One of the most hotly contended issues to spring from HBP - did Voldemort accidentally make Harry a Horcrux? Or is it all just a load of hot air?

Evidence based debates only here please - book references to back up arguments are preferable, but not essential so long as you are referring to something from canon. For explanations of what constitutes canon, please read Bajab's post here.

Against

As far as I can tell, the only evidence that Harry is a Horcrux, is that he apparently has one of the Dark Lord's abilities; Parslemouth.

His other similarities arise from circumstances.

"You can speak Parseltongue, Harry," said Dumbledore calmly, "because Lord Voldemort -- who is the last remaining ancestor of Salazar Slytherin -- can speak Parseltongue. Unless I'm much mistaken, he transferred some of his own powers to you the night he gave you that scar. Not something he intended to do, I'm sure ....

Surely not every parselmouth in history was a decendant of Slytherin, and Salazaa is not said to be the first one ever. We have been shown how interbred purebloods are, so possibly every wizard alive has a chance of been born a parselmouth (except for muggleborn?).

The only definate Horcruxes we have seen, the book, showed remarkable qualities. It contained a complete 'copy' of Voldemort's conciousness and knowledge.

Dumbledore suspected Nagini was a horcrux because she had shown 'curious behaviour'.

Harry has shown no such similar signs, aside from Parslemouth, which he could have if he was a decendent of a parselmouth. Even if Dumbledore is right, and he has the ability from Voldemort, it is slim proof with no corroborating evidence.

Voldemorts intention to use Harry's death (another guess) is not proof. It just provides the possibility of how he could be.

Does anybody know of any other 'evidence' that Harry is a Horcrux?

I'm also against, but there is an argument for him being one.

I think a lot of people jumped to the conclusion that he is a horcrux to explain the connection between he and Voldemort.

Slughorn says there must be a murder and a spell involved, but he didn't know the spell...but he knows its a spell...then take your soul which is split because of that murder and using that spell, place it in an object (we aren't directly told this is how it is).

Voldemort did go to murder Harry, and if he did, I bet he would have taken his split soul and placed it in an object with that spell. However, he didn't accomplish his goal, and thus didn't do the spell and didn't place it in an object...which is why I think it couldn't have happened by accident either.

However, some argue that the spell was done before he tried to murder Harry. We aren't really sure how much time passed between James and Lily's death, so he could have done the spell (if it has to be done beforehand). If thats the case, then I still don't think it could have happened because Voldemort didn't take the piece of his soul and place it in an object.

One argument for that is that his soul piece that he created had a mind of its own and went straight into Harry. Wouldn't that mean each Horcrux has a mind of its own? We only know of one, that being the diary, which has a sort of mind of its own. Or the soul piece was magnetized or fixed on Harry and thus went straight into him. But Voldemort hadn't taken it out yet...I guess we need to know more about the process to know for sure if he is one or not, but till then, I'm gonna say against.

Against

I cannot believe that Harry is a horcrux simply because Voldmeort transferred some of his powers. Powers and soul are two different things. Yes, Harry can speak Parseltongue, yes, Harry has a scar that hurts near Voldemort, yes, Harry had a sort of weird connection with Voldemort's mind(especially in book 5). Why? Because I believe what Dumbledore said about him accidentally transferring powers.

The phophecy said that Harry would automatically be given powers if he became the "Chosen one," and that is exactly what he has gotten. I'm not even sure he knows how to use his powers he has to their most useful advantages.

When Slughorn tells of the horcruxes, he mentions committing the surpreme act of evil against a person, then he says the maker must use a spell. I believe they were said in that order for a reason. I believe, Voldemort intended to use Harry's death for his horcrux making, and he was not aware that his Killing Curse would rebound on him, therefore he did no pre-spell-saying and he didn't set anything up because he had not anticipated what happened (because Snape hadn't heard the whole prophecy).

Some say the power from Lily and James's murders could've been used to make a horcrux, but that still doesn't show us when Voldemort would've had time to do the incantation. My belief>Horcrux making is a difficult task, and is probably not something you could do accidentally.

What about Harry's scar? Well, I take the answer I was given in the book, that Harry's scar is a result from being hit with a most terrible curse--in this case Avada Kedavra. He survived it, which he was not supposed to do, and therefore it left a mark, and a small connection of powers between the killer and the supposed-to-be-murdered. Plus, Harry's forehead is just in to vulnerable of a position to have a horcrux on it. Just doesn't seem likely to me.

I am too against it that Harry is a Horcurx.

I am going to add on to your statement Chris. What you said about the scar being a curse is absolutely right. It is no sign of an "incomplete" horcurx or anything of that sort. The reason he has some of those powers (ex parslemouth) is because it was a curse for harry and Voldemort. Voldemort became weak after he tried to kill Harry and if he hadn't created a Horcurx, he would have been dead. Now in return for surviving the AK curse, Harry recieved powers that grown wizards have not been able to obtain except for a few. On the other side, Harry wasn't able to come in contact with Voldemort without him his scar hurting.

Another, and huge reason why I think Harry isn't a Horcurx is that Voldemort has wanted to kill him so many times. Why would he kill his own part of his soul. I know you might think that 'He is the darkest wizard of all time', yes thats true but does that make him stupid?
While he is one of the darkest wizards of all time, he is also one of the smartest. There is no reason for him to want to kill his own Horcurx

Now you might say 'He knows about the prophacy and he has to kill Harry'. Yes he does but he doesn't know the extent of it and the details of all of it. He wants to kill Harry, because he believes he has to. That may lead to his downfall.

And I'd like to add more to yours Secret All Harry had to do to defeat Quirrelmort was touch him...if a piece of Voldemort's soul were in him, it would be dead anyway...get what I'm saying?!

Right, his downfall will be because he believes in the prophecy so much. Everyone has a weakness, just like in the movie 'Mind Hunters', if any of you get a chance to see it, its decent. As you may have guessed, the killer analyzed each victims weakness and used it against them...also with strengths and routines. Such as, the second guy to die was a mechanic guy...so when something went wrong with the water system, he went over to fix it...it triggered a crossbow...and you know the rest.

So, Voldemort's weakness is his own desire for immortality...leading to the Horcruxes...

So with that said, would he seal a part of his soul in something that is going to die (Harry)? Even though he didn't as JTD (not JTB pointed out. He did it with the snake in Dumbledore's opinion which we should accept (hey, maybe thats our weakness...accepting everything he says), but I heard a theory that the snake was already dead...sorry for getting off topic!

Wow. Four to one already (the one being me); I figured I ought to go aheand and get in here before the numbers against rise even further (as I think they are apt to do). Well, I'm going to go ahead and not post my whole theory as to what happened right away just because it's long, speculative, and I think this debate will be better served by taking the issue in pieces, rather than as one monstrous whole, so I'll start with those points already on the table. I'll begin with the bit I consider most supportive of the possibility...

