Oh! Yes, I totally remember that. I live in Costa Rica, and my lack of presence on the Great Hall made me not comment on this matter, but I can't deny how deeply disturbing I found it.

It was in the media, it was being exposed, and some people who still believe that animals have souls made a public statement asking for that person to be be sent to jail for bad treatment of animals.

There is no PETA in Costa Rica, but there is an association that works in very similar ways to it: The National Animal Protection Society (ANPA in Spanish) that made a whole motion to avoid this exhibition. Since it was considered "Art" and we live by the free speech statement, they couldn't help and make it stop, but I must say that I am embarrassed by the fact that this person is going to represent my otherwise peaceful country in such a way. He lets our name down, and yes, I believe it becomes un-peaceful when animals are being tortured like that.

This was a disgusting display, and I can think of many ways this person should meet his end, but the fairest of them all is the one you said Alkisti:

I am simply disgusted by his act.

When I heard about that, I was sickened. I think it is positively despicable. Nowadays anything counts as art. Splash a bit of paint and rearrange some garbage and hey presto - art. But this well and truly crosses a line. This is not art, it is cruelty. Imagine the outrage if someone locked a child in a room and left it to starve to death. Go ahead, paint a picture of a starving dog if that's where your imagination takes you, but this is just barbaric. Just simply torture.

I really wonder what is considered art nowadays and who is responsible of deciding what to name art and what not. Whoever these people are, they have no heart, no ethics, no values.

I was so disgusted when I saw the pictures, and I felt like crying for the poor dog. It may not speak the way we do, but it feels and understands like we do. Noone has the right to take away the life of something else. (I guess there are exceptions when it comes to preservation) This guy should be ashamed of himself.

I wonder how the state of Costa Rica ever let something like that happen, how they let this guy represent the area at an art exhibition by doing something so horrible, when hundreds of people from all over the world react against that. Everyone who supports this tactic should be ashamed of themselves. No exceptions in the rule. Nothing.

I read the first page and the last page of this thread, so if I repeat something, I apologize. What I have to say piggybacks on what alkisti posted:

This "art" is despicable and heartbreaking. Yes, animals do have emotions and feelings. My dog gets so depressed when we leave on a trip that she won't eat until we get back, or if it's a longer trip (a week) she'll eat minimally. This is whether someone stays at our house and pet-sits or if we take her to the PetsHotel!

What I am referring to as the "piggybacking" thing is a news segment I saw about animal rights in China. I hate to tell some of you this, but you may be wearing dog and/or cat fur on your fake fur clothing items. If the percentage of fur on a garment is less than ??% ( I can't remember what the minimum percentage is) then you don't have to list the fur as part of the garment, meaning the consumer assumes there is none. Anyway, they kill feral dogs and cats for their fur to put on these clothing items and the way these animals are killed is disturbing. All the cats or dogs are in one pen and they are taken one by one to be killed, but killed in front of the others. The rest of the animals realize what is happening and they cower together in a corner mewing or whining and trying to keep from being picked next. I thought I would be sick watching this. I try quite hard not to purchase clothing items with "fake" fur.

As far as things passing for art, Lauren0891 hit on another topic, which maybe should be opened in another thread:

An art major at Yale (I think it was Yale) for her senior thesis "claims" to have impregnated herself and then caused herself to miscarry (by taking herbal supplements and teas) and then used the miscarried "stuff" to create an art piece. I'm saying she "claims" this because some of her professors have stated she said she didn't really use fluids from a miscarriage, but she is also saying she never said this and she did, in fact, use these fluids. At any rate, it's disgusting

Getting back on topic... I agree that PETA (and other extremist groups) tend to off-put people from their cause by alienating people that may otherwise by sympathetic to their cause by their extreme stunts. If these groups would/could show picture/video proof of injustice being done to animals, more people would step up. In the early 1990s I was sent an article, with pictures, of animal testing at Gillette. It was gross, and I stopped using their products... which are more than you'd think. They do (or at least did) have a lot of office products, so as office manager for a travel company I made sure we did not order any products that Gillette produced (Bic pens, Wite-Out, etc). I'm sure our small company NOT purchasing from them did nothing to their bottom line, but at least I felt better about it

I also refuse to eat veal for the main reason of the calves not being allowed to move much. When I lived in Germany I constantly had to look at the menu to see if any of the Wienerschnitzel (my favorite) or any other dish was "vom schwein" (from pig) or "vom kalb" (from veal).

