Rats! I've just started to try to reply in some way, and managed to get myself thoroughly confused within the first paragraph. It's not working. My brain is beginning a descent into shutting down for the night, and doesn't seem to want to function correctly. But I have some answer to this... I'm sure of it. Regardless of Hermione's exact age, though, we would still need to know why Hermione's identity would have been kept secret before the Prophesy came about if she were Harry's sister. We would still have to know why at the very least there are certain people who don't seem to know about her that should don't... Wait, did that make sense?... Yeah, I'm gonna stop trying now... I'll come up with a sensible response tomorrow maybe.

I never really have been very good with the dates in Harry Potter for some reason. Can't seem to remember them. But upon investigation, yes, it would seem that Trelawny did make the prediction while Lily was still pregnant (if I'm not mistaken), as she told Umbridge in the early part of Book 5 that she had been working at Hogwarts for nearly 16 years, making her likely date to have been hired during the Christmas break about seven months before Harry was born. However, I still have to wonder about this. It was then nearly two years between the time that the prophesy was made and the time that James and Lily were killed. And it wouldn't seem as though (I'll have to check this later, but I feel like I have reason to believe this; I'll get back on that... when you bury yourself in as many theories and editorials on Harry Potter as I have in the past couple months, you start having trouble distinguishing canon from fanon), the Potters went into hiding until a fairly short time before Voldemort actually came after them. Just so I can get this clear: what is your timeline on this subject? At what point (or exactly between what times perhaps) do you propose that the Potters decided to chuck Hermione to the Grangers? And furthermore, what exactly was their provocation to do so, other than just that the Prophesy was made? I mean, I don't believe they went into hiding the moment Harry was born (whether Hermione was born with him or not); I'm not even convinced they knew about the Prophesy yet at that time. So when did it happen?... Sigh... I'm making myself confused with all this...

Okay, to make this simple, I'm just wondering if you have a proposed timeline in mind for the events from the time that Trelawny made the Prophesy to the time that Voldemort became Vapormort? All events on the timeline that are pertinent toward the idea that Hermione may be Harry's sister...

And then, just a note on the complicated plot of Harry Potter... You're absolutely right. The plot of Harry Potter is very complex. I don't think anyone could reasonably argue otherwise. However, I also think that JKR handles it in such a way and presents important information to us at just the right times to simplify and make clear this decidedly complex story. I'm not saying that the Sibling Theory couldn't turn out to be right. But at this point, with only one more book left to go, I'd think that there would be a bit more concrete evidence to help prepare us for such a wild revelation. I realize, it could all be each person's perspective as to exactly how firm each bit of evidence on this (or any) theory really is... but from what I've read so far (and again, I've yet to read the full theory, and I'm looking forward to it, 'cause whether I end up liking this theory as a possibility or not, I do believe it's a pretty interesting theory no matter what), I don't really see it as being too likely yet... But like I'm said, I'm definitely intrigued and am looking foward to trying to figure the whole theory out for myself.

OK, I also think that the prophecy was made before the birth, just from the wording of it, however, I think that even if it were not, with LV loose, they would have separated the twins (Harry and Hermione) to be sure that one descendant of Godric Griffindor would survive to fight the last descendant of Salizar Slytherin.

My proof for the descendant theory is listed in a previous post.

Well after HBP, I would think the thing that is "kind of the heart of it all" is the Horcruxes. Learning about these teaches us how to defeat LV, which is the overall goal in the series.

I mean your theory could be true, but I think the Horcrux discovery was the important thing.

i simply think that this theory is brilliant!

i really hope that this is it, it makes great sense if you go way back...

oh, i have green/blue eyes, my dad has hazel, my mom has brown, and my sister has dark brown, so its possible for a biological family to have different colored eyes lol!

also, i am 13 months older than my sis, and the sibling relationship thing sounds pretty accurate, having a protective sister...

i am actually pretty speechless, there is no way that i can add to this, as its perfect i think, and theres no way i could insult in, as i feel its perfect...

right on!

Wow

What an amazing theory!

I wonder however if it may be slightly wrong.

I know that JKR recently said something about the significance of Lily's surname. Could it be that H and Hr are close, e.g. cousins. Could Hr's Mum or Dad be another sibling to Aunt Petunia and Lily Or maybe Hr's Mum was James' brother??

