Oh, Jo....Jo, Jo, Jo.....*sigh*

Well, I'm sorry, but I think she failed monumentally here. Don't get me wrong, I still love the books - I wouldn't be here if I didn't respect her talent - but I'm also not going to accept everything in these books as perfect if they jar painfully with my sensibilities. I am loyal to Jo and the books, but that loyalty is not blind. True love of anything or anyone should be able to see the flaws as well as the things that are good, and I'm afraid that if this truly was Jo's aim in HBP, then IMHO, she failed.

This could be a personal thing - I don't like forceful, brash, in-you-face, gutsy, mouthy people and that's exactly how Ginny's character came across to me. So, I suppose, in that respect, if 'gutsy' was what Jo was aiming for, then she succeeded - but I still don't like her and I don't think she's right for Harry at all. I think she's been brought from nowhere - Harry has never looked at her in any other way up to this point - and suddenly thrust into the limelight as a contender for Harry's affections.

I don't think she's funny - I think she's sarcastic, smart-mouthed and even cruel sometimes. I don't think the fact that she attacks her brothers or threatens people who annoy her with bat-bogey hexes - it's the equivalent in real terms of a girl dealing with her brother's teasing by planting a fist on their jaws - is an attractive quality either. Is that really the type of person we're supposed to see as 'warm and compassionate'?

So she grabs Harry's hand and pulls him away from Dumbledore...big deal!! Anyone who cared about Harry would have done exactly the same thing!!

Jo said Ginny is supposed to have been on 'a journey'. Where, exactly? Because she disappeared off the radar for three books, her role reduced to little more than Neville's or Seamus' - so when were we, the readers, supposed to have seen this miraculous transformation? She just got more irritating from book to book - when she did show up because she was either flirting with boys (and no, not all teenage girls go from boy to boy - it's not normal at all...there's a name for girls like that that's not suitable for use on this forum) or hexing people to prove how 'tough' and 'feisty' she was.

If this was really Jo's intention, then I think she could have handled it better. There are other ways in which you can make a character strong, sassy, independant and interesting without making them seem cold, haughty and a little arrogant sometimes. You can be strong without being a...well...female dog...and that seems to be a distinctions that Jo didn't really make in HBP - not for me, anyway.

Which brings me to Harry - suddenly noticing her from nowhere. I'm sorry, but that's rubbish too. There wasn't a single shred of viable evidence in these books to suggest that Harry has ever looked at Ginny as anything more than a friend. If Harry had ever found her attractive, he would have said so - these things don't just suddenly strike you like a bolt out of the blue. There is ALWAYS something there, whether or not you acknowledge it, and there was nothing in CoS to be able to conclude that Harry thought of her as anything more than an irritation - and an embarrasing one at that. Look at the way he reacted over the Valentine!!

So no, I'm sorry. I'm not buying it. I don't think they're sweet, I don't think they're tender and I don't think they're sincere. It was contrived, awkward and jarred against what was otherwise an overall pretty good book like bad notes in a symphony.

I, for one, cheered when Harry finally came to his senses and dumped her. He knows he has a higher purpose now and he walked away - well flippin' marvellous for him!! And he didn't even look back - it's Ron and Hermione he wants with him in his final journey, not her - just read the last few lines of the book.

Not Ginny...not the one true love of his life, supposedly...*gags*...but the friends who have always stood by him through it all. I think that pretty much says everything. I just hope that Harry has the sense to stick to his guns and find someone....ANYONE....who's more worthy of him than Ginny.

Actually that's a really good point and I think QQS, you just pinpointed exactly what it was that really annoyed me about this relationship.

Yes, it was rushed. But more so than that. Harry was noticing Cho in book three. He wanted to ask her out in book four to the ball. Then in book five, he finally wins her. They have an argument and she runs off with another guy.

BUT

It seemed to me that Harry was still thinking about her- the indication from Ron and Hermione is that they aren't sure whether to tell him about Cho's new boyfriend because they didn't know how he'd react, but it's written that Harry was suprised to find that given the situation of Sirius' death, Cho wasn't all that important. And yet there's that bit of avoidence in HBP.