I find it hard to be a vegetarian since I've eaten meat my whole life, but we're more conscious of what we eat now. We make sure it's organic, or at least free from added hormones. You just need to be aware of what you put in your body. I've heard a theory from some moms at school (one a nurse) that the added hormones in the milk and meat are causing many girls to go into puberty early. There are several girls in the 4th grade who have already started their periods, and these girls are only 9 or 10. As soon as I heard that I switched to organic. I have 2 boys, but still wanted to be safe.

Speaking of my 2 boys... they are up way past their bedtime, so I'd better close.
Kathleen

Once again, I feel the need to step in and not only give away some thoughts, but clear up some misunderstandings. This in no way implies that I favor Habacuc Vargas's behavior, because I despise what he did to the poor dog, and I am not trying to defend the government of my country because, again, I believe they didn't do the right thing. I did a little bit of research on the matter, and I'd like to share my findings with you all.

The art exhibit "Eres lo que lees" ("You are what you read") took place in Nicaragua last year. That is where the so called artist left this poor dog to die out of starvation.

The "reasons" behind this art exhibit are several (the artist has stated different throughout time), but I could only come up with two: at first this guy claimed that it was to show the lack of government support in his country (which as I understand, sadly is Costa Rica) for animal rights and their well being. Then, interestingly enough, the dog's name was "Natividad" (Spanish for "Birth Scene", in the religious meaning).

The thing about the dog's name comes from far. A few years ago, a Nicaraguan thief named "Natividad" was killed in Costa Rica by a couple of Rotweiller watch dogs. He trespassed, for the third time, into a car lot to steal, and after his second attempt, the owner of the property got the dogs and put a huge sign on the front that said, "Beware of the dogs". He didn't care, he entered and was attacked. He was a known thief in the neighborhood, but the whole thing went into trial, because when the man was being attacked, he screamed and woke up the neighbors. (This was around midnight.) They called the police, and the police couldn't do anything because the event was happening on private property, so the firemen came and separated the dogs from the victim. It was a big controversy in between both countries because the man was also on an illegal status. Some said that the authorities didn't do anything to stop the animals from killing the man, but he knew what he was getting himself into (he lived nearby too) and he was trespassing.

So, back on topic, the other "reason" for the awful display, was to bring some attention back to the burglar named Natividad's incident.

Either way, I cannot justify his doings. I believe there is no excuse for putting up such a show. The ANPA (National Animal Protection Association from Costa Rica) ran a motion to ban any similar exhibit in our country. Honestly, I don't know if it went through or not. I do remember the protest movement they made, with banners, blocking of the streets near the Congress building and the media coverage. Then another issues caught everyone's attention and people moved on.

I don't know how he was chosen to represent the country for an Arts Festival, and I don't know who were the people behind the vote. I can only reiterate that I am disgusted by this whole issue, and that the people from ANPA and the other Animal Rights supporters hate this whole idea.

Again, I don't understand what was going through the minds of the people who nominated him for this, of through the mind of the people from my country's Congress for allowing such dishonor.

I am ashamed and embarrassed that such a person could be thought of as a representation of the Art here. Animals, for God's sake, are living creatures! They have feelings, they suffer, they care, they are company, and they love! I have a pet cat, and I love her, I play with her, and I consider her a member of my family.

I know some artists from my country would have been more that happy to display the national talent without risking a life. There was no need for such a display, and I hate the spot where this sorry excuse for a human being who calls himself an artist and the awful people who allowed it to happen have placed my country.

I want to comment a little bit on Kathleen's post. I was sent a few days a go a video taken by PETA on 2005 in China. I believe this video demonstrated exactly what you're talking about. There were big vans with cats and dogs packed in cages, that drove into a huge factory-like place. They threw the animals there and later they took them, killed them God knows how, and they hang them from the ceiling, in order to remove their fur. Later, they sold these furs at local markets. I'm guessing that's how they make "fake" fur.

PETA and other organizations are being extreme sometimes. We need such foundations to make sure that animals are being protected, but there has to be a limit in their actions.

I was reading yesterday a book for my university about research and there was a part in it dedicated in scientists' ethics when animals are being used in laboratories. I have to admit that there is a very strict code about animals in order to avoid their being mistreated for experimental reasons. The question however, is whether these rules are being imposed.


Now, coming to Kaitlyn's post, I had read myself these explanations given by the "artist". However, I can not believe them. He had also stated that he chose the dog because it was stray and sick and it would die anyways. There are other ways of raising awareness on public issues. "Recycling" violence is not one of them.