Wow, a lot of views in such a short amount of time. I'm typically against the idea of Harry being a Horcrux, but for now I'm going to play Devil's Advocate.

Well, I didn't mean that it was hard evidence that Harry is a Horcrux. Just that it's hard evidence of something, and I've got nothing else (nor have I heard anyone else present something that really works well enough, or at all) as to what else it could end up being. It's just something I think we have to consider. It's a more important point than some people seem to think... or at least, I think it's important...

Teehee, I think you've misunderstood me.

No, I think I must have been the one being unclear, so no worries. I completely agree with your definitions of probability and possibility. I was using the same ideas in my post. I probably just put it in a way that confused the issue more than it actually made my point. Sorry. Let me bottom line it for you, so hopefully it will clear up any issues that may arise... It's not as easy as I think you put it to say what is and is not probable when the story exists in somebody else's mind and is ruled by their own perceptions. So it's hard to factor that in, and therefore, probability is an unreliable measure to try to say that anything may or may not be. Does that make sense? I think I have one or two related points that will move us into another direction if need be that I'll make later, but for now, I'll leave it at that.

Like I said, though: any confusion caused, I'm sure I'm totally at fault, so don't worry about it.

Oh, wait. I think I may see the confusion now (that I went back and read your post a second time, passerby). Yeah, it was in the way I put it. What I meant by "possibility" not being firm enough was that the argument "it's not possible" is not a very strong argument for the idea that Harry can be a Horcrux, because one way or another, nobody can yet disprove the very possibility. So I was saying that the fall-back to that inability to definitively disprove it is to go to probability, saying that it's just not likely then. But I don't really think that's a worthy argument to the possibility either, since literature is built on unlikely circumstances taking place to create stories. The things that would seem most improbable often have a way of becoming the most probable when it comes to literature, if that makes sense to anyone but me... Hopefully it will. Anyway... sorry. I see how I misled you by how I worded things. Sorry about that!

Refer to this part of the prophecy: ‘and either must die at the hands of the other for neither can live while the other survives’.

As of now, Harry is surviving because he is alive...Voldemort isn't because he is immortal (I think JKR hinted at this when Fudge mentioned it in the first chapter) So look into the future:

-Harry has a soul piece within him.
-Voldemort doesn’t know
-Harry destroyed all the Horcruxes
-Voldemort proceeds to kill Harry, killing his soul piece as well
-Voldemort has made himself mortal, thus he is living and surviving

It fulfills that part of the prophecy. Before, Voldemort was immortal, and Harry mortal. Once Voldemort killed Harry, he is no longer immortal and thus he is living and surviving. It allows someone else to kill him in the future.

-Harry died
-Voldemort survived

Summary:
Harry destroyed all the Horcruxes except he and Voldemort don’t realize that Harry has a soul piece within him. That means that Voldemort is still immortal. Voldemort will kill Harry, thus making him mortal once more, which opens the opportunity for anyone else to kill him because the prophecy has been fulfilled.

I know this should be in the other thread, but in order to explain my position I had to include the prophecy!

This has suddenly become even more complicated than it already is if this is what it is.

Let's mix it up some more

What if Harry is only a PART-HORCRUX?

Think of it.

As per the pro side - Voldemort was going to make a Horcrux using Harry's murder. Due to Lilly it went wrong, but, what if instead of accidentally making Harry a Horcrux, he only got a part of the deal?

The other part is the bit that was left that Voldy described as "less than the meanest ghost", and now inhabits the body Wormtail conjured. The bit of Voldy that was in his original body got destroyed by the rebounded AK. That accounts for the somebody getting killed in order to make a Horcrux.

Hang on, did I just suggest Voldy created a Horcrux by killing himself? This is getting weird again.

This could explain their link, which Voldemort does not appear to have with his other Horcruxes. He is in Harry, and his ressurrected body, at the same time - sort of - as a "Half-Horcrux". (The real slim shady is dead.) It also throws the prophecy into a new light since the "neither can live bit" might be refering to Voldy only.

V obviously doesn't know (or believe) this himself, but then he is a just a shadow of the man he was.

What's the difference between Horcrux and Half-Horcrux, you ask? Not sure actually.

I'm going to go back to the accidentally creating a Horcurx. Slughorn said this in his original memory:

By an act of evil -- the supreme act of evil. By commiting murder. Killing rips the soul apart. The wizard intent upon creating a Horcurx would use the damage to his advantage. He would encase the torn portion... ...There is a spell, don't ask me I don't know!

This means that you have to commit a murder before casting the spell to create a Horcurx. When Slughorn said he would take it to his advantage, he means that the creator would have control of it. The caster, in this case Voldemort, he would have to make it into some object or person/animal. Now for it to be a person, the caster has to create the spell AFTER the murder. Voldemort never commited the murder he was to commit for his last horcurx.

Now for the Half-Horcurx, I can't see that being plausable. The soul can not be riped into 1/4. The soul is originally split into two, therefore creating two identical and equil parts of a soul. I don't think that you could split a horcurx into two different objects but it being the same part of the soul. Nice therory though.

What if Voldemort's soul isn't in Harry, but his imprint (not his ghost)? The imprint can't think on its own because the soul still resides in Voldemort and his Horcruxes.

So when Voldemort AKed Harry, he was ripped from his body as well as his imprint. His imprint came out forcefully because the AK curse was supposed to kill him. Vapormort flees the scene in pain, the imprint remains. Voldemort was supposed to be dead, so what does it do?

I'm not sure how it would have chosen to go to Harry, because essentially it doesn't have a mind process because Voldemort is still "alive" but immortal, so instead of being alive he's in existence...

How did it get into Harry? What if it was immediatley transfered to Harry when the AK curse rebounded...as in...lightspeed time...very fast?

Now, the imprint won't burn or get destroyed because of Harry's love power...because, like a ghost (but not a ghost), its just an imprint...The shadow behind Harry's eyes in book 5. If the imprint didn't go back to Voldemort, and since he's just in existence, he's essentially not living (Fudge hints at this in the first chapter)...and Harry is alive. So could that leave the option of either one dying?

-Harry kills...or maybe imprissons Voldemort...but if he kills him (as well as the Horcruxes), then the imprint moves on to make that decision that Nearly Headless Nick had, or anyone who dies. Harry survives

-Voldemort kills Harry...the imprint rejoins Voldemort because now (after Harry destroys the other Horcruxes) he is mortal again which the imprint recognizes. Once he's mortal, he is now living, and now surviving.