So meanwhile he's still upsetting because of Sirius, however he's stable-enough minded to notice that Ginny is his true love? Isn't that almost a rebound? A person starts looking for the gap to fill their life and the next thing they're in a relationship?

And who was Ginny to be dating other guys, meanwhile wishing that they were Harry Potter? That's really pretty scummy and unfair on Dean and Michael if you ask me.

Speaking for myself, I haven't neglected Harry.

I've soundly criticised him elsewhere, as I feel that his character (like virtually every other character in the book) drastically transforms in HBP - and not for the better. I currently find it difficult to forward arguments that Harry and Ginny are "ill-suited". What I could confidently argue is that pre-HBP Harry (as we knew him) and pre-HBP Ginny don't seem terribly compatible, and that he seemed to have virtually no romantic inclination whatsoever towards her. I also believe that pre-HBP Harry and HBP Ginny (and vice versa) would have little, if any common ground and subsequent basis for a romantic relationship.

Yet I would be hard pressed to argue against the fact that both characters in HBP seem to suit each other down to a tee. Both are thuggish, juvenile, macho, brash, hard, patronising, 'popular', cool and ultimately boring to me. It's as if they are vying for the joint title of 'King and Queen jerk' and I really couldn't like either of them.

Harry seems to undergo a transformation on at least two fundamental levels - one regarding gender, and the other morality (which I won‘t go into in this post). I know that Rowling tends to explain this away by constantly inferring that Harry is 'coming of age', but the changes that I detected don't seem to be related to this mantra in anyway. (I don't see what being hypermasculine and morally dubious have to do with 'growing up', even if the book seems to try and equate the former to the latter.)

One example that immediately springs to mind is Harry's bizarre reaction to having his nose broken by Malfoy. He's not only drowning in a sea of humiliated ego, but he's incredibly macho about the entire incident. His biggest fear is image-based and runs on the basis that "Ron will laugh at him", which I just found so odd and baseless - not to mention that it inadvertently maligns Ron.

Ron (whatever else he may be) isn't macho. This is the same Ron who admitted to being afraid of spiders, who uses his Mum's phrases on occasion, and reacts with revulsion when he discovered Umbridge's physically sadistic tendencies. There was nothing in any of the previous installments to suggest that Ron would find the prospect of someone having their face stomped on and their nose smashed in, 'funny', which makes Harry's supposed fears completely illogical and eerie. (Really, what kind of mind would see the 'humour' in that? Who would seriously think that was funny?)

This then begged the question - where was this laddish! jockish! perception coming from and why does Harry suddenly adopt this mindset? The only reason that Harry would fear being laughed at for having his face kicked in, is if at some level he
thinks it's funny and would have to restrain his laughter, should it happen to someone else.

Again, I had to mull over the series and wonder at what point (if any) did Harry suddenly start to view physical violence as funny and at the same time, negligible? True, he had always had a stoic streak and had endured more than his fear share if physical punishment. But I couldn't actually trace the development of this amused, negligent, superior attitude towards violence and pain - but there it was, smack bang in the beginning of the sixth book, straight out of nowhere.

The trend of hypermasculinity continued throughout the entire book.

We have Harry on the train being dismissive of the DA, reducing it to level of a laddish scape, while breezily behaving as if it was solely conceived of as a platform for Harry to individually one-up Umbridge. Then there's Harry and the utterly charmless throat-grabbing scene with Mundungus - apparently we were all supposed to cheer on, as this scene presumably underscored that Harry was now a man and that he could 'deal' with his problems - never mind that this action, like most everything else that he does in the book is of dubious benefit.

Then there's Harry and the stupid textbook? Macho! Yes, he's macho and stubborn about it. Harry and his 'clever' little mouth-of to Snape? *yawns* Harry and the Levicorpus spell and his off-hand dismissal of any ensuing protestations from Hermione? Macho! Harry and the fake drugging (behaving as if he's some creep in dark nightclub)? Macho. Harry and the ridiculous "beast within"? Macho! Harry silently siding with Ron's sexism towards Ginny? Speaks for itself really. Even Harry's solo 'quest' to track Draco reeked of this tiresome, manly 'Lone Ranger' mentality. All haphazard guessing and brawn and almost zero deduction. Frankly, I prefer Harry the boy, to Harry the man. Harry "the man", is a moron imv.