I have been reading through the latest posts here. The bit about the "artist" that is positively the most disgusting thing I have ever heard of! Animals are not treated as fairly as they should be. People use animals for their own pleasure and when ever the animal serves no othe purpose, the animal is simply left to fend for themselves. I have two cats and a dog. I would absolutely throw myself in front of a moving train first before I would allow them to starve to death or be kept outside in a pen. Animals are like children, they need love, care and food to thrive. If you leave a dog couped up in a cage out in the front yard and just go out there to fill up the food and water bowls and don't interact with the dog at all, it's like doing the same to an infant or a child. Without love and nourishment the dog will develop depression, attachment issues, and with this much neglect, these factors all take the toll on the brain.

This brings me to a story I read in one of my psychology books, it is called "The Boy Who Was Raised as a Dog". This story involves the story of a 6 year old boy whom for the first 5 years of his life was raised in a cage alongside dogs. I kid you not, and because of this the child suffered from brain damage, slow motor skills, low speech skills and severe attachment issues, he was raised by dogs so therefore he thought of himself as one..

But back to the subject at hand, with enough neglect and abuse bestowed upon an animal the more detachment disorders the animal will suffer from. A dog that is beaten will either one, cower at the site of its abuser or two it will turn on people and show aggressive tendencies. This happens because of the imprinting that is put into the dogs head from the time the abuse begins and also depending on the severity of abuse.

Where I live at there have been many cases of reported animal abuse, and the offender usually always gets a "slap on the wrist", now if this were children we were dealing with the offender would be in prison.

Should the same laws not apply to our furry friends that applies to our children? I really think the legislators need to redo the laws dealing with animal abuse and cruelty and make it a punishable offense just like any other.

Marcey

I have never posted in here before. I am not much of an animal person and while I feel sickened when I see an animal cruelty story on the news, that is about as much thought as I give the whole subject. I don't even like dogs or have any pets.

I wanted to bring up a subject that has been very popular here in Kentucky especially since the Kentucky Derby. Horse racing. This ARTICLE describes the May 3rd event in which the runner up Eight Bells, was euthanized immediately after the race because she had broken both front ankles. There have been numerous articles and blame placing since this tragedy occured. I was just wondering what the Duellers thought about this.

As far as I am concerned, horses are always euthanized when they get seriously hurt. I don't know why they're doing this, but it's common around the world. However, it makes me really sad to see that such pretty animals have to die without choice.

This seems cruel but I'm sure the horse's owner would rather have this fixed than kill his horse, which means that there was really no other choice. What bothers me in this case is how people use animals to make money, This seems harsh. Not only about horses, which are treated sort of well, but also about other animals such as dogs. I watched "Amores Perros" the other day, where a guy owns a dog and he makes him fight with other dogs. The one to survive is the winner. They actually had dogs kill each other, not only fight, which is cruel! This is a real fact and it happens with other animals as well, such as roosters, in Mexico and other countries. I don't know how they allow this and why organizations don't react against this terrible act.

The real problem with this story is not that the horse was put down. It's that they're racing the horses so young. Horses don't fully mature until after they're two years old, so Eight Belles and other horses that race so young are more likely to have accidents like this.

I hope two things come of this. They take the whips (which are probably mostly ineffective anyways) out of the Jockeys' hands and they make a rule which prevents horses under two years old from racing.

First I'd like to comment on the artist...I'm sorry but I almost hurled when I saw those photos and read about it! I'd like to see the artist staved to death and killed. How is that art by the way???

As far as Eight Bells goes...I saw the replays of it on the news and it broke my heart. My favorite animal is a horse. Most race horses that are euthanized...are killed because it's a waste to fix what ever is broken because more then likely they will never race again. The owner, trainer, and vet see no reason to pay for such surgery if the horse can't race and make money. I find that appalling! Eight Bells had two broken ankles..right? Well I'm not a vet but it sounds to me that surgery may have helped. So she wouldn't be racing anymore...who cares! She might have been able to graze in the greenest field she had ever seen..for the rest of her life!

My husband loves to call me an animal activist. And to a certain point..I think he is right. Let's see....we have 2 dogs an Italian greyhound..and a Pitt Bull. The Pitt I found on the side of the road..looked like she was in a dog fight. I couldn't just take her to the pound. So I brought her home fixed her up..fed her, bathed her. And now she is just an awesome dog. She lives happily on her pillow bed, relaxing, playing and eating when ever she feels like it. We also have 5 cats...And we took in a mom and her kittens (They were trapped under our home). The mom cat and one kitten is know living with my mother in law and the other 4 kittens are still with me. So I guess that makes 9 cats. Oh and 4 fish...

