the sorting hat has been done : putting a part / an image of his mind in something that can communicate, and be taken with (as opposed to the portrait)

no, I dont think he made a horcrux because he said it was a act against nature. he also said that death is the start of another adventure.(or something like that.)

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No i dont think he has one ,a horcrux is only made by someone pure evil like you know who,and you have to kill someone to get one so unless dd went evil for 10 minutes to get one and then went good again i highly doubt he has one.good theory tho.

I think it is very unlikely that Dumbledore had a horcrux, but if he did I agree it would be fawkes. You know how it is said that a horcrux somewhat disfigures you, makes you look less human? Well how about his hand? I know he said it was from the ring but you never know. Harry didn't receive any injuries after he destroyed the diary. Just a thought.

i know all the evidence points against dd having a horcrux, but i beleive it may be a possibility, he kept repeating to harry that he makes mistakes, perhaps that when he killed grinwauld he may have made one. Realizing what had happened he never told anybody, and nobody ever found out. I think that it could have happened long ago, but I am against the horcrux idea, he is too good to do an evil act like that, i think anywaym however, mistakes do happen

I really do doubt that Dumbledore has a horcrux; he is my view dead.

But, IF he did have a horcrux then I would have to agree that it would be Fawkes.

Just one thing that I want to type here, (you may all think that this is babble), IF he did have a horcrux I think Hagrid knows. Hagrid's loyalty to Dumbledore is profound and in the PS/SS didn't Dumbledore say, "I would trust Hagrid with my life".?

I don't know if this was said, but heres my views:

1. DD was begging forgiveness for something he did wrong when he took the potion in the cave.
2. Voldemort has an amazing power of Nagini, similar to DD extreme control of Fawkes.
3. Consider this quote "I will truly be gone, when no one here is loyal to me". Doesn't Fawkes come to the safety of those who are "loyal to him"?

I think its fairly obvious that DD made a horcrux. But heres something that makes me wonder... Isn't it strange that Snape killed DD, and promised to do so? He promised to do so, then he told DD to make a horcrux. Thats why DD hand was burnt.

"Guilt is a stronger punishment than anything I can do"

Snape feels guilty, one for James saving his life, and then for killing him. He wouldn't be able to kill Harry, or be on Voldemorts side... Thats just the way the mind works. Thats why Snape killed DD so quickly, he wanted to make sure nobody else did it. Also thats why Fawkes left, because he(or is it she?) knew to leave and hide. As far as where DD is now...I'm not sure.... But I'm positive that DD is living and Fawkes is a horcrux. As far as who he killed, I'm sure it was , this is a shock, but DD had to do it...Emmeline Vance.

He knew that he had to remain alive, and knew he was needed. Of course he didn't fear death, but he did fear leaving Harry alone... So thats my views...

Well you all seem to have pretty much the same idea that DD did not create a Horcurx. I was talking to someone through pm and it suddenly hit me why I created this topic.

DD was a great wizard, too good to create a Horcurx. I am 100% with those of you who think that he is gone for good, but for those who believe that there is a chance that he made one on accident, heres something to think about.

There have been many great wizards thought out time, all the way back to Merlin to DD. Along those lines, some have gone bad. For example, Crouch was an excellent wizard and he loved his job, everybody liked him and voted? him to be MoM. Once he was granted all of this power, he became greedy and ruthless. Voldemort, yes even him, is a great wizard, terrible.....yes.......but great as Olivander would say and he has done so spectacular things like putting off death for a while. I'm not saying that DD is/was a wizard that went bad. All I'm saying is that with power comes great responsibilty. DD was young and strong when he was young, that how he got rid of Grindwald(sp). Perhaps DD was blinded by power then and then later realized what he did wrong.

Well enjoy conversing about that for a while.