It is a great idea though for how the characters could all be tied up at the end of book seven (still holding out hope for 8,9,10...)

Not ruling out the whole brother/sister thing but agree with others that the Potter family was too well known to hide a daughter!

Well here is a new thing... if the theory is good (well not my opinion), the real revelation would be that Hermione is the Horcruz and not Harry...

This would be a realy hughe revelation...

Sorry, but wouldn't them being siblings be a huge revelation? Why would Hermione have to be a Horcrux for it to be "HUGE"?

idunno - glad you like it. If you want, there's a huge sibling theory debate going on at Mugglenet, and I've written Sibling Theory fan fiction (link in my sig).

Actually she possibly BE related to Harry, but not a sister. Remember she is a muggle, so possibly a sister or a distant relitive on Lily's side? Just thinking, but i must work this theory out in more detail.

Okay... after having read the very long and exhaustive theory in all its glorious detail... I must admit, I'm still not really onboard with the theory (I don't particularly believe that Hermione is Harry's sister) but I can see how it's a possibility, and I quite get where it's coming from. My biggest question for the theory at this point would have to do with the Protection theory and its relation to the Sibling theory. It is said that Harry may gain protection from Hermione as he does from Petunia, but we now know that this magic will cease to function once he turns 17, so it can't play as big a role in the conclusion as the full theory guesses at. This isn't really a problem to the theory, so much, just a small part of it. But here's a bigger potential problem, still regarding the Protection...

It is stated that the reason Harry has not been told that Hermione is his sister is because the information must be kept from Voldemort, and Harry could only be told once he's mastered Occlumency. The problem with this now, is that Harry is now officially full of information that Voldemort needs not to know, and he still hasn't mastered Occlumency. It looks as though he may never do that. The reason he can know all sorts of things that it would be best that Voldemort not also know about, though, (i.e. the full Prophecy, that fact that he has all this information about the horcruxes now, etc.) is that Voldemort is now practicing Occlumency against him. Voldemort is now officially guarding the connection, which has opened the door for Harry to know more. So why didn't DD bother telling him about Hermione too? It seems like it probably would have been about time for that information to finally be passed on to Harry.

All in all, though, I think it's a good theory. I don't really go for it myself, but I get why it's so appealing, and I also get why some can really get behind it. For me, I'll reserve final judgment until I can get a bit more evidence.

The Protection question is a legit one...I'll try to provide a possible answer.

Harry's protection at Number Four Privet Drive must end at age seventeen for obvious reasons...Harry will be of age, and finally able to leave the place he has hated for so long, and Vernon at least will see to it that Harry is given the boot. Once he cannot call it home, it cannot provide protection... But in SS/PS, Dumbledore tells Harry that a sacrifice like Lily's provides protection for a life-time, which sounds like it will last beyond Harry's coming-of-age to me! Hermione might provide all the protection from there on.

How Can You SAY That!!! if they were she wuld of been dead wen voldemort came in book 1 and it was never menicioned and i highly doubt it is, we wudda known rowling wont just come out and say that they were thats rele stupicl

MOD EDIT: Please try and remember your tone, this is a respectable discussion. Also netspeak is not permitted"'u'...". Thanks.

That's a pretty strong reaction, Ninalovesharry36, and I can understand why you would not choose to believe in the theory. I'm far from convinced myself. But the theory is far from stupid, and you shouldn't say so. It's in the rules. If you disagree with a theory, it's fine and dandy to say so, but you should choose how to say it in a kind and respectful manner that also hopefully puts forth reasonable and coherent counter-points.

As for my counter-points... that's not a bad argument for the Protection Theory, Circe, and I could see that, except then wouldn't it have been a good time to come out with the truth about Hermione when Dumbledore told him his protection from the Dursley's would be wearing off at 17? That brings me back to my other big question, and the one I'm actually more interested in: Why hasn't Harry been told. The big argument in the theory for Harry not being told about Hermione was so that Voldemort couldn't find out either. But I really feel that that argument can no longer be valid, now that Voldemort is employing Occlumency against Harry. That is the reason for Harry being told a lot of things at this point, so why not this? We need a more solid reason than just because JKR needed to not reveal it till the last book. That may well be the reason, behind the scenes, but there needs to be a story-reason as well, and I'm not really seeing the one presented at this point. So I'm just wondering if you have any ideas for how that one could be worked out?