I know you all probably think I'm crazy, but thats what I'm here for.

I have no idea which side I'm on either. I agree that his soul remained split no matter what time he made his Horcruxes. If you wish, I'd suggest looking at the Horcrux Murders thread to get a scope of who he killed personally. It also has theories on which murders resulted in which Horcrux. But, as you mentioned passerby, he had already killed three people before he found out about the Horcruxes...or before he learned what they truley meant.

I think I'll stick with my imprint theory for now

Okay, bear with me here (espcially you, Traz). The thing that bothers me in the "accidental horcrux" thoery is kind of like baking a cake.

Let's just say (i'm telling you, hang on!) that my kid wants me to make him a cake for his birthday. I assemble all the ingrediants. I measure out the flour, get the two eggs out of the fridge, get the sugar and junk for the icing ready and plop it all in a bowl. Then the phone rings. It's an emergency call from a family member or friend who needs me immediately. My husband is not home, so I grab the kids and go! Hours later, I get home and what do I have sitting on my counter? A mess. . .not a cake. I was not able to finish making my cake (even though I probably left the oven on), and the cake definately did not make itself. I could not have "accidentally" made a cake.

Or making a chicken pie:
I have all the ingrediants out to make a yummy chicken pie, except the yummy chicken. I'd best go get me one. I go next door to my mom's house (for she has chickens) and pick out a nice plump rooster. I take the ax down from the shed and head over to "do the deed." The chicken revolts and grabs the ax with its wings (even though he does not have opposable thumbs to wield an ax properly) and he axes me instead. (Gruesome, I know.) What does the chicken do then? Well, he certainly does not go to my house and throw himself into my pan to make himself into that yummy chicken pie.

I like the first analogy better, but I figured I'd better put something in where there was a killing involved. Does this help make sense of where I'm coming from? (Where am I coming from? Yeah. . .about there.)

Those were great analogies passerby. I never thought of it that way, but I also never thought it would have been accidental either.

I'm kind of confused now...because if you put it that way, where does the connection come from? It might be something different...didn't JKR say in that interview that it will be revealed (and it should) in the 7th book...doesn't that mean it wasn't mentioned yet? So maybe it isn't a Horcrux, imprint, or anything else that we've already been told about. Or maybe I misunderstood...I dunno

I like your analogies, passerby, if only because I would use the same sort of arguments against the idea of Evolution (wonder if that Forbidden Forest debate is ever gonna happen)... but you're still not making room for the fact that we're in a fictional world here... and not just a fictional world, either. A magical fictional world.

So let's take the cake analogy. But we shouldn't be trying to bake a cake. What we should be trying to do is conjure a cake. We make it using a spell. So let's say that I have a spell of some sort that can transfigure another object into a cake. I gather my magic and intent in mind (because of course, it's difficult to transfigure one object into an entirely different one), focus on the object I intend to transform, recite the spell, and voila: I just turned by pet frog, Trevor, into a delicous, decidedly-green cake... that croaks...

But let's say that just as I'm in the middle of the spell process (bear with me for a moment because I can think of a number of excellent questions that are probably occurring to you here), something goes wrong, I get hit by another spell maybe, and my spell goes wild, and I accidentally end up transforming my cat into a furry, black cake... (I'm really not very good at this sort of magic, am I?). Well, I didn't intend to turn my cat into cake. I intended to turn my frog into cake. And yet, there my cat is: cake! Not a very good cake, perhaps, but my spell-casting abilities aside... it's still a cake!

Now, no, this is not the greatest example in the world and we are dealing with spells a little bit more intense and a situation a little bit more mucked up than this. But hopefully, you can still see how it's not exactly the same thing when you're working with magic to do things as when you're working in real-life situations.

Now, one problem you may have with my analogy is the fact that at the time that Voldemort was hit with AK, you would think he was not at that time reciting the spell to make a Horcrux, nor transfering a soul-piece. But that's not necessarily so. We have no idea what it requires, when it needs to be done, nor how it needs to be done in order to make a Horcrux. Furthermore, we also don't know for sure that Voldemort didn't devise his own spell and strategy to transfer a soul-piece into a Horcrux, so we don't really know.

Now, at this point, I'm seriously dancing around the details of my own theory as to what happened, and that's not even getting into other possible theories. But I still want to take this one thing at a time, and I find it much more interesting to get into the details than just putting it all out there, so I'm going to remain dancing around my theory for the moment. Hopefully, I did what I wanted to accomplish with this post, though, and show how your analogies, while quite good, are not necessarily entirely applicable to the circumstances with which we are dealing.

Lets also say that I intended to make a cake. I got all the ingredients, put it in the oven, but when I took it out later it was a pie.

Ingredients=the spell and Horcrux object
oven=setting out the plan
pie=something unexpected happen

I'm sitting at the table looking at the pie in disbelief. How the heck did this happen? I used everything for a cake, mixed it up like a cake, put it in the oven looking like a cake, but when I took it out...it had crust like a pie, filling like a pie, and other stuff like a pie.

Something I did made it into a pie, or something I didn't add made it a pie. Or an unexpected ingredient fell into the cake mix, which added a crust and filling to it (hey, its magic). So...something was added to Harry that reacted to Voldemort...which may have been Lily's sacrifice.

So the oven's heat transformed my cake into a pie after that ingredient fell into the mixture. Just like maybe Voldemort's AK hit Harry and sealed the deal with the sacrifice.

If any of that made sense, how does it make Harry have a piece of Voldemort's soul in him?

I don't know...but what if a piece of Voldemort's soul was intentionally placed in Harry by someone else? So when Voldemort used the AK, he was hitting himself. Where did this person get it from? Or maybe thats really too out there...

Voldemort had his ingredients...not to turn Harry into a Horcrux...but to turn a different object into a Horcrux that he might have had with him. So its like I mixed up a cake but without eggs, thinking that I should use them later. He moves to kill Harry, but forgot a part in his ingredients and it backfired (the pie part).

So what was I getting at? I lost myself...

Now I'm hungry for cake and pie (granted, not the ones traz made.)

These analogies are getting confusing. And I'm finding myself having a harder and harder time following crsdba's train of thought... But I have one rather important addition to make before I have to go home from work in a few minutes. And that is: you guys make it sound as if we know what the exact ingredients for a Horcrux are and what the process is. But we don't. We have ideas. We know that the ingredients include a murder and spell, but we don't know what that spell is, or how and when it's done. And those are important things for us to know for these analogies to really work. Without knowing the specifics of the spell, it would be like supplying the wrong ingredients for the baking of the cake. And then, who knows what we'd end up with? Does that make sense.