What does any of this have to do with Ginny? Plenty, seeing that he is deliberately shaped and remoulded in order to become 'her man.'

Sibling theories aside for a second it is actually scary how alike Ginny and Harry are in HBP. Both are hot-shot quidditch players, both are suddenly jettisoned into fawning popularity. Both don't seem to have anything better to do with their time other than running around jinxing or hexing people (bat bogey hexes, levicorpus and sectusempra). Both are fond of smart-mouthing people; both display an obnoxious, creepy and decidedly unfunny sense of humour. Both take time out from their busy schedules to briefly patronise the 'underdog' (Luna) thus demonstrating to us what great people they really are. They’re tough and fierce and not above resorting to violence. Yet when push comes to shove, and Snape does his thing - neither of them can do anything remotely useful.

For Ginny, however, this is no surprise as her uselessness has been an apparent pattern throughout the series. JK informs us that she is to all intents and purposes a powerful and talented witch due to circumstances of birth (7th born) but I'll need evidence that extends beyond the words 'bat-bogey hex' - which, really seem to be her only claim to fame. She's rarely involved in the main action anyway, which is fitting for a preordained paramour I suppose.

In OotP, she does little in the crucial fight scene other than break her ankle and then attempt to be staunch about it. I can't even remember what she does in HBP other than hex Zacharias Smith and fly into somebody. Yep. I'm sure that all of these daring! cool! funny! antics are going to be incredibly helpful when it comes to putting away Voldy. *shrugs* Nevertheless, her uselessness is consistent if nothing else.

Harry on the hand is the real 'revelation' here. He used to be extremely good at DADA if I recall, and seemed to have an active interest in it. Then along comes HBP and Ginny, and he is almost as trifling and superfluous as she is. I find it interesting that rather than making Ginny step up to Harry's level and display her mettle, Harry is seriously reduced in scope and ability in order to make them 'compatible'. Unfortunately Harry's character is all but coarsened, dismantled and trivialised in order for this paring work. In short, they are equals - as in, equally as unlikeable as each other.

In altering Harry so drastically in order to make him suitable for fierce, blazing-faced Ginny, he becomes a ‘man’ to match her ‘man’. Pre-HBP Harry would would have been insufficiently 'staunch' for the type of person that Ginny becomes.

Right.

It's not for nothing that people all over the net (and not just a couple of posters on this site ) keep drawing comparisons to SVH after they read this book, and consider (among other relationships) H/G as representative of this. I agree that much of this relationship seems to be an exercise in escapist wish-fulfillment, and something that occurs in a protective, decontexutalised vacuum that is completely aside from the war. Harry and Ginny are king and queen of Hogwarts, rulers of cool, talk of the hallways, and guardians of teenage mediocrity. It's like they're on holiday from fighting evil or something, leaving them sufficient time to moon, ditch and date, amid the disappearances, imprisonments and killings.

The relationship really reminded me of one of those 'parallel universe' fan-fictions where the underlying premise is 'what Harry's life would have been like if Voldemort had never existed', followed by an enactment of Harry's lovely, ordinary (boring) life.

I am a H/G non supporter, but not for the same reasons as you; Actually I completely disagree with your analysis of why the couple's ill suited. Maybe you should create a thread "Venom Harry" and another one "Venom Ginny" separtely cause you really seem to hate them? Just teasing...