I wholeheartedly disagree with this theory. It does not make sense and if this did happen I would punch Jk in the eye. I think people would know and even if Dumbledore went around saying Obliviate to every wizard or witch he met it still couldnt happen. Memory spells can be broken. Or are you saying Hermione is the offspring of Lily and someone else (Sirius, Dobby) or James and someone else (Minerva Mcgonnagal)
I think it would be more likely if Hermione was Petunia and Vernons daughter and they were told about the magic and got rid of her.
I do not believe any Harry/Hermione relation stuff and I do not think they will ever go out.
I think Harry will die in book 7 and have no time for romance

I do wonder if the introduction of this idea came at a bad time for H/Hr shippers, as maybe they want to cling to some connection between them, if not romantic.

It has certaily got a lot of people heated and others confused!

I like the idea that Hr is in someway linked to Harry, of which we are unaware, and the idea of a big revelation in book 7. Something that will have us all wondering "why didn't I think of that?"

Having read the theory and the numerous replies though I really don't think this can be true. Unless Hr was the product of a relatonship between Lily and some other party (which would have been very secret) which I think is unlikely and would destroy H's memory of his parents.

And the reply that wondered about V being father to both H and Hr was just hilarious. Don't think JKR would put us through all these years of intrigue and angst just to regurgitate an old and much done story. I hope not anyway!

Are my main questions about this theory going to be ignored or are you just trying to find potential answers to them? If it's the latter, then that's fine; I'd just like to know. I need my initial objections to the theory cleared up before I can even begin to entertain the possibility...

ehhhh...im afraid its kinda overananlyzing....

i really doubt that Harry has any unknown relatives....not to mention secret relatives
Jo said in an interview that she wanted him being complately alone.
It isnt Jo's style (thank godness) to create such non-sense relationships.

But it was really amusing reading the whole first post.

this is so interesting to read and i think it is quite believable! except the fact that snape and lily had a love child (hermonie)- i mean come on were talking about snape!

no matter what harry is not and will never be alone. ron and hermonie want to come with him anyways. hermonie could be revealed at the last minute! i guess well just have to wait and see!

It's conceivable (no pun intended) that Harry and Hermione can be siblings. But, I don't buy the theory. It could get very complicated. Are they HALF brother and sister? Could it be James had an affair before Lily became pregnant with Harry? I don't think so. I believe that James was very much in love with Lily and remained faithful to her. I don't think they are siblings with the same mother (Lily) because I just don't think Lily would have had enough post-partum time from Hermione's birth in September until Harry's birth the following July. I'd guess those chances are slim to none.

IMO this sibling theory is one that non-H/Hr shippers would really want to believe in. It would be incest if Harry and Hermione were to become an item in book 7. A lot of H/Hr shippers are still hoping that it H/Hr in the final book, but incestuous--Never! I'm sure Jo would never do this. So, I think that it's just a ploy to make R/Hr and H/G more convincing and acceptable. But, I'm not being fooled. Jo is too smart and clever to give us a Star Wars-like ending by having Harry and Hermione be brother and sister (like Luke and Leia turned out to be). As far as I am concerned, the non H/Hr shippers are grasping! It's a no-go!

i believe this could actually happen i mean they understand each other well and hermione doesnt feel awkward hugging harry its just like shes a sister but it also seems quite far fetched

Reading the posts, I gues that alot of people are geting confused with Start Wars ...

It's realy not the same thing, no one was realy hidden from LV, the most important fact is that the chousing of is nemesis was done by LV imself and not HP famely... also the prophesi was enunciated well after, they where born and at that time only DD would have know about it and they would have no reason to kill Hr.

That terrible knight, only HP was the target, both parent died trying to defend HP if he would have had a sister LV would not have care more...

sorry but this one i have to disagree with...not shooting down...just disagreeing..

a bit farfetched

rowling does love to hit us with shockers but i mean reall....this would be toooo much and a little over the top....could be true but doubtful and if it is...ill be SEVERELY dissapointed

First of all this theory has been very nicely explained, lot of support...yet I'm not buying it...If true most of the seventh book would be about explaining this theory, since there are many loose ends...I'm with Padfoot's Avenger on this one.