I can't stand seeing stray animals, abused and starving on the streets. I don't like seeing a dead animal on the side of the road because their owner is irresponsible and just tossed them out like trash! I have so many pets because at least I know that with me..they will have a good life...they will have love, food, shelter (They are ALL indoors by the way). They are always clean. And more importantly safe.

I told my Husband that when we build the house we will live in forever, and raise our kids (None yet) That I want a lot of acres...for all the horses, dogs, cats, roosters...and any other unwanted animal can live and be safe! I know that's wishing for a lot..but who knows!

I found this article about a contest on the ugliest dog. We have heard of many animal contests but this is one of the most harsh and appalling. The price was the title for the dogs and 500$ for the owners. The dog which won this year is a poor three-legged, one-eyed, with cancer dog. This is what annoys me the most. The little dog is suffering and his owner takes him to a contest? And now, she's going to appear on a tv-show as if it was such an achievement.

What do you think?

I think it's sad. And I wouldn't have invited you on my tv show...that's not an accomplishment. The dog (in my opinion) should be at home. If it's that sick..a contest is no place for it. And I honestly don't think any animal is ugly!

I find it sad as well, and I think it is kind of...pathetic to use your sick dog to win a contest. And I really can't understand why this woman deserves to be in a television show. Instead of criticizing this purposeless contest, journalists appraise it. I don't think they would do so if there was a contest on the ugliest baby or something like that. It is insensitive treating animals this way. If I had a pet, and even if it was "ugly", I would never take it to a contest. I would never take it to any kind of contest actually. I don't think it is fun.

This is very upsetting. I mean, if I had an ugly pet I would enter it into the contest but I definitely would not use my dying dog to win money. We just adopted a Lemon Beagle that had been hit by a car. The farmer that owned the dog was going to put him down but he was saved by someone from the vets office. Kala (sunny in Hawaiian) had to have pins put into his right hind leg and part of his hip socket removed. He is a wonderful dog, very affectionate with the kids. We would still have gotten him if they would have had to remove the leg. I can't stand people that manipulate animals. To win money or put the animal through such agonizing stress is just inhumane.

I have a question for the DUeling Club concerning Animal Rights, since this thread hasn't been used in a while.

What is your opinion on using animals to test human products (hair and makeup, etc.)?


Personally, I disagree wholeheartidly. I am one of those, speak up for those who can't speak for themselves guys. And I really think this is cruelty at it's finest. I've read about tests that burn the skin of sniamsl and make their hari fall out during the first generation of products. How can we do that to animals for a product, us humans are using? I think that if we want a product made, we need to test it ourselves and not allow a different species to pay the price for our need of luxury.

I think it is cruel, very cruel when it comes to cosmetics. I see the necessity of testing drugs on animals, drugs that can save millions of lives, but when it comes to cosmetics...it is unacceptable. I use cosmetics most of the times but I try buying those which weren't tested on animals. It is so vain making these poor animals go under these tests simply to make us look better.

Actually, there is a whole code of ethics when it comes to experiments on animals. I will try to find a link. It was very interesting (it'd probably make PETA a little bit happier) but I'm not sure how many of these rules scientists actually follow.

I found an article about rodeo and acts against it. Here it is.
What do you think about this? Shouldn't we stop using animals as a means of personal entertainment?

Oh yeah, I totally agree with you that animal cruelty for personal entertainment is terrible. I did it cruel, disgusting and straight up wrong.

Take bullriding and bull fighting, bull fighting especially. Did you know that the matador stabs the bull with short spears multiple times in the upper back, each time leaving the spearnin the animal. They do it to decorate the bull with the colorful spears and the blood "glistening" on it's back. Finally, after the bull has experiences enough pain, humiliation and fear...the matador kills the bull with a sword stabbed into the spine. What kind of sport is that? It's despicable and down right cruel.

And what about horse races? Horses alive to race, breed new racing horses then die. Thank god they're thinking about getting rid of the whips. Cantou imagine how scared those animals met be of the whip?

The human race (not everybody) is a very cruel species. How much pain an fear must we draw out of our inferiors before we realize what we're doing? We have a control problem. We want to feel superior by treating those who cannot speak like dirt. We grab a bunch of animals and we humiliate, hurt and kill them. We laugh and point and call it good fun...

That is how we get entertainment these days. It is horrible and in all honesty...one of the worst aspects of the human race.




Wow, rereading this, I got a little upset thinking about bull fighting, haha.

~Nick~
HJP

What is your opinion on using animals to test human products (hair and makeup, etc.)?