I don't think Harry's being macho for one thing. The train incident, well I guess he didn't want to be "caught" in that situation because what he did was actually pretty dumb, I mean who would have wanted to go walking inside the school, in the Great Hall and have everybody see their nose bleeding because that guy - that 1. you hate, 2. think is stupid - punched you in the nose when you should have known better; after all all this is pretty ridiculous when you think about it, not necessarily because of the result - i.e. nose bleeding - but because of the way it happened (I thought what Harry did was kind of stupid). There must be yes a part played by the ego, but who doesn't have an ego?? Ron might have laughed in fact: don't they usually make fun of each other from time to time when they do something ridiculous? But on that last point I'm not sure, maybe Ron wouldn't have laughed and Harry misjudged his reaction. Plus I'd like to add that his biggest fear is to be not found and to go back to London stuck in the train, it's not image-based. He is worried probably also about that, but that is so way beyond his fear of remaining stuck there. And, if your definition of not being macho is admitting one's fears, then I think we can agree that Harry is in fact not macho, cause he was never that guy who pretends he's great and courageous and fearless and blablabla... he's so modest and his ego might have grown -which is normal by the way!- but it's so small compared to his modesty. Oh and by the way, if Harry is so worried about his image, how come he so naturally makes that girl on the train at the beginning of HBP understand that he's glad to stay with Neville & Luna because they're his friends (and that she'd better take off because she got it all wrong and he's not interested in someone like her)? and how come he takes Luna to Slughorn's Christmas party? Not exactly the"best" choice if you wanna save appearances is it?

You think Harry's attitude towards Mundungus is of dubious benefit?
Harry is in deed becoming a man in that he understands he has a power of his own: just like all adolescents, at some point you realize that you are not the child who's "powerless" in face of adults, that they do not necessarily have to control your life, that you have the ability to act on your own and to stand up to those adults who do not "rule the world" anymore because you are actually starting to get a place among them and their world. Harry is in that phase, and yes the scene with Mundungus proves that. But he's not doing it because he likes to show that "Oh yeah I'm a man now, you watch me handle that scum Mundungus! I'm a big macho and I can [MOD EDIT]lap anybody anywhere at any time, you just watch me!". He doesn't even realize that Mundungus is stealing HIS own stuff, he still refers to it in his mind as Sirius's belongings and he can't stand seeing that man stealing things from Sirius, that guy who's the closest thing to a family he ever got, whom he loved and whom he hadn't really grieved yet. This is why he reacts as he does towards Mundungus.

About the textbook, Ron would have done the same. About the hexing he didn't know what he was doing. About the drugging, how on earth was that macho?? didn't see an ounce of machoness there! About the "beast within" I think that's called hormones (I'll get back to that later)... And about the solo quest for Draco, he had no choice but to go alone didn't he? after all Ron & Hermione weren't exactly supportive of his theory until late in the book were they? But I agree that what he did to find out about Malfoy was pretty stupid sometimes (naturally, he didn't have Hermione! we all know that brains are not exactly Harry's strong point ).

As to the "coolness" of Harry & Ginny, well yes they ARE "cool" I can't deny it but do you really think they sought that popularity? They are not behaving like supposedly cool people, they're not trying to actually get attention on them, are they? The one thing in which they do take pride -and that I can't deny it- is being good Quidditch players; they love winning but do they brag about it for instance? no. Harry's popular because he survived Voldemort's mortal curse and because he did like a thousand amazing things during his stay at Hogwarts and also because of Quidditch naturally. Ginny well, I guess she's popular because she's supposedly pretty and goes along with pretty much everybody except the real stupid and/or mean ones; actually I don't really see where that popularity comes from exactly.
They're not being nice to "underdogs" as you put it just to prove that "Oh look at us, although we're cool and popular, we have time for the unwanted because we like to do charity (cause charity's good for the image!)" They're both kind to whoever deserves it and their attitude towards Luna is the proof of it. Maybe they ARE just "nice", can't you accept that?? Even if Ginny is a bit arrogant maybe sometimes or takes pride in a somewhat stupid sense of humour (and believe me I don't like that!), she's not a prat. And Harry's far from there, very far!