I really don't think theis theory holds water. I mean, it's not like it could never be, but Lily and James would have to be about 19 when Hermione was born, and that's pretty young.
And about Hermione's hesitation to hug Ron? Well, she's got a thing for Ron, and as a girl I can tell you that I hug guys that are my friends, but am considerably more hesitant to hug guys that I [I]like.

Over all, Harry and Hermione being siblings would probably be too much of a plot diversion, d'you know what I mean? It's kind of a lot for JKR to have to explain in the next book. But it was an interesting theory...

Semi-off topic...

Is it not a bit weird that Scabbers was in the Weasley family for 12 years(Percy's rat) and when it was given to Ron, that at the same time Hermione got CrookShanks(half cat/kneazle) which is the same breed of creatures that Ms. Figg(Squib in Harry's neighbourhood) breeds?

Strange considering harry wasnt friends with Ron and Hermione until he was 11.:-S

I actually thought of this before..i even went as far as saying that Hermione was Lily reincarnated so she can protect harry because right from the off she was protective of harry even when they weren't mates.

But it just doesn't fit.

1)where was hermione when James and Lily were killed and Harry about to be murdered?

2)2 different birthdates. Hermione and Harry are 10 months apart..is it not unhealthy to have a baby so quickly aftyer the first?

3)why has Dumbledore kept this crucial bit of news from harry if it were true? Wouldn't he had let him live with the grangers? afterall, his mothers blood does run through hermione.

4)Hermione doesn't look like harry's family..nor does she have petunia's teeth. Hermione's teeth are described as beaver-like/rabbit-like while petunia's are described as horse-like. Hermione would look like lily which she doesnt.

5) Hermioine's hair is never described as wild or messy, its described as bush..a huge difference.

6)Rita skeeters artical- of course she was going to laugh it off...none of it is true is it.

At best she could be a cousin he doesn't know about. Personally, i think she's voldemorts neice.

I read someone speculating that Hermione was Petunia's daughter and I realised after reading book 6 that Hermione and Dudely are born in the same month - could they be... twins?!

Answer: No, I don't think so - it's too cheesy but it's still a lot more likely that Harry and Hermione are cousins, not siblings.

Hmmm. I really love all the detective work that has gone into this theory. It is very impresive indeed, but to quote Dana: I'm not buying.

JKR went to great lengths to ensure that Harry faces Voldemort on his own, a trend that most likely will continue in Book 7. Hermione and Ron, although they won't be killed outright, will most likely suffer greatly in the final book, symbolizing Harry's internal struggle with coming to terms with his destiny and his history.

From a plotline perspective, I think JKR, as a writer, would be very careful not to recycle ideas in such a way. She'd want her story to say something fresh and original. She'll probab;ly surprise us with some unexpected twist, but I don't think we'll find out anything along the lines of Hermione being Lilly and Snape's love child!

Interesting ideas here, however...

Cheers!

To be honest, I think that this theory has done a lot of reading between the lines, maybe a little too much. I applaud those who did all the research, but I don't buy it.

If it does turn out to be true though, I'll be very surprised.

I’ve been away for awhile so I’ll try to catch up on everyone’s responses!

>>>JKR went to great lengths to ensure that Harry faces Voldemort on his own, a trend that most likely will continue in Book 7. Hermione and Ron, although they won't be killed outright, will most likely suffer greatly in the final book, symbolizing Harry's internal struggle with coming to terms with his destiny and his history.

In this day and age, it’s almost impossible NOT to reuse someone else’s plotlines, isn’t it? JK Rowling manages to recycle very traditional plots in a unique way. Besides, she is always worrying about Star Wars comparisons…why worry about being compared to Star Wars if there were no precise parallels which to compare? Harry is NOT Voldemort’s son…but Hermione and Harry could be sister and brother, a la Leia and Luke.

>>>>>I read someone speculating that Hermione was Petunia's daughter and I realised after reading book 6 that Hermione and Dudely are born in the same month - could they be... twins?!

Not sure where you got that information. Hermione’s birthday is September 19, 1979. Dudley’s is sometime in June of 1980, as Petunia said in HBP that Harry is one month younger than Dudders.

>>>>1)where was hermione when James and Lily were killed and Harry about to be murdered?