Yes, I know that even a fictional, magical world has established rules in which it must function. As a writer, myself, I think I have a keen understanding of how that must work. But it is my opinion that the rules of the Harry Potter world have plenty of room for an accidental Horcrux. The rules of the cake-baking world perhaps do not. But HP, I think we can swing it. More later. For now, I'm on my way out.

And I'm sorry for not being clear...is that how all my posts are? Were you not clear about the imprint or the whole pie thing. At first I was joking then suddenly I formed something out of it.

I dunno...
-Voldemort thought he was going to make a cake
-but he created a pie.

-he was going to kill Harry
-but he lived.

Maybe food isn't the right analogy for that...but sorry for the confusion.

I thought Slughorn said that you split your soul through murder then do the spell. So maybe it follows that...however, traz is right...the one thing we don't know is what that spell is, how long it takes, what the nature of it is, etc. Voldemort could have taken his time doing the spell, then did the AK.

I love these analogies!!

Just to be clear, traz my friend, you're not alone...I firmly believe that Harry is a Horcrux too.

I know the points that are being made here with regard to the accidental making of a horcrux, but I think we need to concentrate on a few important things that have already come up from various people throughout the thread.

1. We don't know exactly how a horcrux is made. We know that it requires a death and a spell, but the order isn't clear. Are the two spells cast simultaneously? Which is possible - one verbal, one non verbal, for example. Or one after another? Obviously it needs to be in quick succession, whatever the case - the object needs to be ready to receive the soul piece.

2. Voldemort was unaware of Lily's protection and was therefore unaware that his curse wouldn't work. Maybe he did have an object prepared - it certainly seems very likely, given his knowledge of the prophecy and everything Dumbledore told us about the typically serial-killer-ish need to take objects from victims. Who else would he want an object from other than the boy who was supposedly to destroy him? Wouldn't that be the greatest prize ever for him? I don't think there's any doubt that an object was ready, but the curse didn't work. It rebounded. We don't know exactly how AK works. If it sucks soul like a Dementors kiss, the soul has to go somewhere. No one knows exactly what happened that night, least of all Voldemort, Harry or Dumbledore therefore we cannot conclude that an accident is impossible or even unlikely. At the very least, it is possible.

3. With all these vague possibilities, we need to look elsewhere. Is there any evidence for a strange connection between Voldemort and Harry? Undoubtedly. I'm sure you're all aware of the Changeling Hypothesis - many aspects of the evidence for that theory apply now more than ever. Not just the parselmouth thing, that's an aside. There's the feelings, the dreams, the strange impulses that came over Harry to attack Dumbledore, for example. Then we have these wandless bursts of powerful magic driven by little more than Harry's emotions, it seems. Remember back in PS when his hair regrew of its own accord, how he apparently apparated himself on top of a roof. Why? Because he was frightened or threatened or angry. Look what happened to Aunt Marge. Where is this well of untapped power coming from? Why is it exclusive to Harry?

4. The scar is very important. When Voldemort possessed Harry in OotP, his scar felt as though it had 'burst open', implying that it is some kind of doorway - to what, exactly?

5. We know that even Dumbledore himself says that it is possible for a living thing to be a horcrux because he suspects Nagini, so if a snake can be a horcrux, so can Harry. I don't think Nagini is a horcrux, BTW...I think Dumbledore was opening up Harry to the possibility that a living thing can be a horcrux which brings me to my final point.

6. Why didn't Dumbledore tell Harry if there was a possibility he could be a horcrux? Surely he would have? No, of course he wouldn't. Harry is a seventeen year old boy, he was sixteen at the time. How could he have explained such a thing to Harry? That he might have to sacrifice himself to finally bring down Voldemort? He couldn't - it's too big, he would have no idea the effect it would have on Harry. So Harry is going to need to learn about sacrifice first. How will he do that? By witnessing Snape giving his life, I think. Gutted though I am to even think it, I have very little doubt that Snape will die protecting Harry, or at least protecting someone...maybe even to allow Harry to get at Voldemort. Only then, I think, will Harry understand what's necessary.

However, and this is a big however, it doesn't mean that Harry will die. Remember, the spell didn't work. Harry still has his own soul. If he is a horcrux, he can 'die' to release Voldemort's soul and still survive. I reckon when he does, his scar will disappear and that's why the final word of the series is 'scar'. It's obviously pretty important.

Phew....lot of theories in there... Crux of the matter, I'm firmly convinced Harry is a Horcrux. It's made sense to me ever since my much-missed debating mate, Bandoth, first suggested the idea of a split soul way back, long time before HBP came out. That, plus JKR's comments that traz mentioned back on page one leaves me with very, very little doubt.

Okay, I'm attempting to address some of the points you made, Louise . . . (operative word being "attemtping")

Against
I would have to say that i do not believe that Harry is a Horcrux.

1.) First of all i think that before we can fully understand if he is, we need to know or acknowledge how you make a Horcrux. Since we don't know that then it is going to be very difficult. We can only guess that it is not simple to make a Horcrux, from what Dumbledore has ssaid. And therefeore i ask you, How and When could Voldemort have made Harry a Horcrux? His mother was around him as an infant, The Dursleys as he grew up, and Dumbledore at Hogwarts, so when did Voldemort make him a Horcrux?

2.)Dumbledore states that he believes that Voldemort has greater control over Nagini than is normal, even for a Parceltongue, and yet it seems he has no control at all over Harry a person who openly defies him.

3.)When Vopldemort marked Harry as his equal, therefore starting the Prophecy, what sort of fool would have put a part of there soul in a person that it was there aim to kill. If he had done that then as soon as he killed Harry he would be killing part of himself. Well that makes sense....er...not! Tom Marvolo Riddle is not a fool, he is an extremely clever man. If i can work out that its not the brightest thing to do, then he certainly can.

To your first point, Nick, I think we've covered that. It happened when the AK backfired. At least, that's the theory. While we're on the subject...Janet, I think I might not have made myself very clear up there. By prepare an object, I meant have it standing by. I didn't mean to imply that any more complicated preparation ritual or whatever was required. We don't know if it is, it's all assumption of course, but I'm working from the known fact that it does require an object and it requires that object to be close at the time of killing. I don't think it's something that you can save for whenever the killer has a few moments to spare...it's something that has to be done immediately. That's an assumption on my part, granted, but one that I think makes logical sense.

To your second point, Nick - Nagini is a dumb animal with a few extra abilities that Voldemort uses to his advantage because he can speak Parceltongue. Harry is not. He's a sentient being with his own 'soul', just as Quirrel was.

Third point - we are assuming that it was an accident, Nick, as traz and I have stated in previous posts. We have also both stated our reasoning behind it. I think we can all safely concur that Voldemort wouldn't have done it intentionally.