I think it's true however that their relationship is a symbol of "teenage mediocre relationships" cause what links them is so superficial. I think Harry "fell" for her cause she was there, she was pretty and the fact that she's so liked by all the guys made her more desirable; I think Harry acted like a short-sighed adolescent in that part: he sees the popular pretty girl in somebody else's arms and it makes him go nuts, whereas he spent the whole summer with her, feeling absolutely nothing! They seem to have just a few common points like Quidditch and being pretty much bold, but that's about it. The Ginny thing came out of nowhere and I don't see how she can be a match for Harry because she was never really that much described in the books so we don't know who she is really and we can't see how come their personalities match... it's just out of the blue! Ginny always liked Harry (dunno why, it was never said) and Harry just let his hormones take over his brains. And she's supposed to be a gifted witch and Harry's equal and perfect match? hard to believe really!

MOD EDIT: Hi there. Please edit the quote you wish to use in future rather than posting the whole thing. Also the use of asterisks as substitutes for cussing is not permitted. Please take a look at the rules forum here Also, you need to be a bit more careful about wording, it's not advisable to appear too intollerant of others views. Thanks

But beware, it is really long... good luck in finding it, and enjoy the read!
-Dominique
Essay Link

Bear with me a moment here...but Harry is a character who knows what it's like to be unpopular. He was bullied for 11 years before going to Hogwarts. He has constantly defended people in the past for many reasons...Neville, Hermione, Ginny, Ron.... His heart is good, he always does the right thing and although he is headstrong at times, even Dumbledore has passed comment on how wonderful he thinks it is that in spite of everything that has happened to him, Harry remains a true, loyal and good friend, someone with qualities and strength to be admired. That's why I've always loved Harry and found him to be such a warm, caring and wonderful character.

So since when did he become so shallow as to be attracted to someone who hexes people just because they annoy her? More than that, Jo places Ginny in this 'Slug Club' as a sort of reward - which would seem to indicate that she is showing how shallow Slughorn is too...but at the same time, she expects us to like Slughorn and accept him as someone who Dumbledore needs around. So what exactly was this? A crude way of pushing Ginny and Harry together early in the story? Are we supposed to think that Ginny is marvellous for hexing someone who annoys her? Are we supposed to see her being rewarded and singled out for such behaviour by a character that Jo expects us to like?

What are we meant to think when we see James and Sirius doing the same thing to Snape in OotP? Okay, so Ginny didn't humiliate anyone in front of the whole school, but she nevertheless hexed someone who was getting on her nerves - rather shallow reasons. Harry was devestated by what he had witnessed his father doing - so much so that he put himself in great danger to try to get hold of Sirius and Lupin for some kind of explanation for his fathers behaviour. What reason were we given? Well, they were young....it was to be expected... Well, it didn't seem so casual an occasion for Snape, did it? He carried those scars with him for the rest of his life. harry actually felt sorry for him...someone who he absolutely loathes.

So why did he not even pass comment on what Ginny had done? Doesn't this seem to be rather hypocritical a thing for him to do? This doesn't fit with his character. It seems to me that Jo is not being true to herself in her writing or Harry's character by making him accept such behaviour, and this isn't the only time that Ginny has done things like this.

How are we supposed to see such a person as 'warm and compassionate'? Warm, compassionate people don't hex other people when they annoy them. It would be like me slapping someone across the face because they annoy me. Or me hitting the 'banned' button on this forum when someone says something to annoy me.

Would such action be fair? No. Would it be acceptable under any circumstances? No. It is not acceptable to lash out at people who annoy you. Nor it is acceptable to overlook such behaviour as a normal part of growing up. Is this the sort of message that Jo would like to be sending out to her readers?

I sincerely hope not.

Yet again, more evidence for a Ginny-Sue.

I agree with you Dana, it doesn't fit Harry's character at all... that's because his character was 'altered' when he was spiked with the love potion. And for any.. H/G supporters reading this, which I know there is someone.. your main question is: Love Potion makes someone obsessed like Ron and Harry wasn't obsessed...

But Ah Ha.. I must tell you this, that the longer a love potion is left out, the stronger it will be, right? And the love potion that was in those candies that Ron accidently ate were from Christmas. And Ron ate them on his birthday- March 1. It must have gotten really stronger by then.. and obviously, that will make you more obbsesive.. Rather than the fresh love potion Harry was being spiked with...
ok, i'll stop now, because I have a feeling that this is posted somewhere on this thread, and I don't want to repeat what others said... If I allready did so, I'm sorry, but I'm thinking exactly what your thinking!