She could have been in Godric’s Hollow. There is reason to believe that some cover-up was made that night. We have never seen Avada Kedavra behave so destructively as to destroy a house, yet the Potters’ house was in ruins. We have seen one instance of a ruined house however – Slughorn’s and he did this himself to cover-up his presence. Dumbledore may have arrived on the scene and taken Hermione and destroyed the house so as to hide all evidence of her presence. I am more inclined to believe that Hermione had already been given up for adoption, because Voldemort was clearly after the Potters and they couldn’t give up Harry because of Dumbledore wanting to Prophecy to be fulfilled.

>>>>>2)2 different birthdates. Hermione and Harry are 10 months apart..is it not unhealthy to have a baby so quickly aftyer the first?

They’re called “Irish Twins” and it is possible to have children ten months apart. We all know a few sets of siblings less than a year apart in age. It’s not common, but it’s certainly not impossible!

>>>>>>3)why has Dumbledore kept this crucial bit of news from harry if it were true? Wouldn't he had let him live with the grangers? afterall, his mothers blood does run through hermione.

He needs to protect Hermione’s identity, especially if Hermione is part of Harry’s blood protection. I think that McGonagall may be the Secretkeeper for Hermione’s true identity, as McGonagall and Hermione have a close relationship. In that case, Dumbledore wouldn’t be able to reveal the truth to Harry.

>>>>>4)Hermione doesn't look like harry's family..nor does she have petunia's teeth. Hermione's teeth are described as beaver-like/rabbit-like while petunia's are described as horse-like. Hermione would look like lily which she doesnt.

She has prominent teeth like Petunia, and wild hair like Harry’s.

>>>>>>5)Rita skeeters artical- of course she was going to laugh it off...none of it is true is it.

Why did she react so vehemently to the statement “Father substitute”? About the Love Triangle Article, I think you would find it hard to laugh it off if the article was being quoted everywhere and here you were, a self-conscious fourteen-year-old girl. If Hermione knows that Harry’s her brother, then the situation is laughable!

Sorry folks! I don't think JKR would make Hermione and Harry into sibs. She isn't going to pull a Star Wars on her readers. At least, I hope not. It's because I ship H/Hr that I can't see them as brother and sister. Sometimes, I think that whoever thought this theory up ships H/G or R/Hr. By believing in the Sibling Theory, it leaves their ships free of obstacles. Know what I mean? At least this is my opinion.

I believe!!!

Hiya, Starliteprism!

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Cheers

Circe, I could say the same as to Ron and Hermione's constant bickering. I know of a lot of brothers and sisters that bicker all of the time. I have a niece and nephew (brother and sister) that my brother-in-law refers to as 'Caine and Able' because they are constantly arguing and at times have hit one another. There isn't always this wonderful, close relationship among sibs anyway. Although, you do see it among people who love each other.

I still say that JKR will NOT make Hermione and Harry siblings. JKR is a sly one! I wouldn't put it past her to create a romance between Harry and Hermione in book 7. She's always full of surprises. It's H/Hr for me. I won't give it up until I read the last page of the final book. And if my ship sinks, well, there's always fan fiction where H/Hr survives!

Im sorry to say i disagree with this theory. Hermione and Harry will not be brother and sister. Their personalities are completely different for one. Hermione is a smart funny and conciensious person while Harry is a bully (If you dont believe me reread Harry and Colin situation. The most they could be is Half Brother and sister. If so Hermiones parents will possibly be:
Lily and Lupin
Lily and Uncle Vernon
Lily and Dobby
James and McGonnagal
James and Andromeda Tonks

I htink the most believable are either Lily and Lupin or Jaames and McGonnagal. Lily loves Lupin.Lupin loves Lily. But Lupin says no because he is a werewolf. They have sex and Hermione is produced. Lily then has to convince James Hermione is his. James is PIG HEAD! He is a bully like his son and I believe He may have made McGonnagal pregnant. Through rape?
It is hard to believe your parents arent perfect, but I believe Harry may need to face this

You know, I disagree with the Sibling Theory as well, for a number of reasons... but Remus_Lupin, your ideas on this just leave me absolutely flabbergasted... I'm not even sure what to say. First off, in regard to the actual topic at hand, where did you ever get that brothers and sisters had identical personalities? Or even similar personalities? Can they? Absolutely! Is it a prerequisite for two people being siblings? Never in life!