Please...let's not travel in the same circles as the thread on the main forums now, eh? Let's think outside the box a little.

Ooh, Janet, about my last point...yes, I'll admit that perhaps Dumbledore realised that he had made a mistake in withholding information from Harry. But he still hasn't told Harry everything for some reason - he still hasn't revealed one of the most crucial points of all - the real reason why he trusts Snape. Why not? I still think that telling a young boy that he may have to die is not necessary. Firstly, Dumbledore may not be sure himself, so why worry Harry needlessly? Secondly, he had no idea how Harry might react. It might make him reckless, or angry to the point where he loses all reason, or depress him and completely incapacitate him. Why risk that when he's not even sure himself?

The final word being scar - no, it's not a guess. As far as I'm aware, it's a fact. JKR has already written the final chapter and she's stated that 'scar' is the final word.

Thanks, Louise, for the "scar" bit. . .I'm going to go a-hunting.

You all have given some very compelling arguements to ponder over.

This just came to my mind, however, when Harry asked Dumbledore if Voldemort can feel when his horcruxes are destroyed, DD gave the assumption that Voldemort is probably at this point too in human to feel when pieces of his soul is destroyed. Evidence would be in the form of the diary and Voldemort's fury with Lucius upon learning that the diary had been destroyed. I often wondered if this was infact true. Did Voldemort know all along? If not, then wouldn't Voldemort have an idea of some sort that Harry contained a portion of his soul, and if so, why would he be so eager to destroy him? I just thought I'd rasie that question...

Moving forward,
I have to agree with the fact that a horcrux imitates the person exactly. Harry, loaths Voldemort and thwarts him almost constantly. So if a horcrux imitates it's counterpart, then how is it possible for Harry to be one?

Perhaps some crystalized pineapple and several bottles of elf-made wine, along with some felix, and we can get all the details of horcruxes and the making of them from old Slughorn...

Hooray! I'm not alone. Thank goodness for Louise.

Now, I'm not going to get to everything that's currently being discussed because I'm sure I'll get buried under it all if I try and just create confusion, rather than actually clarifying anything, or making decent points. So I'm just going to address one or two things tonight and call it a day...

It's good to see that there are other people out there that believe that Harry is a horcrux. Here are some quick thoughts that I have on the subject.

Voldemort planned to kill Harry and use his death for a Horcrux. This means that he probably didn't use James or Lilly's death to create it. If Harry didn't die, then that only leaves Voldemort himself. I think that the AK bounce back death of Voldemort was what created the rip in his soul. I know that people will say that he didn't die, but I would argue that if your body is destroyed and your soul moves on, that you have died. This is a special situation. Because of the horcruxes, the soul was able to stop from going to wherever a soul like Voldemort's would go.

I think that this would explain the chain of events. Voldemort kills Lilly and James. He then has nobody stopping him from taking his time and preparing the horcrux spells. Even though Slughorn's explanation appears to say that the spell happens after the murder, it doesn't preclude it from happening before. Yes, you have to kill someone to rip the soul. Yes you can't catch the soul until after the murder, however, if the spell is used to create something to catch the soul with, it could be created before hand. I like all of the analogies, so I will give one that I used on the main thread. It's not quite as pleasant as the cakes and pies, but bear with me.

You have a rat trapped in your closet (or a piece of soul attached to your main soul) and you want to bring it to the rat zoo (a horcrux). In order to catch it, you first get a bag to catch it in (a spell which creates a vessel to catch the soul in) and then you open the closet to let it out (commit murder).

You wouldn't let the rat out of the closet and then go looking for something to catch it in. I think the spell creates a vessel to catch the soul in so that it can then be transfered to the object of your choice. Since Voldemort was dead, he couldn't control the final destination. He had sucessfully stopped the soul piece from escaping. If Harry became a horcrux by accident, there had to be something that Voldemort did to at least catch the soul. Otherwise, pieces of soul would be jumping into other people by accident all the time when a murder occurs. How the soul ended up in Harry is still a mystery to me. I think that it could be fate, as the prophecy had already predicted that Harry would be marked as Voldemort's equal.

The specific how and why Harry became a horcrux still need to be worked out. I believe it is true simply because of all the other clues that we have. (Nagini, scar connection)

Imprint Theory.........'Nuff said

JK

This is kind of short, but what if the catcher of the soul (for lack of a better word), is the body itself? So when a murder is performed, the soul still resides in the murderer but now its split...hey...what if it splits more than we think it does, like cells splitting. One murder splits it in two...then another would split those two in two so now you have four...Or it goes by what we believe in that the orginal soul is split every time, reducing the amout of soul in each "splitting".

Like...I dunno...*thinks of analogy*...you have a pizza, and you split it in half. You eat that half (place it in a Horcrux). You decide to eat half of that half (a fourth of the original amount) and...you get the picture...

As for remaining in the body, I can't think of an analogy at the moment

I know this is not a popular viewpoint on this, but I'd still like to say it, just to hear what you guys think. It's a completely different theory, so it might take some time to put down logically:

You are your soul. That's all that defines you, since Dumbledore has taught us that family, and therefore your genetical composition, doesn't make a difference. Your choices do, and they are directed by your soul.

Horcruxes touch the core of the connection between Power (in the form of magic, in this case) and morality. I mean, if we could really split our souls, would we do it? Would we give up our essential wholeness just for a chance to cheat Death? Could power corrupt as absolutely as that?

Ok, enough rhetorical questions. Yes, it could. If you can murder someone, you’re half-way there, already. Dumbledore says that killing rips the soul apart. So if you don't plan to make a horcrux, it happens anyway. But the soul isn't split literally - you don't have little pieces of soul residing in you suddenly. Your entire being just becomes less whole and pure.

So, in my opinion, a horcrux is an impure and unwholesome state that takes hold of something. It's not a certain amount of substance that can be divided between seven objects. The "tearing" of a horcrux isn't literally, but a metaphor to how you as a being become less whole, and therefore, less human.

This unwholesome state, once established, can then be passed on to other objects.

Harry can't be a horcrux, because horcruxes are unwholesome. They don't live in your toe or something, just as souls don't inhabit a particular part of your body. It's a state of being. So if Harry had such a state over him, he would never be able to love. A totally pure soul like his, cannot exist alongside an impure soul in the same person.

Nagini could be a horcrux for the simple fact that, as an evil creature with an already impure soul, Voldemort's unwholesome being could survive in her.

The pain Harry felt when the unwholesomeness of Voldemort posessed him, shows that it totally clashed with his whole being, so he couldn't be host to something as impure as a horcrux. Voldemort had posessed Quirrell, and even Ginny, who wasn't evil but who had poured her soul out to him, making her susceptible for it.