I totally agree with both of you on the cosmetics issue and using animals for our own entertainment. It makes me sick. But sadly...a lot of people feel this way, but; nobody does anything about it. Where do you even start? I have no idea. Humans are the cruelest species...you're absolutely right about that!

Where do you start? I don't know...

There are probably many things that can be done, but I would suspect that protests will be involved. I guess that the best way would be to join one of the existing organizations and then help them out in any way you can. Then hopefully, the leaders of those organizations will meet with governors and other governmental figures to try and save the animals!

I've been thinking of a few to join for a long time now. And with my love for animals I probably will. But honestly...if nothing yet has happened to make people stop treating animals like Guinea pigs and attractions...I'm afraid nothing will.

I'm against animals as entertainment. Even though the keepers of the animals say the animals have a good life, I don't trust them. They may be right, but can a life in a small tank be better than life at the ocean. I'm talking about dolphins now as only a week ago I was in an amusement park where there were dolphin shows. My aunt asked me if I wanted to come, but I refused. Even though she said that the dolphins had a good life, I didn't want to. Because, well, it may not be so bad here, but after having watched way too many commercials for WSPA, I even find large tanks with lots of water in not good enough, because it's only the beginning! Other places in the word dogs are kept in small cages in which they can barely turn around. It's one long chain and it's disgusting. It's a principle to me not to take part of such things.

I once saw a movie where clips from bull fighting was used. To be honest, it made me sick. I couldn't even stand looking at it. One time the bull were running around with the spear in it's bag, and you could see the blood running down. That's too much for me.

Okay, so now I have a question. I read an article at work today. I can't give it to you as it was in a Danish newspaper, but I can put you in the situation. A married couple have had a dog for many years and it's getting old (over 7, I think). They start with having the dog standing outside day and night for weeks without taking it for a walk or anything. One time they leave for a two-days long vacation, and the dog just stands outside those two days. As I know, a dog needs food everyday like most normal animals. So, this continues through two years before anyone does something about it. I'm not really sure who helped the dog, but it was put to sleep just yesterday even though a lot of neighbours had offered to take care of it. When I read this, I wasn't really sure of my thoughts, I still not am. Because every animal has a right to live, but not if it's a painful life.

So my question is: Should a tortured animal be put to sleep or should someone try to make it's life worth living again? When have they been tortured enough for one life?

Should a tortured animal be put to sleep or should someone try to make it's life worth living again? When have they been tortured enough for one life?

Well, I'd say that if an animal can be rehabilitated and shows no sign of aggression, then it should absolutely be given a second chance at life...and a good home. Do whatever it takes to make sure these animals can be put in better homes is what I say! However; there are some that are just so mean and just plain angry because of what has been done to them that they need to be put to sleep. Which I think is putting the animal out of it's misery. Who wants to go through life mad and scared at everything? Not me!

They have been tortured enough for one life time when the animal can't be rehabilitated. They have gone so far back to their animal instincts that they are no longer domesticated.

Should a tortured animal be put to sleep or should someone try to make it's life worth living again? When have they been tortured enough for one life?


Hermione17, I'm seeing you everywhere...good to see you

And once again, I agree with you. If the animal has the ability to recover and live a normal, good life then let the poor thing. However, if the damage is beyond repair, then unfortunately, the animal should be put to sleep...for it's own good, to stop the suffering.

I actually live right down the road from an animal shelter, where I volunteer, and we see animals coming in all the time that have been abused. Sometimes we can save them, sometimes we have to put them to sleep. When have they been tortured enough? That's hard to say...I guess the only answer I could give would be N/A. I think that they only way one can determine the future of an abused animal is by the present condition of said animal, even if their past is horrible.

-Nick
HJP

LOL I am everywhere..It's good to see you too Harry James Potter.

I've thought of volunteering at the animal shelter...but I don't think I could handle watching animals being put to sleep. I know it's in the interest of the animal...but I don't think I could handle that. I'm the type of person that does anything to save an animal. When I see semi's hauling chickens or pigs...I instantly start whaling. I feel like I should high-jack the truck and save them LOL. Everyone thinks I should be a vet...because of my love for animals and I always say the same thing..." sure thing, I'll just tell my patients that your animal needs to be put down ,BUT; you're going to have to see Doctor so-in-so, because that's NOT in my job description." LOL I don't think that would work...Kudos to you though for being strong enough to work in a shelter. As far as being a member of an organization..I was thinking of WWF. World Wildlife Foundation. I also thought of PETA...but they might be a little extreme for me. I've heard some crazy things about PETA.