Thanks,
-Dominique

Ah, yet again Westerly, you have a talent for summing up beautifully in just a few words what I wanted to say but could only have done so in at least two pages!

My sentiments exactly.

I think that the love potion idea probably grew from Creamtea's (and many other fans' too, if you look around the fandom) complete bafflement at the events in HBP...desperately searching for a legitimate explanation that goes beyond the horrifying possibility that Jo might possibly have lost her touch. I don't think she has...please no one reading this misunderstand - I wouldn't still be here if I had lost my faith in Jo completely (just about 60% of it, but 40 % is still a workable limit, I feel...) I just think that it's an attempt to explain the unexplainable...we are meant to accept this on face value and that's pretty much all there is to it. I just think it's extremely unfortunate that Jo failed to take her readers on the same journey of discovery that Harry apparently went on.

I have to say though that I am currently re-reading HBP and have gotten up to the 'House of Gaunt' chapter and as yet, not one single time has Harry dwelled on a thought about Ginny. The only time Jo steps even vaguely close to a suggestion is the scent in the potions room which reminds Harry of a floral scent he detected at the Burrow. Which, if the debate thread were still open, I would argue most vociferiously indicates that Harry associates good feelings and memories of being part of the family that he has spent so many years yearning for and certainly does not indicate the stirrings of a 'monster' in his chest that is about to strip him of all semblance of morality and sense. And where does that scent issue from? A Love Potion...designed to have just that effect on him. The boy's brain is clearly addled....

This reminds me of the whole argument against psychics. If you go to see a psychic and he tells you that you're going to have three children, a lot of people would go out there totally convinced that they'd been told the truth and probably would end up having three children. Of course, if you walk out of that room and immediately have a hysterectomy, then that pretty much rules out the possibility of you having any children at all, let alone three. So was the psychic wrong? Probably... But my personal views aside, the point is free will. We drive our own destiny, make things happen.

Ergo, if Harry had never smelled that scent, would he have even thought about Ginny any more? Or would he have remained focused on the task at hand - namely that someone was trying to kill him, a fact that surely would drive the most reasonable of us to distraction, let alone a 16 year old boy who has already had more near misses in his short life than most of us would be unfortunate enough to have during our full four score and ten. That scent was in his memory, he associated it with feeling happy and content, he thus transplants his yearning for that family to Ginny - effectively blinding him to her faults which once went against his own moral code. That's not a basis for a relationship. Making someone fit into an ideal surely is not what love is about. It's about compromise, yes, but not ignoring values which you hold dear.

I understand what Jo was trying to achieve, really I do, but a convincing plot it did not make, I'm afraid. At least not for me.

Westerly, that story had me nearly wetting myself... Absolutely hysterical! Slightly caustic for poor Jo and I sincerely hope that she never reads it, but as a parody from a clearly upset fan it was absolutely brilliantly written and no doubt reflects the feelings of many, many people

Well, just that she was trying to create a love interest for Harry to highlight the fact that he's growing up and becoming interested in girls. She wants to show that he's just a normal teenager, I guess. It just seemed to me that that's all fine and dandy - but you also have to make it plausible and likeable. I mean, Ginny is supposed to be the hero's girl, and huge swathes of her fans just can't stand the preppy little idiot. She's shallow, sometimes cruel, cold and just...well...your typical Ginny-Sue, basically. I just think that Jo tried to make Harry real and in the process, brought him down in my estimation...and in a lot of other peoples too, I guess.

I have to say, I totally agree that men tend to marry their 'mothers', just as women tend to marry their 'fathers', so to speak. Not all the time, obviously, but generally, people come to be attracted to qualities and, conversely, turned off my failures in the characters of their parents.