So for it to be impossible for LV to reside in Harry without pain, means that Harry's entire being has to be absolutely pure and whole , even more so than poor Ginny, who was just silly, not evil...

Harry's scar is, imo, just a remnant of the past, that to a certain extent explains who he is, i.e. the son of a woman who gave him her life.

As an afterthought... we don't know and can't explain exactly what souls are (see post... ). That's what's so frightening about horcruxes. Even in the wizarding world, it's not just a taboo subject, but it's so horrible that almost no-one knows about it. It can't then be that easy to accidentally pass a piece of your being onto someone, even when you vanish/evaporate etc. It's such complex magic, that Voldemort is the first wizard ever to try to make 7 horcruxes. I can't really see that happening.

Anyway, hope it made sense, seeing as it's based on all things abstract and metaphorical!

Capricorn,

I would argue that JKR has given the soul some physical properties. If you think about the dementors kiss, it is the act of removing the soul from the body. This means that a person physically possesses a soul and that soul can be removed. In the real world, there isn't a way for someone to see, touch, or remove a soul. A soul is purely based on faith. I believe that this lets us know that it is possible to physically alter the actual soul. It establishes that a soul is something real. I don't think it is physical in the sense that it is a body part like a brain or a heart. I simply think that it is physical enough that it actually exists and can be manipulated. Does that make sense?

Fair enough, Vulturemort. Like thoughts eh? Ok, if thoughts can be a magiphysical substance, I guess, for the purpose of a fantasy story - so can souls. They could even be a chemical balance, who knows. I would then revert to the theory of this being very complicated magic, so an accidental transfer is improbable. But it's an opinion, so I'll leave it at that.

The complicated nature of a horcrux is what makes me believe that Nagini is not one. Voldemort was suprised by the arrival of Frank Bryce. Would he be able to perform the spell quickly after the murder. We don't really know how the spell works so this is a difficult question to ask. However, if Nagini is not a horcrux, I feel that Harry must be one. It would explain why Dumbledore revealed that bit of information (that living things can be horcruxes)

In regard to Harry being a horcrux. If it happened the way I theorized earlier, the complicated portion of the magic was done before Voldemort died. The chance/accidental portion of the magic occured after his death.

I don't understand why this discussion is so dead. It seems to me that if Harry is a horcrux, it would change the way that we look at the story as a whole. People don't seem to give this much thought. I feel like people don't want it to be true because it would mean that Harry must die. Maybe it's just a stupid idea. Somebody must have an opinion on this. I had to leave the regular discussion because it is filled with first time posters saying the same thing over and over again. Every post in that discussion asks why Voldemort would try to kill Harry if he is a Horcrux. You can only answer that question so many times.

against


i don't think that harry's a horcrux, and i don't think he's even half horcrux, though i must agree with the "accidental" horcrux, why? let's think about two different ways to make a horchrux:

1: you first commit the murder, and then you say the spells to lock your soul inside an object. in this case vodemort couldn't make a horcrux with harry's murder, because he couldn't even commit the crime, he "died" before he could.

2: you first say the spells, prepare the object in which you'll keep your soul, and then, when you commit the murder, your ripped soul will instantly "run" to the object you chosed for that purpose. In this case, vodemort could have done a horcrux, but with his own murder (because he said the avada kedavra, but instead of harry he killed himself, and of course he didn't die because he already had horcruxes)

and why is this an accident? becasue voldemort intended to live to tell the tale and hide his horcrux! and he couldn't, he lost that horcrux, in case he made it. this give us another important information, what if harry returns to godric hollow's and finds this accidental horcrux? what if voldemort, knowing this, waits for harry in there?

these two cases doen't mention harry as a horcrux, i don't think he could be, if voldemort felt pain when he tried to possess harry, why doesn't that piece of soul feel pain inside harry?
and, we have the fact that dumbledore believes that voldemort failed in the attempt to make his last horcrux, and he made nagini a horcrux, after his return.

I don't think that possession is the same as a piece of soul inhabiting Harry. If the soul reacts to an evil act by tearing or scarring, wouldn't that make the soul naturally good? What I mean to say is that the soul doesn't really appreciate it when the body commits murder so it seems that it is not evil in itself. It is the evil mind of the person that damages the soul. However, a possession is all of the conscious evil of a person concentrated and inserted into another object. This would be very different from a horcrux. There is a connection that is caused, but it isn't Voldemort himself concentrated and inserted into Harry. That's just my belief, and it isn't based on much, but I think it is worth considering.

I also don't think that Dumbledore was correct in all of his guesses for the horcruxes. I would find it much more interesting if there was at least one suprise horcrux instead of Harry simply working his way through the list that Dumbledore gave him. I am willing to wager that JKR isn't going to give us all of the facts right away.

Just because a murder is committed, doesn't mean that the soul leaves the body for a host... In fact, we know that it doesn't. LV has murdered way more than 6 times. The book describes the forming of a horcrux to take place with the tearing of a soul... as in, the soul is maimed, mutilated, etc. What happens to the soul that is ripped? It stays in the body, ofcourse. LV is described as having a "mutilated form" because he has murdered so many (probably hundreds or even thousands) of times. He doesn't have a thousand horcruxes.

And, Peter Pettigrew killed a group of muggles and blamed it on Sirius . He doesn't have a horcrux, so what happened to his soul? Stayed in the body, ofcourse. If the soul tore and left the body everytime a murder was committed, all of the deatheaters would have horcruxes that they were unaware of.

I am referring to the theories about Harry being an "accidental horcrux". The theory is that the piece of soul that is torn from LV leaves him and just accidentally manifests itself in Harry because Harry is the closest object. But, how could it? LV would need to have performed a horcrux spell after the murder in order to create his horcrux. LV was near powerless, and only merely more than a ghost...

Now, let's go on to the more complicated version of this theory, and the more logical one at that. It has been said that the spell for the horcrux was performed ahead of time (which I doubt). Even if this were true, the theory of the soul going into the closest object would remain falty. The closest object to LV is his wand. Wouldn't the soul manifest itself in the wand, and not Harry?

But, like I said, the soul can't just tear and float around looking for an object. There would be pieces of soul everywhere, in all sorts of objects and people.

Does anyone else see how this is impractical?

I don't think Voldemort killed hundreds of people...I don't even think he killed twenty believe it or not. Here are some of the known deaths by Voldemort himself:

Frank Bryce
Dorcas Meadows
Grandma Riddle
Grandpa Riddle
Tom Riddle Sr.
James Potter
Lily Potter

Cedric, Bertha Jorkins, and Myrtle were either killed by someone using Voldemort's wand or were killed by the basilisk...Cedric and Bertha by Wormtail using Voldemort's wand. I think thats correct, feel free to correct me.