There is a main idea when it comes to this topic: an animal should be put to sleep if living is a torture it can't handle, no matter the care provided by its owner(s). This means that if an animal is severely ill and it can't handle the pain it goes through, despite medication and other treatments, the best thing to do is euthanize it. I know it is hard for the owner, but it is the best for the poor animal.

I remember reading that animals that participate in experiments should only be euthanized in the case mentioned above. The book also said that animals taken from the wild should be put back only if scientists are sure that they won't face problems adjusting to it.

However, people tend to do things their own way. If I had an animal with a severe health problem, I might put it to sleep, though I know it'd be very hard. If I loved it though, I'd knew that this would be the best solution.

Now, if I could no longer take care of my pet, I would find a nice home for it, and not let it die alone, like these people tried to do. For goodness's sakes!

So I don't know how many of you knew about the (now closed) show in Las Vegas called Siegfried and Roy. Those were the names of two German men who used to have a show in Las Vegas where they would perform stunts with tigers, and I mean big, adult tigers. There is a quick video (sorry about the music) here about Siegfried and Roy. It shows some of their stage acts with the tigers. Then, about 3 or so years ago, Roy was attacked by one of the tigers and almost killed. Needless to say, the show has been discontinued. Although there have been many calling for the tigers destruction, the tiger was kept alive, thank god.

What does the Dueling Club think about this show in general? Do you agree with the morals behind turning a wild tiger into a circus animal?


How do yo feel about people calling for the tiger to be killed? Was it a good decision to let it live (which I think it was)?


Finally, I don't know how many people have heard about this. But there are these two guys who found a malnourished lion cub and took it in. They feed it, played with it, and lived with it as it grew up. Eventually the lion got too big to live in their flat so they reintroduced the animal to Africa, successfully. A year later, the lion was the alpha male in a pride and was told to be completely wild and would not remember them. However, the two guys wanted to see the lion (named Christian), so they went to the wild to find it. I'll let you read the article and see the video for yourself to see what happens. Let me know what you guys think. The link to the video is here.


Happy Posting


-Nick
HJP

Exactly my thoughts. When it's to suffer more than necessary, just end it. It's the most humane treatment.


That's pretty much everything I'm against. Animals should live in the free, not in a circus. It's not a n optimal life and they shold have been set free. Or better. The shows should never have started. And, well, no. Of course the tiger shoulden't have been killed! When playing with fire you get burned, obviously Roy did, and (sorry if sounding mean) he deserved it. And there was more than just one tiger. I think being so many tigers has to give some problems. It's like having a lot of male cats; they can get along, but not for always. Animals shouldn't be in anything like this, and if people wants to make shows, do it with someone who can say no, a human!


Oh my god. I'm nearly crying, no wait, I am crying (I'm very emotional when it comes to things like that). That's just so sweet! It's good that the lion could be set free successfully and still remember them. Beautifully! It just shows that animals are more clever than some give them credit for.
Though it's still surprising me that you can supress the nature of a lion and not having it turning wild as it sometimes happed, and then set it fee and it's doing brilliantly becoming alpha in a pride. It's unique I think!

OMG!! I'm in tears! That was so sweet...okay..I need a tissue! What a great success story! I'm so tired of hearing how animals are treated like garbage and this story really gives me hope. Thanks Nick for putting that on here so we can all enjoy that. I'm still in tears!!

Okay about the circus ...personally I don't like circuses..mainly because I hate clowns..they scare me But why put an animal through tough training and then expect them to behave like a human. These animals live in cages and stuff. They don't run free when they are done performing. And I like how happy-potter put it. If you play with fire, you're going to get burned. It's Roy's fault for being attacked and I'm glad they didn't kill the tiger. Animals have instincts and no amount of training is going to erase that.

To touch on a bit of what Alkisti said.

I actually thought I was going to have to do this yesterday. My cat (my baby) was really sick, took him to the vet, did every test imaginable and they don't know what caused him to have a fever. But other than a high fever he is perfectly healthy (Thank God). But I was trying to prepare myself for the worst...so that I could go ahead and put him down. But thankfully he's fine now with all his antibiotics he's taking.

This is slightly off-topic, but this video is said to have received millions of views from all around the world. Check it out.
It is crazy what animals do!

Since this is a discussion on animal rights, what do you think about having pets? Do you have one (or more) ? Should there be laws when pets are concerned? What are the precautions one should take? And how could we avoid having so many stray animals?