From there, we get a little off topic, so I hope no one will mind if I just quickly touch on them (I promise not to get into full-on debate mode on this, so as not to get completely off topic)...

I disagree with your perception of Harry being a bully. And I really can't see using Colin as an example of him being one either. Harry didn't bully Colin. He tried his hardest to avoid him. That's pretty much the opposite of bullying. In fact, if anyone was bullying anyone else there, it would have been Colin bullying Harry, although then that's not even the right word. Rather, Colin was pestering Harry. Maybe you've never had a Colin-type pestering you, but let me assure you as one who has had that sort of experience (though still not on the same level as Harry), that it is quite annoying, and I think Harry's behavior in regard to Colin is usually quite admirable.

I'm going to go ahead and leave most of those pairings you have alone, because while I flat-out don't agree with them, I understand that a lot of people see it as a possibility for Lily or James to have... ahem... "had relations" with various other people. Though, I really can't resist mentioning the James/McGonagall pairing... But rather than arguing it, I'm just going to say: Shame on you, Remus_Lupin. Shame on you for even suggesting such a thing!

The Sibling Theory didn't go down easily, although Jo Rowling already wrote in her website that Hermione doesn't have any siblings. There is also no indication that James and Lily could have had any other children during the period in which Sirius, Lupin and Peter Pettigrew were still very close together. A baby is not easy to hide. Somewhere, somehow, somebody must have mentioned this. Dumbledore knows he was dying, yet no word about sister to Harry. There is still a slight possibility to expect in Book 7.

Look no offence or anythin i think you guys theory is WAAAAAAAAAAY out of proportion. James might be arrogant but he isn't all that bad that he would sleep with his teacher. And don't forget these books are for everyone. Including Kids and people of other religion.So JKR won't write this. Now for Lily/Lupin and Lily/Snape it is impossible for this reason Herminone and Harry are about the same age even if she is 10 months older than him and Lily would have had to do things with different people around the same time. And lily is way too decent to turn into that kind of person. And JKR has way too much respect for lily to turn her into a person like that. Now for the original sibling theory.....IT IS NOT POSSIBLE!!!!why you might ask well when you have a kid he or she must have PHYSICAL characteristics of one or both of the parents. Lily has Red hair and emerald green eyes.... and James has Jet black hair and hazel eyes. Harry looks like his father but has his mothers eyes so he is definetly their son. Herminone who has brown hair and brown eyes has no characteristics of Lily and James. Maybe she looks like James's parents, maybe but as you can see in the Mirror of Erised chapter, harry sees people in his family and he doesnt mention anbyone with bushy brown hair. For the record James's eyes are hazel not brown!!And Lily's parents is impossible because she doesnt look much like Aunt petunia so it is impossible for it to happen and JKR wont turn this into Star Wars. Save this theory for fanfiction.

Now, now: I've been fairly vocal (not for awhile, I suppose... okay, I've said some stuff) about how I don't agree with this theory. However, I would not be so light with throwing around terms like "possible" and "impossible." Improbably, unlikely, "I disagree..." Things like these are better things to say unless you can solidly disprove something. Now, before some of you who do feel like you've effectively disproven it already say so, let me point out that things like Hermione not looking much like Lily and James don't disprove anything, but rather may make it less probable. Still not impossible, though.

For that matter, the idea of physical differences becomes even less of a sure thing in this matter when we take into account that we are dealing with a world of magic. For all we know, Hermione could be a morphamagus, and has intentionally altered some of her charateristics to make herself appear less like Harry. Understand, I don't find this terribly likely, but then, it could be possible.

Just to say so one more time: I disagree with the Sibling Theory, but that doesn't mean it's not a very well thought-out theory that deserves a little more respect, whether you agree with it or not.

I totally agree with the sibbling theory! If GOdric's Hollow does refer to Godric Gryffindor then it could also stand for:


Godric’s hole
Godric’s empty space
Godric’s echo
Godric’s lacking significance
Godric’s lacking sincerity
Godric’s hole
Godric’s depression
Godric’s small valley

Which sort of matches the sibbling theory if you get what I mean...
I thought it was good...~*~LoL~*~...