I don't think that Ron is on Hermione's intellectual level. I don't mean that nastily, it's just simply a fact. They would be bored with each other after a very short time. It would be great at first, I'm sure, but what do they have in common? What would they talk about? You have to have a basis for a relationship. Same thing with Harry and Ginny - you have to have a basis for it to work, and IMHO, there isn't one.

Ginny is cruel and cold; Harry is compassionate and warm. Ginny seems pretty shallow; Harry has never judged anyone by anyone else's standards. Ginny thinks it's okay to hex people who annoy her; Harry, up until HBP anyway, has always found such behaviour abhorrent.

I just don't see how Jo ever expected us to be able to accept this. Ginny is simply not a nice person. Harry is. I don't see how someone who clearly cares deeply for his fellow man and someone who teases and flirts and hexes people who irritate her could possibly be attracted to each other.

I think the basis for Ginny's attraction is clear - because Harry is famous and because he's popular. She fits very well into Slughorn's little club, doesn't she? At least Harry had the gumption to be affronted by Slughorn's invitation.

MEOW dana! Let it all out girl!

I couldn't agree with you more. I really didn't like who Ginny became in the 6th book. I liked her before that, but she really was just nasty and snottish in HBP.

And I think her attraction with Harry from the beginning was very much focused on the famous thing- she didn't even know him and she was supposedly chasing after him on the train in the first book.

She didn't know him at the start of COS and she was dropping things whenever he was around.

Harry has never been described as 'goodlooking', especially in the initial books when he was wearing slobby clothes that belonged to Dudley and had scotch-taped glasses. Not exactly something to drool over if he?

Maybe if Ginny's crush had started AFTER COS, it might be a little bit more believeable, but that still doesn't explain where Harry's feelings came from.

LMAO!! Dana, I know how much you would hate the thoughs of that!! LOL I never really hated her, although I did dislike her very much HBP The reason I'm backing off her a bit is because I think Harry/Ginny should have been a great part of these books, but because Jk failed to get us to like Ginny in the way she wanted us to it sort of spoilt things for us. Jk didn't want Ginny to be the person we people who post here on this thread, see her as, so my take is she's not a bad character (how could she be if Harry likes her ) she is just badley written. Reminds me of that cartoon woman out of Roger Rabbit - 'I'm not bad, I'm just drawn that way' well Ginny could substitute 'drawn' for 'written'

And the other thing I've noticed is that there are quite a lot of people who actually did like Ginny in HBP I still dont see why at all, but there are so many of them that something must have clicked. Goodness knows what Anyway, please dont stop posting your venom views. I cant say I've really disagreed with anything you've said, maybe I just haven't felt as strongly about it as you

I've been thinking about that statement the last couple of days and you know the really sad thing? I realised that in spite of everything that I've said in here and everything that I've read from other people.... I'm still a Harry/Ginny supporter. I'd love to see JKR write her down a little and for them to end up together in the 7th book.

But only if she changes. Not the way that she is now. I just don't get it. I'm seriously dumbstruck as to how Ginny GOT that way? How did we get this sweet and shy little girl in book 2 who was scared enough that she couldn't express her feelings and had to talk to Tom Riddle to get comfort, to this nasty horrible snot of a girl? It just doesn't make sense to me. Even in book 5- she had a boyfriend. Great- I fully support that. I even support her having the guts to ditch him when he's being a prat. But not being out right nasty and horrible. That's just wrong.


(I'm thinking maybe a few of us need to have a straight out Ginny-Venom thread and then we can leave the Harry-Ginny relationship part in peace )

Wow. That was really rude. I'm a grown woman too - not exactly a professional, but I hold a BSc - a first class honours - so I flatter myself that I'm not exactly thick either and I saw the H/Hr in the films too. I think you should be a little more careful the way you express yourself in the future because what you just said was highly offensive. You have no right to judge another person's opinion because it's just possible that they might compare you to a child for believing what you do too.

Anyway, that's off topic.

Pix, we do have a Ginny-bashing thread...sort of...here.

heh heh- I HAVE actually posted in there... but there's too many people who think that she's great.... I want full out she's a pinata and I have a stick-lets-take-turns type bashing lol.