This topic has been renamed into "Everything Animals". The reason why is that we want to broaden this discussion. This being said, you are now free to discuss anything concerning animals, from having them as pets, to their rights, and everything in between.

A topic I want to bring up is being a vegetarian. I came across this video a few days ago. It is basically about the way animals are being treated from the moment they are born til the moment they reach our plates. Some of these are very cruel.

So, if you watched the video, do you think it could convince you not to eat animals and turn into a vegetarian diet?

As much as videos like this sadden and somewhat disgust me, I can't say that I would be totally turned off from eating meat. Now I do not eat steak at all, I can't stand it..I eat hamburger every once and awhile but I steer clear of steak..I eat pork and poultry and fish...It is cruel how our animlas are treated before they go off for slaughter..

Why can't it be done like it was in the pioneer days? The farmers back then at least had humane ways of putting their animals down before they made them into meals. My gramps used to raise, pigs and chickens back in the day. At least he had humane ways of putting his livestock down before cooking them.

It is very cruel how animals are treated in society as a whole, people act like animals are secondary nothings and should be discarded like garbage when they serve no purpose anymore. One commercial that breaks my heart is the one that has singer Sarah MacLachlan speaking for the ASPCA and she sings one of her songs and it shows pix of all of the animals that are hurt and or injured that the ASPCA rescues..It is so saddening. I love animals and I can't imagine hurting one in any way...

There needs to be stricter laws enfoeced for people found guilty of animal abuse or cruelty..They put people in prison for shoplifting and burglary why not for hurting innocent animals?

There is a reason why our system is called the "Criminal Justice System" and not the "Victims Justice System"....sighs

Time to dust off the cobwebs and try to revive this thread. We can open the discussion with a story Hilly brought to our attention about a mini horse that was also born a dwarf: here.

Personally, I think Koda is absolutely adorable! I'm so glad they decided to treat him instead of putting him down. What does everyone else think of this precious horse and the circumstances surrounding him?

OMG he's adorable! I'm glad that they decided to treat him, too. Just because he's different and has some health problems, doesn't mean they should put him down! Especially because he's such a resilient little horse--if he was very sickly and barely clinging on to life, I could understand wanting to put him down. But he's just like disabled, and he's clinging on to life just fine...so I'm glad they kept him alive.

Now, can I just say that he is SO adorable! I am so glad that they decided to help him instead of putting him down. It's nice to see people in this world working to help animals like Koda. I hope his dental surgery goes well

Normally I absolutely hate horses, but this one I just want to give a big hug and pet it It's fantastic that they decided to give it a chance, but if the health problems couldn't have been solved, it should have been put down before it suffered too much.

So how is the view of deformed animals in general? You know, those born with five legs or two heads. There's been a lot of them over time. Especially calfs, but that might just be because that's those I end up seeing on television and it's the same animal in different shows Anyways... Of course the extra legs aren't that bad, but what if it's something that is a disadvantage? What is morally right to do? Contraty to us, they can't speak for themselves.

Recently, a lady from my town was apprehended and is awaiting trial on 33 charges of animal neglect and cruelty.

Here's the article:

A Nebraska resident is headed to trial on 33 counts of animal cruelty.

During her arraignment this week, 51-year-old Cheryl Lillie pleaded not guilty to the charges, which were filed after her home was deemed uninhabitable in May.

Authorities say the house was unsanitary, filled with animals and infested with insects. Thirty-three cats, three ferrets, two dogs and several mice were removed from the house. Eleven of the animals had to be put down.

If convicted, Lillie faces up to a year in jail on each charge.

i personally am a great believer in animal rights; they can think, they have feelings; they also have pain and discomfort and need to be feed. nonetheless, they should be freed from abusive owners, and those said owners should be penalized for treating an animal so badly.

i agree with Hermione17 100%(:

I also agree, animals do have rights and feelings. I feel extremely strong about such things- I don't wear/use leather and I don't eat meat (I have to eat chicken because I get really pale and ill) but if I didn't get sick then I'd definitely be a vegetarian (I don't even eat jellies!)

I'd like to uhh discuss animal abuse, for a sec...
It really bothers me, seeing stupid people hurt them. They act like animals don't have feelings. Or perhaps they are aware of them, but they don't care because they're "weaker" than them. Any thoughts?

I hate hearing about people abusing animals. It just make me so angry and sad. Angry that people could be so cruel and heartless to hurt little animals that really have no way to protect themselves. And it makes me sad because I dont want to imagine a little animal being hurt. My mom told me about some lady who had a bunch of dogs and was abusing them and she got arrested for it, they had to put eight of the puppies down because they were that bad, it made me want to cry. I just wish that people would not be so cruel.