I also agree that one's soul piece does not become a Horcrux because it has to have some sort of other spell or whatever, at least thats what Slughorn said. However, the soul is still split within a person regardless if someone has an intention of making a Horcrux or not. Know what I mean?

I for one am still holding on to my theory about not a soul-piece within Harry, but Voldemort's imprint.

Wait, Barto, what is your theory on the imprint? I really want to hear this, because I have read a similar theory and I think that is what you are getting at...

And if it is what I think you are saying, I may be inclined to agree with you

Hey, you really want to hear it? The whole thing can be found here. Basically, instead of Harry having a piece of Voldemort's soul in him, he actually has his imprint. When Voldemort used the killing curse (also combining the Phantom Death Theory), he had marked Harry as his equal. If Voldemort was supposed to die, he was also supposed to have that choice to become a ghost or not. Because he didn't have this choice because he was still alive (though barely because of his Horcruxes) his imprint went to what he had just marked as his equal...Harry...even though all this may have happened in a split second. Thats just my take on it...

Although Harry being a Horcrux would also make sense...though its hard to rule out how the soul remained inside him this whole time if when Voldemort couldn't touch him until he was 14 (unless thats just the physical self touching him...but Qurrel got burned with him on his head). Also, I don't remember who, but they said that there could have been another killing curse which not only killed the person but took the killer's soul piece out to be placed in an object...which when he did this backfired on himself...just another thought I suppose.

It could be true, Chris, that Voldemort only commited those murders you mentioned - however, it still makes him a serial killer, so 7 murders, 20 murders or even 100 - he's still done some extensive damage to his soul...

I agree with LilyPotter here. I find it difficult to think of pieces as soul floating around, or even manifesting themselves in a person's foot or kidneys or whatever (Since it is argued that they do not posess completely, I assume they reside in only a part of the body). I get rather uncomfortable when horcruxes are talked about in such an off-hand way. Frankly, they scare me. Do we (as humans) know of anything more powerful and absolutely mysterious than a soul? I just can't think of horcruxes as floaty bits of mysterious substance that can accidentally get lost in the wrong body...



I have to disagree with you, vulturemort. There is a difference between a whole soul, and a ripped one, though I agree that a unscathed soul should be seen as essentially good. It feels as though we're forgetting how incredibly powerful a whole and pure soul is. I think Jo tried to make it clear that the power of a pure soul does not equate to the sum of its parts, but to something even more. That is where love and emotion lies - and Harry's chance of succeeding...

Silly example, but if someone's been part of a team, like a sports team or a school play or whatever, they'll understand what I'm trying to say.

So anyway, if a pure soul is good and wholesome, a split soul will very likely be the opposite. Because the act of ripping a soul into pieces is the most evil magic known to wizardkind, I find it dificult to believe that the product of it can still be essentially good, and it being neutral is even less likely, since such strong magic is bound to leave some kind of mark.

Therefore, a piece of Voldemort's soul that resides in Harry would be evil, so why does Harry not experience constant pain? If the pain of Voldemort posessing him was caused by the piece trying to escape, it means that Dumbledore's explanation is wrong, and it is a matter of opinion whether one believes that possible or not. I don't - not when it comes to complex magic involving love and souls. Dumbledore's the expert.

Also, in terms of setting up the whole idea that Harry has a pure soul and will defeat Voldemort because of it, it would greatly undermine the symbolism if Harry turned out to having hosted a part of Voldemort's soul with him all along. It could be technically possible, but I have to ask: why would Jo do this?

Love and purity of soul being the reason for Harry's chances of success is the heart of the story - why would a writer bring a technicality into play at such a crucial point? A technicality would disrupt the flow of the emotional story and theme.

The 'Harry is a horcrux' theory originated from wanting to explain the connection between Harry and Voldemort, right? I just think that that alone doesn't serve as an adequate basis for a sound theory, especially when the theory eventually needs complex magic gymnastics to make sense. I'm with Chris on this - I'd rather say it was an imprint.

I suppose it is possible that there is another killing curse out there somewhere (although, I personally don't believe it). However, we know (as we have been told throughout the series) that the curse used on Harry that night by LV was, in fact, the Avada Kedavra curse. Remember, he is "the only person to have ever survived [it]". Therefore, I believe that the spell to split the soul (using the AK curse to commit a murder) and the spell to actually create the horcrux, must be two separate spells.

You know, guys, everyone in here has some simply fantastic arguments for Harry both being and not being a horcrux... But I have come to the conclusion that those of us who believe Harry is a horcrux (Vulturemort ) and those of us who believe he isn't a horcrux (me ), simply will never be persuaded to believe otherwise. (atleast until book 7 comes out!)

I was just thinking about the splitting of the soul and had an idea. Perhaps the tearing of a soul purges the good bits of the soul away from the original piece. When the murder occurs, the good parts of the soul are expelled and slowly, only the most evil bits remain. It's a possibility which would allow for a piece of soul to reside in Harry even though Voldemort's evil self couldn't bear to touch him.

I still believe that even if the soul piece were evil, it would be possible to coexist with Harry's soul. It wouldn't necessarily taint Harry's pure soul and it wouldn't necessarily react in the same way that Quirrell's skin reacted or Voldemort's full possession did. We don't know for a fact that Voldemort couldn't stand being inside Harry. That is Dumbledore's opinion. I have considered that, at that point, Voldemort discovered that there was a piece of his soul in Harry and that is why he left in such a hurry. He had just become aware of the fact that his plans had to completely change and needed to think about it. He was challenging Dumbledore to kill Harry, then suddenly disappeared. Could it be that he realized that Harry must live for now?

Finally, the first thing that brought me to this theory was not an explanation of Harry's connection to Voldemort. It was the introduction that Nagini, a living being, was a possible horcrux. It has always seemed like it was a shaky guess on Dumbledore's part that could possibly be a clue to us that a living thing could be a horcrux. I really don't believe that JKR has given us the identities of all of the horcrux. There will be a suprise in my opinion. This made me think that Dumbledore's guess was a clue to the readers that Harry is a horcrux. That would allow her to later reveal it and we wouldn't say, "wait a minute how can a living thing be a horcrux". It's just a bit of intuition, but that is basically what all of our theories are at this point. The connection to Voldemort simply became reinforcement for the idea and the main topic of conversation in these threads.

I find it horrible how I've neglected this, my favorite debate thread, and so I'm going to make a valiant effort to get back into the thick of it, while also hopefully reviving the discussion a bit...

So, let's say I'm gonna bake a cake... Naw, just kidding. I loved those cake analogies, though... Hm, what I'm actually going to do is: I'm going to attempt to lay out my theory as to what happened, and I'll try to deal with what seem to me like the biggest factors in the argument as I go along, and then do my best to answer whatever other questions that arise afterward. Sound good? Okay...