~Mia Malfoy~

Unfortunately, when I was a young girl I watched a video that was meant for viewers 18 & older, and it had terrible images of animals getting abused. I wish I had stopped watching it with my friend,but I just glued my eyes to the screen hoping that the ending would be "happy." I don't know what the heck I was thinking, expecting something likethat. But it scarred me for life...seriously, it did. Everytime I hear "Somewhere Over the Rainbow" I see those image, because that song played while the animals were getting...(well really disgusting things, that's all.)

I despise anyone who treats animals unfairly. My friend's little brother does not know how to handle a dog. He's so mean to it! It really bothers me...I feel like telling him to stop but my friend just says he always does it and its fine. Or the problem won't be fixed.

I feel very strongly that animal abuse is not only imorale it's also psychotic! Many killers have started out hurting animals and graduated from there. When I look at my own animals I can see the love in their eyes. I know they have feelings and they can understand things to a certain degree. I think animal abuse should carry the same punishment as assault and murder in cases where the animal dies.

Every living creature belongs to God. Who are we to take any life or mistreat those that can't fight for themselves! Sick people that hurt animals or disregard them are the reasons why I have so many pets in my home.

I see strays everyday that need help because their owners abandoned them or mistreated them and kicked them out. It really breaks my heart!

Dawn

It's terrible, isn't it? When I look into my cats' eyes, I always think "Wow, they're so lucky. They could be one of those cats with no love in their home." It's nice to know that I "saved" an animal. When I grow up, I'd love to have as many pets as I can possibly handle.

What sucks is that at shelters or pet stores, people always buy the "cute" ones, particularly the young ones or the ones that aren't a mutt or something. (cute species, too.) What happens to the "ugly" ones? It's really sad how we can be judgemental like that.

Most of my pets I've rescued off the streets. Even the animals in pet stores aren't completely taken care of. A lot of them go to a home with an underline illness. And the owner is responsible for paying the vet bill.

I bought a kitten from a pet store 6 years ago. I didn't intend to, but every time I passed the cage she cried and stuck her paw out of the cage at me. I picked her up and help her and she instantly fell asleep and started purring. I put her back in the cage and she started crying. That was it! I had to have her...she was breaking my heart. I got her home and the next day her face swelled up like a pumpkin and I rushed her to the vet. She had some sort of infection which went away after giving her antibiotics for over a week.

I have so many animal stories, it's unbelievable! No animal is safe unless they are in a loving home. I feel like Hermione! HAHA If I ever make a lot of money I've been thinking of starting a refuge for animals and of course donating a lot to WWF (World Wildlife Foundation) and the ASPCA. Animals are a weak spot for me and hold a special place in my heart.

Dawn

Oh I totally agree with you. I love the ASPCA! & I feel like Hermione, too! Crookshanks was purchased by someone loving, too. Heheh.

I'm a little worried about my cat...he's been throwing up for about 5 days in a row. I think there's something wrong with him. Anyone know about cats?

Well it could be a hair ball. I would call your vet and see what they say. It's hard to tell what is going with animals when they don't have any clear cut symptoms and throwing up could mean a number of things.

You can also try the internet. Go to google and type in Why is my cat throwing up? You might find some info relating to your particular kitty and his/her symptoms. I usually try that before calling the vet, unless it's really serious.

Dawn

JuicyWitch, my cats throw up or have hairballs all the time. (to my mother's displeasure). Because they have really long hair and they eat ALOT... mind you there might be something wrong with them... but they seem fine. Mm... Anyway I love animals, I don't know what I would do without my cats. I had one that passed away at about 10 months, because she had a heart condition or something. I struggle alot with animal cruelty, so much that I can't watch any movies with animals in it. Just an animal being sad, or a little hurt, it kills me. So, dog movies, naaawt fo me.

And it's so true, it's impossible to know what animals really want...

My parents are afraid there's something wrong with him. The last time he was really sick was because he had kidney stones. I don't think it's that serious like it was before, but this new food he's trying out makes me throw up a lot, and my mom's getting a little ticked off about it. But they think there's something wrong with him. D:
Thanks for the tips

I'm sorry your kitty is sick. If it looks like the same thing he had before then maybe you guys should take him to the vet. Cats don't usually throw up hair balls everyday. At least mine don't and I have one long hair kitty. He rarely throws up but when he does...I know something's up.
I hope your kitty will be okay. Don't you wish they could talk and tell us what's wrong. I sure do!

Dawn