Well, to make a long story short, I'm just going to start right from the point when Voldy tried to kill Harry. I think we've probably already hashed out pretty well that we don't know for sure the process of making a Horcrux, so we're pretty much into guesswork no matter how we want to slice it here, but most of us seem to agree that there's at least a strong implication that the equation comes out to be: Murder + Spell = Horcrux, with a decidedly less likely (and surprisingly wholly different) equation being: Spell + Murder = Horcrux... Boy, could I have made that less confusing? Yes, I probably could have. But I won't. For the purposes of this discussion and because it's the more widely agreed-upon equation, I'm going to go with Equation #1, and that is Murder + Spell = Horcrux.

If that's how things go down, though, then how do I explain Harry accidentally becoming a Horcrux? If the spell comes afterward, then there's no time for Voldy to say the spell before dying, thus, no Horcrux. Well, my original theory circumvented the need for the spell, but I no longer believe that theory to be very likely at all, so I'm not even going to try going down that road. Instead, I believe we come to a situation where we have to ask ourselves a question: When does the spell to create a Horcrux have to be used?

This is not an easy question to answer because we don't have positive verification either way, but I believe we can at least guesstimate about it. Some would say that the spell could be used any time after the murder to create the Horcrux. If this is true, then there would be no sense of urgency in creating the Horcrux right there and then, thus no reason for a Horcrux to have been accidentally made (unless, that is, Voldy just likes to get things done as efficiently as possible). But what if there is a sense of urgency? Why would there be a sense of urgency? To come up with possibilities for this element, we have to talk about the nature of the soul and soul-splitting...

What happens exactly when a person commits murder? All we really know for sure based on what Slughorn said is that murder (an Act of Evil) splits the soul, tears it, rips it apart. But what does that really mean? Does it mean that a whole little piece of the soul completely separates from the whole and floats around like a little fishy in the body? Maybe. Does that soul piece (or can it) reattach to the soul-whole in any way or after some amount of time? Maybe. Does it mean that the soul piece necessarily HAS TO be completely separate, or is it still attached to the soul-whole at least in part? Maybe. As you can see, we have a whole lot of maybes, and not really anything for sure. But let's take each possibility one by one and decide how each one might work...

Possibility #1: The soul-piece separates completely from the soul-whole. If this is the case, we have already determined that said soul-piece MUST remain in the body at this time, or else anybody who's ever commited a murder could possibly have an unidentified Horcrux lying around somewhere, and that just doesn't work. And what happens if that body is destroyed? Well, it's reasonable to assume that soul-piece, right along with soul-whole, would probably be compelled through the veil just as any soul that has been separated from the body is apt to do so long as it hasn't already been compelled elsewhere (such as in the case of a Dememtor's Kiss, or if it's being held on this plane of existence by an - or multiple - exisiting Horcruxes). Now, from there, there might be some case for the separated soul-piece potentially seeking refuge in Harry all by its own AFTER the body of Voldy had been destroyed, since it would be tethered to the mortal plane by the other Horcruxes, but not to the soul-whole. However, like I said, I find this possibility less likely, although easier, so I won't get too deep into that.

Another important question with this possibility is: Does the soul-piece remain unattached to the soul-whole, or can it be reattached to the whole in any way? The question is important because if reattachment is not possible, then there's no telling how many non-Horcruxified soul-pieces Voldy might have had in him at the time of his body's destruction, which could open a whole can of worms that I probably couldn't discuss if I tried. But more importantly, if it can reattach, then that ability would create a necessity for Voldy to transfer the soul-piece into a Horcrux as soon as possible. Maybe even immediately. There's also a theory (not mine, but a theory) that the soul-pieces are destroyed if not immediately transferred into a Horcrux, which would also create the necessity for immediate transference.

Possibility #2: Split. Torn. Ripped apart. These are all terms used to describe what happens to the soul when murder is commited. But do they positively convey that the soul-piece is completely separted from the soul-whole, or could they still be partially attached? Could they describe just enough ripping that they are, another piece, but still hanging on (perhaps by a thread), and that the Horcrux-spell itself is what rips that final thread and pulls the soul-piece into another object. I believe this could be the case. And that it could also necessitate the need for immediate soul-piece-encasing, if the split soul could potentially mend itself over time (at least to a degree).

All these theories show the possible need for immeidate transference of the soul-piece from body to Horcrux, not just soon after the murder, but even as the murder is taking place. If the spell for Horcrux-transference takes place simultaneously (or within the same breath, as it were) as the AK spell itself, then the transference process itself would already have been initiated by the time the AK backfired, and then what more could you want but a backfired killing spell to disrupt the intended flow of said-spell and send the soul-piece somewhere it wasn't even intended to go, such as into Harry.

Just some possiblities, and you can find them as far-fetched as you like, but remember: this particular post is about the mechanics of how it COULD work. There are plenty of other reasons on canon to further support the theory of why it may have worked that way. We've discussed some, and we could discuss more, but for the time-being, I'm on mechanics right now.

One other thing before I put an end to this admittedly long post... As has already been put forward, the question is out there as to how a piece of Voldy's soul could possibly exist in Harry. A piece of Voldy's soul would be evil, and could not exist within Harry, just like a body-sharing Quirrel couldn't stand Harry's touch, or a mind-possessing Voldy couldn't stand to remain in Harry's mind... The problem with this is that all this assumes that a piece of Voldy's soul would in fact be evil. But would it? Let's think here for a second.

What tears the soul? An Act of Evil? Why should this tear the soul? Presuambly because the soul is not an evil thing. No soul is evil. Not even the withered, torn-up soul within Voldemort. The very reason his soul is so withered and torn-up is because he as a person is evil. But if his soul were also evil, then how would it be affected by his evil deeds? If anything, it would be empowered by his evil deeds. But it isn't. It's ripped to pieces, it's in shreds, it's left Voldy with hardly a scrap of humanity left in him. A piece of Voldy's soul, disconnected from him, could potentially live inside of Harry, maybe even influenced by his own good, pure soul. Pain could be caused when Voldy is close by or trying to influence or enter Harry through his mind because an indirect link would still exist, so physical or mental proximity would ignite the Voldy-connection made by the soul, thus creating conflicts between the nature of its one-time-master and its current-residence... Does that make sense?

Anyway, I think it's entirely possible and would even make a lot of sense as to how and why things work as they do for a piece of Voldy's soul to exist within Harry. I've run out of time to further discuss this matter now, though, which is probably a good thing since I've probably gone overboard on talking about it already. So that's my say for now. Hopefully, we'll see some new life in this thread...